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j_ung
Feb 20, 2006, 8:40 PM
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Actually, I probably won't be one to review these. I just reviewed the Montrail Magnets and Wasabis and I'm going to stick with those for a while. The down side to reviewing shoes is that when you get a pair you really like, you often have to lay them aside for the next review. Woe is me. Anyway, I don't want to put too many shoes on any one person.
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james_climber
Feb 20, 2006, 8:44 PM
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I thought it was a mexican brand ,
I tried them once , it was an old model , confortables, and long life i still have them , but not very good for small edges
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tgreene
Feb 20, 2006, 9:16 PM
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In reply to: I thought it was a mexican brand , I tried them once , it was an old model , confortables, and long life i still have them , but not very good for small edges
With the older Icampa's and now my current Chameleon's, I can edge just as well from either the inside or outside edge of the toe box. You don't need chips or crystals to bite into either, as these shoes are smearing machines! :wink:
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mesaman
Feb 20, 2006, 9:33 PM
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:D :D :o
Let me tell you The Acopa B3s are by far the best climbing shoes I have ever worn. They totally transformed my climbing. The rubber is totally sticky and my footwork greatly improved while climing in the B3s. I was totally hurt when I got off a route and noticed I had a blow out on my right toe. Is there any address were I can send them back for a resole or replacement. I'm climbing in the Acopa Aztecs now, there also nice but really hard to compare with the wicked toe box of the B3s. I would like to get a pair of the sidewinders soon because I've seen the kick ass toebox they sport. NO other shoes compare to the presision toeing, edging and smearing of the Acopas. super phyced on the B3s
Nicko
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bachar
Feb 21, 2006, 12:53 AM
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chriss! I'm not really sure about Seattle - Marmot?? If not you can get 'em on the website. We'll work with you too - if they don't fit first try we'll pay shipping 'till it fits! cheers, jb
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bachar
Feb 21, 2006, 1:34 AM
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B3's Sidewinders! Wow you guys are going for the gold...I guess not much has been said about these as they are more appreciated by "advanced" climbers (whatever that means). The original idea for the Sidewinder was to mold the foot in a "climbing" position and make a shoe directly on that shape (or last). Most lasts (all, really) have a flat bottom (sole). The human foot does not. So, I thought I'd see if we (everybody) was getting it wrong all this time. Heck, maybe a climbing shoe shouldn't be flat after all? Maybe it would work better if it was actually shaped like a foot?
At first, I thought some of the same things some have already noted. "It doesn't lateral edge very well. You can only edge on the tip of your big toe...etc." BUT I also noticed someting else. Since it admittedly has a rather odd curvy edge, in order to use it I found myself looking for different types of footholds. Bumps, scoops, ribs, curved edges, pockets, etc. The amazing thing is that these kinds of footholds were all over the place and I HAD NEVER NOTICED THEM ! Even on climbs I had done dozens of times!
This shoe has completely revolutionized my footwork. Now it's my only shoe and I can't imagine going back to a flat soled shoe ever again. Don't get me wrong...we're all used to climbing in flat soled shoes and it takes a big effort to break this paradigm (it took me two years to adapt - of course I suck - others will find it easier).
And the B3 - it's basically a Sidewinder with a "straight" inside edge. The outside edge is still curved up (like a human foot in climbing position). I kept it that way so people could make the transition to a Sidewinder. Most people notice the B3's superb toe point but they also notice that they now use the outside of their foot more as well.
blah blah blah...Hope that helps some of you out there! sorry for blabbing! cheers, jb
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breaksnclimbs
Feb 21, 2006, 1:55 AM
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I have the green slippers w/ yellow velcrow.
I like 'em!!! My only regret is that I bought a half size too large :(
I didn't expect for them too stretch soo much. At first I really really liked
'em then they got too big on me!!! I just haven't been able to get another pair for a "fair " evaluation.
edit to add: Will tossing them in the washing machine totally screw 'em up?? Maybe I can shrink them back onto my feets :lol:
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tgreene
Feb 21, 2006, 2:09 AM
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If they are a dark greenish-grey with orange velcro, they would be Chameleon's...
What size did you get, and what do you need..? I have a 9.5, but could have really used a 10, but only because I have weird feet! :?
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holdplease2
Feb 21, 2006, 2:11 AM
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Mr. Bacher:
One thing you may note is that most of us climbers buy to our percieved potential, not our observed reality.
Ex: We try to redpoint our 5.6 projects on Mammut Revolutions thinking it might help.
Ex: We pay $4 extra for ultralite biners, when the weight of our rack has nothing to do with being out of breath and panting in a 5.7 handcrack.
Ex: Some of us buy XXL condoms when all they really represent is a health hazard.
When it comes to shoes?
I look forward to twirling my B3s around my finger at the gym. I may not be rad, but damn if I won't look it...right up until the point at which I start climbing.
:)
-Kate.
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tgreene
Feb 21, 2006, 2:17 AM
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^ :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
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4togo
Feb 21, 2006, 2:23 AM
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Wow, the Sidewinders look pretty wild. Add me to the list of bums looking for a free pair for the novelty of trying them out :P or are you ever going to do a demo in Alaska?
I climbed in a pair of Auroras for most of last year. I really liked the way they performed (in the summer I climb mostly vertical/slab and in the winter I'm a gym rat). Nice edging and excellent sensitivity, which was the whole reason I was in a velcro slipper in the first place. Also one of the best fits for my foot (wide forefoot, narrow heel, HIGH arches) that I've found. All in all a very good shoe that I would (and have) happily recommended.
My only two complaints -- or constructive criticism -- would be:
#1 the very top of my foot occasionally gets pinched in the split tongue/upper/velcro combination -- possibly due to my very high arches
#2 the toes blew out after only about three months of gym climbing. I don't climb anything exceptionally hard (lead 5.11, sometimes redpoint harder) and I'm sure my footwork isn't perfect, but my shoes usually last much longer -- from six months to a year, depending on frequency of use.
Thanks to Yosemite Bum's heroic resole efforts, the Auroras got a second lease on life and they and I had a summer of very enjoyable slab climbing -- they're very worn around the edges again but no blowouts :D
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breaksnclimbs
Feb 21, 2006, 2:26 AM
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In reply to: If they are a dark greenish-grey with orange velcro, they would be Chameleon's... What size did you get, and what do you need..? I have a 9.5, but could have really used a 10, but only because I have weird feet! :?
That be dems :D I remember the name now that you said it !!
I can't really remember what size but, I think I bought them in a 8.5(us)
And I'm pretty sure I'd do good in a 7.5-8 (I'd hafta try 'em)
Oh and Holdplease 2 that was awesome!!
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tgreene
Feb 21, 2006, 2:41 AM
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The one thing about Acopa that I've not seen w/ any other shoe company, is that they seem to have a cult-like following... Once you have climbed in them, you'll never want to wear anything else, because they fit that damn good! :oops:
When I described my foot as being weird, it's exactly like 4togo's, except I have collapsed arches which is why they fit like a well contoured glove.
It looks like I'll actually be trying out a pair of Sidewinders very soon! :wink:
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organic
Feb 21, 2006, 4:45 AM
Post #40 of 111
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I have never tried Acopas and don't know if I will. I have mostly climbed in 5.10 shoes with sportiva and boreal ocassions. The thing is finding a climbing shoe that you like and that fits is hard so when you do you want to stick with it. Unless I had a chance to try on some Acopas and test them out or get a pair for super cheap I don't think I would switch. I am kind of a shoe nazi though and it has taken me two pairs of Anasazi velcros to find my perfect fit. Ok so my point, what would make me want to buy them; if I saw them around on other people and touched them and/or saw them in action, that might help.
What makes Acopa better than 5.10 or any other company, why should I buy Acopa?
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sidepull
Feb 21, 2006, 6:22 AM
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In reply to: The one thing about Acopa that I've not seen w/ any other shoe company, is that they seem to have a cult-like following...
umm, you should really look at some of the evolv threads, there's almost as much slobbering.
oh, BTW, I wear B3's and XXL's.
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t-dog
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Feb 21, 2006, 6:24 AM
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In reply to: This shoe has completely revolutionized my footwork.
That right there pretty much sums up my experience with the Sidewinders as well.
They lasted me for about a year before the front of the big toe completely blew out on me, but in that year, did I love them!
I have to say though, that I pretty much climbed 95% of the time indoors with them, which probably accelerated the inevitable toe blow-out, as most holds stick out in a gym, as opposed to being recessed, as they are outside. The outside edging you have to get used to, as it has a clearly defined edge you can use, aside from that it doesn't work as well. But once you trust it, the rubber bites in nicely and holds you without too much effort/strain on the foot.
What I loved most about the shoe, is the control and freedom of movement it gives the big toe. The way you can move your toe to pull in and grab with your big toe only, not the entire foot, is mind-blowing! Not to mention the overall comfort level of wearing the shoe. I would put it on and not take them off for 4-5 hour sessions in the gym without much discomfort at all, and without losing any sensitivity or agressiveness in the shoe.
The wide fit was a god-send for me as well, as I had an extremely hard time finding an agressive shoe that was not brutally narrow or way too long. Not only are my feet narrow, but I have flat/no arches either, which accentuates the problem of the widening foot when I put pressure on it. The lacing system was nice in that it allowed support in the arch for said lack thereof, while allowing the toe box to remain voluminous, so that the knuckles of the curled toes didn't get crushed.
Did I mention that they didn't smell bad at all by the time I had thoroughly thrashed them too? If you've been near my climbing shoes, you know that's no small feat!
Now for the parts I wasn't too keen on...
The large heel cup seemed built more for comfort (of which it provided tons), than for hooking performance, which you would sort of expect from a shoe this radically designed in other respects. It held well overall, but the lack of tensioning in the heel-cup allowed it to slip around a little on some hard hooking situations. Maybe sizing a half-size down could have helped, but at what comfort cost?
The downturned nature of the toebox, and especially the big toe made it slightly more difficult to toe-hook and do bat-hangs. Toe scumming is not a problem as the shoe fits well and there is ample rubber on the fore-foot, but pure reverse-toe-curling movement was pretty limited. To be expected from such a down-turned shoe, but still something that would have been nice.
And the last thing that I don't like about them, is how hard it is trying to find a new pair of them!!! I'm having to use my RockSocks again, and it's sooo much harder to pull on jibs with my toes, ugghhh.......not to mention the funk!!!!
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tgreene
Feb 21, 2006, 2:12 PM
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In reply to: In reply to: The one thing about Acopa that I've not seen w/ any other shoe company, is that they seem to have a cult-like following... umm, you should really look at some of the evolv threads, there's almost as much slobbering. oh, BTW, I wear B3's and XXL's.
Acopa on the otherhand would be more like the mythically elusive Unicorn, because up until this point, they haven't bothered to focus on advertising. The focus has been on perfecting a revolutionary new design concept.
What I have seen several times in this thread already, is that people LOVE them, but have worn them out and don't know how to replace them. I was in the same boat back in 2003, and it took quite a long time for me to actually get in touch with Acopa. Between the time that I bought my Icampa's, and when I finally got in touch with the company, the company had been acquired by Bachar and his partners. I was ecstatic when I was told to send in my Icampa's and exchange them for the newer and better Chameleons. Since then, I've stayed in contact w/ Acopa, and have promoted their shoes in the midwest whenever possible.
Early last December I was testing a pair of shoes for a new startup company that's headquartered overseas. My partners and I were at Drapers Bluff in SoIll for the day, on some premium sandstone. For my final route of the day, I decided to jump on a really funky and slabby 10B mixed pro route. After a half dozen failed attempts to even get on the face to start, I was getting worn out and really pissed. I finally gave up and put my Chameleons on, then sent that bitch! In my report to the other company, I was very clear about what I felt their shoe was good for, and where it stopped performing.
I'm a mediochre climber at best, but the shoes have actually made a world of difference in forcing me to re-learn my footwork and edging techniques. It's amazing what you can actually stand on, when you have a shoe that is designed for minimalist situations. 8^)
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t-dog
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Feb 21, 2006, 2:29 PM
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In reply to: Aye, but Evolv ... plays up the whole Vegan/PITA thing...
Did you mean to say PETA?
Unless, like me, you consider most vegans to have serious denial issues :lol:
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tgreene
Feb 21, 2006, 2:31 PM
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Nice catch... PITA works on so many levels! :mrgreen:
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lou
Feb 21, 2006, 3:25 PM
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Have often wanted to check out the shoes....kind of a shot in the dark to order sight unseen.....any demos coming to the Phoenix area?? Really dont see anything in the stores around here....... lou
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tgreene
Feb 21, 2006, 4:45 PM
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They are sized so that you generally want to order them in the same size as a street shoe. I actually am planning to try the new ones a 1/2 size larger, because of all of the breaks in feet over the years.
The top of toe box also has the ability to stretch a little in width, unlike most other shoes.
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j_ung
Feb 21, 2006, 4:51 PM
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Still tough to buy site unseen, even with that info. Sizing climbing shoes correctly is such a precise science.
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holdplease2
Feb 21, 2006, 4:57 PM
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Re: Evolv: another thing that may be bringing them some loyalty is giving so much away.
I only have ONE female partner that doesn't have a FREE pair of evolvs. And none of them lead harder than 5.10 trad except maybe 1. A few have more than one free pair!
How do you get a free pair of Acopas? You follow Michael Reardon for a day of soloing and you get free shoes. For a lifetime. (According to a thread on ST) Which could be rather short, actually. ;)
And Tgreene, I think its quite good that you say upfront that you are affiliated with Acopa.
-Kate.
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tgreene
Feb 21, 2006, 5:24 PM
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In reply to: And Tgreene, I think its quite good that you say upfront that you are affiliated with Acopa. -Kate.
It seems that unless you're in California, chances are you've never seen or heard of Acopa. Being in the midwest, I feel that I have "something" that I can offer Acopa by bringing their shoes into a new market. Don't get me wrong, I've certainly TRIED to become affiliated, but to no avail... Still though, it doesn't change a thing about how I feel about the product.
Sure, I have developed a contact there (Steve), but only because he's the person that I was able to track down in my lengthy quest to replace my Icampa's. I did speak w/ Bachar on the phone last evening, for the first time ever, and who is this Reardon guy that you speak of..? :lol:
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