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cardboarddog
Oct 8, 2003, 9:44 PM
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I don't know if this is the place, but I got a nasty little spider bite in my ear at the Gunks on Sunday. Anyone get bitten there? Symptoms are similar to Brown Recluse, it took about 6 hours before I noticed it, and then it was seriously swollen and painful, and over the last three days it has turned all kinds of black and purple with whitish blisters around it.
I doubt it's a recluse, but I've read that a bite from a Sac spider almost identical symtoms only not as severe.
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dynoguy
Oct 8, 2003, 10:06 PM
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:shock: I would definitely see a doc as soon as possible :shock:
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tenn_dawg
Oct 8, 2003, 10:11 PM
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Go to the doctor and ask to be put on dioxicillian. It is an antibiotic that reversed some of the effects of a brown recluse bite on Kary Mullis.
The bite will get MUCH worse before it gets better. I hate to scare you, but you may loose the ear.
Go to the doctor NOW.
don't believe me, here is some motivation...
Day 3
Day 4
Day 6
Day 9
Day10
It was alot of work to post all those links. Check them out, then go to the doctor.
Travis
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tenn_dawg
Oct 8, 2003, 10:13 PM
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tenn_dawg moved this thread from General to Injuries & Accidents.
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cardboarddog
Oct 8, 2003, 10:14 PM
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In reply to: :shock: I would definitely see a doc as soon as possible :shock:
My girlfriends a RN, she said they just give you antibiotics and send you on your way with a big bill. I was just wondering if anyone knows about spiders at the Gunks, and if there are spiders there that could have done it. I checked into NE spiders, but got nothing.
Oh well.
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cardboarddog
Oct 8, 2003, 10:17 PM
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In reply to: Go to the doctor and ask to be put on dioxicillian. It is an antibiotic that reversed some of the effects of a brown recluse bite on Kary Mullis. The bite will get MUCH worse before it gets better. I hate to scare you, but you may loose the ear. Go to the doctor NOW. don't believe me, here is some motivation...
Day 3
Day 4
Day 6
Day 9
Day10
It was alot of work to post all those links. Check them out, then go to the doctor. Travis
Dude that literally turned my stomach. Outty.
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tenn_dawg
Oct 8, 2003, 10:32 PM
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The necrotoxin in spider bites is not to be taken lightly.
If it was MY ear, I would go so far as to duct some pure oxygen from a tank onto the wound once it started to rupture. It may help keep some of the tissue alive. Hopefully just enough so your ear will grow back similar looking to how it was before.
My dad got bit on the ass by a spider with a necrotoxin in it's venom, and it hollowed out a hole the size of a Q-ball. I met a girl the other day who was bitten by a recluse on her thigh, and by the looks of her scar, it was a similar type of reaction.
My house in Memphis is infested by Brown Recluses so I've done more than my fair share of reading up on them. If you want to read some of the most interesting literature on them I have ever read, pick up a book called, "Dancing Naked in the Mind Field" By Kary Mullis.
The book has managed to disapear from my bookshelf, so I can't tell you exactly what chapter it's in, but Mullis details his experience with several brown recluse bites on his FACE! He managed to not be terribly disfigured.
It's a good book too. Worth a read.
Travis
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rizzuh
Oct 8, 2003, 10:40 PM
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reaction to reading tenndawg's post (in order)... :D ... :) ... :? ... :shock: ... BLAH!!! all over my computer.
i hate spiders...
every crag should be bug bombed.
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redpoint73
Oct 8, 2003, 10:42 PM
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There's SOMETHING lurking around here in the Northeast. My GF's coworker got bit by an unknown spider while working in the yard this summer (in Mass.). It bit him near the eye, and it also turned black/purple and his face got numb. Of course, the doctors had no idea what kind of spider if could have been. They told him they had never seen that type of reaction from spiders in this area. Scary . . .
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meataxe
Oct 8, 2003, 10:49 PM
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I only got as far as Day 6... I don't want to look further...
All this pestilence... The end time is near :P
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redpoint73
Oct 8, 2003, 11:00 PM
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This comes from Penn State Univeristy, not too too far from NY:
The yellow sac spiders probably account for more human bites that any other type of spider. Humans usually incur C. inclusum bites outdoors while gardening in the summer. C. mildei will readily bite, despite their small size, and they have been observed crawling across the human skin surface and biting without provocation. Fortunately, most bites are relatively painless and do not result in any serious medical conditions. For C. inclusum victims and some individuals sensitive to C. mildei, the bites will exhibit the symptoms described below.
The bite is usually very painful at the outset, with developing erythema, edema, and pruritus. The burning sensation associated with the bite will last for up to an hour, with rash and blistering occurring during the next 1-10 hours. Some patients may exhibit systemic reactions with fever, malaise, muscle cramps, and nausea. These symptoms are similar to black widow bite symptoms but are much less severe. A necrotic lesion and ulceration may also occur at the site, but this is less serious than the similar symptoms that accompany a brown recluse bite, and it usually does not result in scarring.
Like you said, sounds like it could have been a sac spider.
http://www.ento.psu.edu/...piders.htm#yellowsac
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xanx
Oct 8, 2003, 11:04 PM
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day 6 is the last pretty picture. 9 and 10 are the real bad ones...
my (rather uneducated) guess though is that the person in that picture had an allergic reaction to the necrotoxins in the spider's venom. if they have pictures of the guy, i am assuming he was treated (there are antivenoms for a lot of bad venoms, plus good old shots of epi if the sht hits the fan) - i forget the name of it, but there is a syndrome (basically a bad allergic reaction) which results in a similar decay of flesh. there is no cure, but treatment includes spending time in a compression chamber to force more oxygen in.
face bites are especially bad b/c of all the blood flow to the face and the difficulty in isolating hte area bitten.
best of luck, and go to a doctor dammit!
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dontfall
Oct 8, 2003, 11:06 PM
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In reply to: I only got as far as Day 6... I don't want to look further... All this pestilence... The end time is near :P
Good because 9 and 10 are just grose. Man, I am going to take any type of infection I have from know on seriously no matter what it's from.
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rvega
Oct 8, 2003, 11:09 PM
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THE HORROR! That was one of those images you can never get your mind to erase. I use to let spiders live in my home...now? SQUISH!
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tenn_dawg
Oct 9, 2003, 4:44 PM
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Did you go to the doc, dude?
Travis
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meataxe
Oct 9, 2003, 4:50 PM
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In reply to: THE HORROR! That was one of those images you can never get your mind to erase. I use to let spiders live in my home...now? SQUISH!
A statistic to make you feel better...
You are rarely ever more than 10 feet from a spider.
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asaph
Oct 9, 2003, 5:04 PM
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no more than 10 feet? crud. I'm terrified of spiders, and now even more so thanks to those horrid pictures. creepy mean spiders.... ::shudders::
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cardboarddog
Oct 9, 2003, 5:17 PM
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In reply to: Did you go to the doc, dude? Travis
Yeah. BTW, thanks for moving this topic to injuries. Dude the doctor had no clue. The only thing he said was that because it is in cartilage it may help reduce the amount of tissue damage. However he was a little worried about my gland (whatever the one under your jaw is called) being the size of his thumb, so I got some cephalexin? Never heard of it. Hope it works.
Seriously thanks for the info. I used to like spiders. Now they will all feel my wrath! :twisted:
I'm kidding.
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tenn_dawg
Oct 9, 2003, 5:25 PM
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It's an antibiotic that works well for abcesses. We used to prescribe it to cats who had big ass sores from getting into fights, and then getting infected.
I'm glad you went, at least now you can have someone to blame other than the spider if your ear falls off (crossing my fingers that it dosen't).
Travis
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climbingjunky
Oct 9, 2003, 5:58 PM
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Was it a genetically mutated spider? Did you find that you gained some superhuman abilities? Only kdding. :lol: I hope it's not serious. :cry:
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cardboarddog
Oct 9, 2003, 6:50 PM
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In reply to: Was it a genetically mutated spider? Did you find that you gained some superhuman abilities? Only kdding. :lol: I hope it's not serious. :cry:
I wish.
:)
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stick233
Oct 9, 2003, 8:04 PM
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keep us posted on the healing stage... we want to know if you go van gogh... just kidding, hope it heals well...
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bumblie
Oct 9, 2003, 8:14 PM
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This thread reminds of little spider incident I witnessed a while back.
Several years ago I was watching a guy hangdog his way up Apollo Reed (5.13a) at Summersville Lake in West Virginia. The route goes up about 20 feet, then heads out this incredibly steep (30-40 degrees off horizontal) roof. From what I've heard, it's a long continuos jughaul.
In West Virginia (and throughout the Southeast) we have these huge yellow and black spiders, with tail sections (thorax? abdomen?) larger than a quarter.
Anyway, this guy was hanging from a bolt and started going on about all these "big" spiders. This led to much derision. He clipped into a bolt and insisted that someone throw him a stick to clean them out. Someone tossed him a five foot stick, all the while everyone is giving him flack. He says "It's too small". Then he sees the resident 12' stickclip and requests it be sent up via his rope. This leads to more insults. Somebody obliges him and then the fun starts.
He starts cleaning out this hole that you can jam your whole arm in. I think it's a key rest on the route. One by one, he fishes out over ten of these yellow and black beasts. Falling from over thirty feet up, the little buggers picked up some speed on the way to the slab below. When they hit, they sounded like eggs being dropped. It was quite an impressive show. And, of course, everyone apologized for all those mean and nasty things we said to the Brave and Heroic Spider Slayer.
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cnyclimber
Oct 9, 2003, 8:16 PM
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One of my friends got bit this summer in conneticut. She didn't go to the dr right away either. She waited three days before she realized that she had to go. Her bite was on her buttocks. It was still pretty bad.
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superfox
Oct 9, 2003, 8:31 PM
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I have a story similar to Bumblie's. Last weekend I went to Rumney with my friend and his dad and dad's friend. I had climbed up Underdog, and was belaying my friend up it (we were going to do Via Ferrata, the second pitch), and my friend's dad was belaying his friend who was working on As The World Burns, on the same belay ledge as Via Ferrata. The guy climbing was incredibly arachnaphobic, and the cliff we were at has lots of spiders. He saw a quarter-sized one on a roof about five feet up, flicked it off, and sent it on its way down. He failed to notice that a group of people were sitting down below our climb. It missed one person by about a foot or two, and landed on one of their ropes. When it landed we heard the same egg-splat noise as Bumblie heard, but we were almost seventy feet up.
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cardboarddog
Oct 9, 2003, 8:46 PM
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In reply to: One of my friends got bit this summer in conneticut. She didn't go to the dr right away either. She waited three days before she realized that she had to go. Her bite was on her buttocks. It was still pretty bad.
Do you know how long it took for the thing to heal?
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bhudda
Oct 9, 2003, 9:32 PM
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Did you get the spider bite while soloing that 5.3 you were talking about in that other thread you posted?
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lilcapntravis
Oct 9, 2003, 9:51 PM
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In reply to: It's an antibiotic that works well for abcesses. We used to prescribe it to cats who had big ass sores from getting into fights
gross. i hate ass sores on cats. especially the big ones.
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pinnaclechick
Oct 9, 2003, 9:51 PM
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Ugh, went straight to day 10. Bleh..
:?
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boulderpaul
Oct 10, 2003, 6:47 PM
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wow tenn_dawg i have a very weird taste in my mouth due to the 9th and 10th days...
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gretchino
Oct 10, 2003, 7:45 PM
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Bleck is right....ick ick ick
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mega
Oct 10, 2003, 8:23 PM
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A few months back I got chigger bites at the Gunks - apparently not all that uncommon there. At first they seemed like mosquito bites, but they got infected. Some antibiotics killed it, but around there, if you are hiking down after a climb, be careful not to walk in the grass.
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climblarge
Oct 10, 2003, 9:35 PM
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teen_dawg pics are sick. did that person wind up loosing their thumb? I would definatly see a doc asap.
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cardboarddog
Oct 10, 2003, 10:51 PM
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In reply to: keep us posted on the healing stage... we want to know if you go van gogh... just kidding, hope it heals well...
Not a problem. Since my ear is already starting to get better I'm going to assume I was bitten by a Yellow Sac spider. No where near as bad as a Brown Recluse but still not fun. Here's a link if you want to know what to look for. These spiders account for probably 80% of spider bites on the east coast and are known to bite without provocation. Not trying to freak anyone out, but be wary if you see one.
http://www.srv.net/~dkv/hobospider/yellosac.html
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wc
Oct 10, 2003, 10:58 PM
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In reply to: Go to the doctor and ask to be put on dioxicillian. It is an antibiotic that reversed some of the effects of a brown recluse bite on Kary Mullis. The bite will get MUCH worse before it gets better. I hate to scare you, but you may loose the ear. Go to the doctor NOW. don't believe me, here is some motivation...
Day 3
Day 4
Day 6
Day 9
Day10
It was alot of work to post all those links. Check them out, then go to the doctor. Travis
That is crap. That is not a Brown Recluse bit, it is some kind of funky flesh eating bacteria that you can get from any little scratch. There are much worse things out there than Brown Recluse bites.
http://www.bact.wisc.edu:81/ScienceEd/stories/storyReader$89
here is an interesting quote from the above article "some are speculating that it is on the rise due to pain relievers called nonsteroidal anti-inflammatory drugs such as ibuprofen"
http://www.emedicine.com/...161416Untitled-5.jpg
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granitegod
Oct 12, 2003, 5:34 AM
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As an ER nurse, here's my 2 cents:
a.) If it's red, swollen, and hurts..... see a doctor.....whether it's your ear, your belly button, or your penis, or your armpit where you shoot up.
b.) It may not have been a spider at all. I read recently in a textbook in the ER, that many spider bites are misdiagnosed....simply because someone says they were bitten by a spider. Regardless, unless you show symptoms of envenomation......you just may need treatment for an infection.....antibiotics. But depending on the severity, you may need an IV dose or two to get the infection under control. Blood tests may need to be done (blood count, smear, culture)......depends on what it looks like, when it happenned and how sick you look in general.
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deadpointman
Oct 12, 2003, 9:45 AM
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In reply to: In reply to: Go to the doctor and ask to be put on dioxicillian. It is an antibiotic that reversed some of the effects of a brown recluse bite on Kary Mullis. The bite will get MUCH worse before it gets better. I hate to scare you, but you may loose the ear. Go to the doctor NOW. don't believe me, here is some motivation...
Day 3
Day 4
Day 6
Day 9
Day10
It was alot of work to post all those links. Check them out, then go to the doctor. Travis That is crap. That is not a Brown Recluse bit, it is some kind of funky flesh eating bacteria that you can get from any little scratch. There are much worse things out there than Brown Recluse bites. http://www.bact.wisc.edu:81/ScienceEd/stories/storyReader$89 here is an interesting quote from the above article "some are speculating that it is on the rise due to pain relievers called nonsteroidal anti-inflammatory drugs such as ibuprofen" http://www.emedicine.com/...161416Untitled-5.jpg
Their may be worse things than Brown Recluse bites out there, but there are also a lot of less f***ed-up things than Brown Recluse bites out their. Their venom is a cytotoxin and can cause some pretty awful tissue necrosis.
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bumblesbounce
Oct 13, 2003, 3:14 PM
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Go the doctors... there are Brown Recluse's Maine, so there are in Penn. I got bit by a one them in Maine and even afta a couple of hours it's nasty... as ten dawg showed us. Oh, and for me it wasn't the dcillin... I had some other non cillin family thingie. After all the anti dotes and anti vitims I've ever seen.
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lookaughtbelow
Oct 13, 2003, 3:27 PM
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Where aer these spiders native to? any in europe? that looks TERRIFYING to say the least. ick i hate spiders :x
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tenn_dawg
Oct 13, 2003, 3:40 PM
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In reply to: That is crap. That is not a Brown Recluse bit, it is some kind of funky flesh eating bacteria that you can get from any little scratch. There are much worse things out there than Brown Recluse bites.
WC,
Please don't start a response to me with, "That is crap."
"Funky Flesh eating bacteria"? OH really! Is that your scientific diagnosis? You are so misinformed and ignorant that I am not even going to waste the time...
Travis
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overlord
Oct 13, 2003, 7:21 PM
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In reply to: Where aer these spiders native to? any in europe? that looks TERRIFYING to say the least. ick i hate spiders :x
in europe the only really dangerous spider is the black widov, native to dry and warm mediterran area. there have been numerous bites this year on croatian coast (6 i believe, thats about 3 times the average) so there was a kind of panic. but since youre from deutchland, you dont have to worry about that. it is extremely rare even in slovenian carst and coastal region. i dont know about the southern france, spain or italy, but i would assume it lives there too.
and its not such a great deal, a healthy adult can get through it without medical attention, but can be lethal to children and eldery. even of youre a healthy adult, its advisable to see a doctor. and dont worry, youll probably never get bitten.
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fear
Oct 13, 2003, 7:32 PM
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[quote="deadpointman"]In reply to: In reply to: Go to the Travis That is crap. That is not a Brown Recluse bit, it is some kind of funky flesh eating bacteria that you can get from any little scratch. There are much worse things out there than Brown Recluse bites.
Ummmm... Yea it is some kind of localized cytotoxin, perhaps a brown recluse. Your "flesh eating bacteria" theory would have left our patient quite dead long before 6 days was over.
There are other spiders too in the Gunks region with less potent but still nasty bites. A lot depends on the unique reaction of the individual who gets bitten, and the spider that did the biting(how much venom introduced, where on the patient, etc)
-Fear
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cardboarddog
Oct 13, 2003, 7:44 PM
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[quote="fear"]In reply to: In reply to: In reply to: Go to the Travis That is crap. That is not a Brown Recluse bit, it is some kind of funky flesh eating bacteria that you can get from any little scratch. There are much worse things out there than Brown Recluse bites. Ummmm... Yea it is some kind of localized cytotoxin, perhaps a brown recluse. Your "flesh eating bacteria" theory would have left our patient quite dead long before 6 days was over. There are other spiders too in the Gunks region with less potent but still nasty bites. A lot depends on the unique reaction of the individual who gets bitten, and the spider that did the biting(how much venom introduced, where on the patient, etc) -Fear
I'm pretty much 99% positive it was a reaction to Necrotoxins you'd find in venomous spiders. All the symptoms matched.
There are really only 6 venomous spiders in the United States, (technically they are all venomous but only six will cause a reaction in humans). If I was bitten by a Recluse or a Hobo spider, I got off easy. Like you said, it definitely depends on how much venom the spider actually injects. Unlike the Black widow, the Recluse and the Hobo spider have alot of control over how much venom they choose to inject.
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sandbag
Oct 18, 2003, 5:43 AM
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wow T4 all the way, suck all of you in big time
http://www.snopes.com/photos/brownrecluse.asp
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enigma
Oct 18, 2003, 6:59 AM
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Last week I got bit by a spider on my ankle area. It was and still is terribly itchy. Even with cleaning and using hydrogen perioxide it still became infected. The skin is hard around the area affected. Luckily I have been taking antibotics for a tooth-ache during the same duration.
While it is not completely healed it is Not getting worse, except its hard to resist scratching.
I hate Spiders too :!:
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jono
Oct 18, 2003, 7:33 AM
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spiders creep me out. when i lived in kansas those things(brown recluses) infested a lot of houses but not mine thank god. all we got here in WA are those hobo spiders but ive never been biten. Ive seen some bad scars from those recluse bites and tenn_dawgs pictures are not the worst. i think that dude was thinking of staph infection(spelling?) the flesh eating bacteria.
and about those big spiders in the gunks or whatever, go to south/central america. the spiders there look like monsters, with horns and all kinds of shizz. ewww creeps me out...
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jackwhite
Oct 19, 2003, 2:04 PM
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You really have to go out of your way to get a Brown Recluse to bite you, as they are non-aggressive to the point of timidity and ... well... reclusive. Direct physical contact will do it, though, like rolling over on one in bed or grabbing one inadvertently when throwing another log on the fire. Early synmptoms occur a few hours after the bite - nervousness and restlessness, chills, aches, nausea and fever. The degree of tissue necrosis varies according to the sensitivity of the individual, and severity to the degree of some of the posted photos in this forum is extremely rare (though not unheard of). Renal failure also results in a small number of incidents. There is to this day no effective anti-venom, but experiments using dapsone, commonly used in the treatment of leprosy because of its leukocyte limiting properies, have shown promise in limiting the extent of the tissue necrosis.
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pranaguy
Oct 20, 2003, 4:13 AM
Post #48 of 48
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Registered: May 26, 2002
Posts: 61
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In reply to: That is not a Brown Recluse bit, it is some kind of funky flesh eating bacteria that you can get from any little scratch. There are much worse things out there than Brown Recluse bites.
For sure there is... Didn't any of you see our own Mike Reardon's masterpiece Cabin Fever??
-Matt
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