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reg
Nov 1, 2006, 1:51 PM
Post #51 of 59
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don't know if it's been said but "when in doubt - back it up" - i always used a sling girthed through swami and leg loop cross over (rather then loop) - of late i use two slings - which extends the device up to about eye level and a prussic back up. some say overkill, time consuming, bla, bla, bla - but it's comfortable esp. with a pack and hell ...you can take a bite-0-ham sammich or smoke a camel while your commin down. 8^)
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csgambill
Nov 1, 2006, 2:10 PM
Post #52 of 59
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In reply to: In reply to: Why don't you just cut off the existing belay loop and tie a new loop with 1/2 inch tubular webbing. This way you can replace it when it gets worn and make it larger or smaller depending on your preferences. I believe* that belay loops (when new) are far stronger than tied 1/2 inch tubular. Therefore, such practice would be to replace a strong link with a weaker one. I'd think that to be generally ill advised. *Dangerous words - can someone help me out here with actual ratings?
Just for the record, I completely agree with you. In addition to being weaker you also run the risk of tying the loop improperly and having it come undone. So, this is not a practice I'd recommend to everyone. The belay loops on almost any harness are much tougher than a single piece of tubular webbing and will wear far better. Just give your harness a once over before you use it and remember climbing is inherently dangerous!
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watchme
Nov 1, 2006, 2:47 PM
Post #53 of 59
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I think everyone is missing the lesson to be learned from Todd Skinner's accident: retire old gear.
If he had broken an old sling or an old 'biner, we would be stressing over the kind of sling and biner that broke. In this case it was his belay loop which failed because it was too worn (the current hypothesis).
Gear is cheap. Just buy a new harness every few years, and store your harness properly.
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jimdavis
Nov 1, 2006, 8:19 PM
Post #54 of 59
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In reply to: don't know if it's been said but "when in dought - back it up" - i always used a sling girthed through swami and leg loop cross over (rather then loop) - of late i use two slings - which extends the device up to about eye level and a prussic back up. some say overkill, time consuming, bla, bla, bla - but it's comfortable esp. with a pack and hell ...you can take a bite-0-ham sammich or smoke a camel while your commin down. 8^)
And in doing so you take all the rise out of your harness! Even notice that increased tension on your lower back when you do that stuff? There's a reason they space out the leg loops from the waist belt.
Comfortable with a pack? In taking that rise out of your harness, your now more likely to flip over backwards...and your recommending this for use with a pack?
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reg
Nov 1, 2006, 8:34 PM
Post #55 of 59
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Registered: Nov 10, 2004
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In reply to: In reply to: don't know if it's been said but "when in dought - back it up" - i always used a sling girthed through swami and leg loop cross over (rather then loop) - of late i use two slings - which extends the device up to about eye level and a prussic back up. some say overkill, time consuming, bla, bla, bla - but it's comfortable esp. with a pack and hell ...you can take a bite-0-ham sammich or smoke a camel while your commin down. 8^) And in doing so you take all the rise out of your harness! Even notice that increased tension on your lower back when you do that stuff? There's a reason they space out the leg loops from the waist belt. Comfortable with a pack? In taking that rise out of your harness, your now more likely to flip over backwards...and your recommending this for use with a pack?
good point about the "rise"! i usually hang my pack (when it's full) on a 4'sling below me. can't say tension on the lower back is a problem but i'm gonna try the belay/rappel loop to compare just as soon as i ditch the Bod i'm using. thanks! maybe if this all works and i'm more comphy - i could add an IPA to the ride down!
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bri1682
Nov 1, 2006, 8:42 PM
Post #56 of 59
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Registered: Jun 16, 2006
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The stitching on my Petzl adjama's belay loop started fraying and coming undone after only a few weeks of use.
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madrock
Dec 20, 2006, 9:42 PM
Post #57 of 59
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Registered: Dec 11, 2002
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It has long been considered a badge of honor wearing your incredibly tatered harness while climbing in Yosemite. This might be a good time to reconsider that practice. Even the best climbers can make mistakes.
Joe
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ja1484
Dec 20, 2006, 10:51 PM
Post #58 of 59
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Registered: Aug 11, 2006
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In reply to: In reply to: Why don't you just cut off the existing belay loop and tie a new loop with 1/2 inch tubular webbing. This way you can replace it when it gets worn and make it larger or smaller depending on your preferences. I believe* that belay loops (when new) are far stronger than tied 1/2 inch tubular. Therefore, such practice would be to replace a strong link with a weaker one. I'd think that to be generally ill advised. *Dangerous words - can someone help me out here with actual ratings?
Believe me, they are. Knots lower strength of any given material. Sewing is always stronger. Also, belay loops are generally doubled 11/16ths webbing bartacked through a section of triple thickness. They have to pass 15kN to pass UIAA cert, and most of them are far burlier than that.
See here for more info:
http://www.bdel.com/...p_archive.php#102706
BD's historical average of belay loop testing is over 5000lb breaking strength. That means when they pull random harnesses off the line and snap the belay loops, of all the harnesses they've tested, the average breaking strength is over 2.5 tons of force.
Notice that the belay loop that was cut 90% of the way through was still good to 700lbs...well above bodyweight.
Suffice it to say, I am not worried about my belay loop, and I am not about to replace it with tied webbing.
(This post was edited by ja1484 on Dec 20, 2006, 10:54 PM)
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gunkiemike
Dec 20, 2006, 11:48 PM
Post #59 of 59
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Registered: Oct 1, 2002
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madrock wrote: It has long been considered a badge of honor wearing your incredibly tatered harness while climbing in Yosemite. This might be a good time to reconsider that practice. Even the best climbers can make mistakes. Joe
This is the first new insight I've seen in this sad episode, and it says a lot. Now, is anyone gutsy enough to step forward and corroborate this?
There was a time when it was the vogue here in the Gunks to see how little gear one could lead a difficult route with. I believe Lynn Hill talks about this misguided direction in her book (not 100% sure, haven't read it. Just going by something I think I heard her say) That'll get people killed too.
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