|
orrsteve
Mar 31, 2005, 9:07 PM
Post #1 of 9
(2476 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Mar 31, 2005
Posts: 1
|
I'm new to wall climbing, so I'm looking for some input:
What's the easiest way to set up a ledge at a hanging bivy?
How do you arrange your clip-in points, the ledge, pig, etc., so that there's room for everything?
Is it best to spread out horizontally or vertically?
On the Prow, my partner and I had a total cluster at a hanging bivy. It's easy to set up when you have a natural ledge to stand and walk on, but at a hanging belay where there's less room, what's the best way to set everything up?
Thanks for any input! Steve O
|
|
|
|
|
guanoboy
Mar 31, 2005, 9:50 PM
Post #2 of 9
(2476 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Jan 2, 2004
Posts: 244
|
The most important thing to do is to 'flag' yer ship before ye set sail. That is, assemble your ledge on the ground and never dissemble it on the climb. Clip it assembled at three points to your haul line. This puts your pig below your ledge. When you get to your anchor clip the ledge to the highest point possible and clip your pig so it hangs below or to the side - you often don't have much choice. Avoid hanging your ledge on a low angle wall. I think i've posted a photo of my ledge 'flagged' and i know there are other photos and descriptions of the process on this site.
enjoy
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
ricardol
Mar 31, 2005, 11:21 PM
Post #4 of 9
(2476 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Nov 11, 2002
Posts: 1050
|
Its easier to setup a big wall bivy if its spread out horizontally.
The more points (bolts or pieces) to anchor to, the better. I've only soloed, but almost all my bivies have been hanging bivies.
This is what i usually do.
If i have 3 bolts, i like to dock the pig to an outside bolt, and then attach the portaledge to the other outside bolt. That leaves plenty of room in between so that one is not on top of the other.
(of course the bolts are connected so that they back each other up) -- and there are proper anchors built for you to attach yourself from. On zodiac and TT i hauled and docked the pig to 1 bolt several times (backed up) .. but not all routes have bomber belays like TT and zodiac.
If the bolts are not bomber-- the i'd build 2 anchors. dock the pig to one, and then attach the ledge to the bolt furthest from the pig... which left plenty of room for everything to fit nicely together.
To move around the belay i'd leave my aiders clipped to different parts of the belay, so i could step from one aider to another, my tie in (climbing rope) is usually long enough to reach any part of the belay, and i use an adjustable fifi to hook in and stay in close when i need to. (i usually also have a long (double length) sling that serves as a backup tie-in. -- that gets clipped to the nearest powerpoint as i move around.
==============================
as far as keeping the belay tidy -- use slings and daisy chains to clip your rack and organize other gear while at the belay ..
I have keeper cords on my chest harness (attached at the shoulders) and at the end of the keeper cords is a carabiner.. i can use both these keeper tie-ins to clip the chest harness (full of gear) to 2 points of the anchor at the bivy. -- nice and tidy ..
-- ricardo
|
|
|
|
|
kungfuclimber
Apr 1, 2005, 7:46 PM
Post #5 of 9
(2476 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Aug 6, 2002
Posts: 162
|
If you really don't want to get any nasty surprises do what I did.
Put a long peice of webbing around a rafter or something similar. Clip your ledge (still packed in its bag) to the webbing. Clip yourself (in a harness) to the webbing. You are now hanging is freespace with the ledge hanging with you. Have someone turn off the lights. Assemble the ledge.
It sounds silly but it is the worst case scenario. Pitch black, at a hanging belay with no achoring for your feet (no leverage). I practiced this until I could setup the ledge, alone, in the dark, under ten minutes. I learned alot about the easy and hard ways to setup my ledge, and the smart and dumb ways to pack it.
The ledge is a A5 cliff cabana, not the easiest to setup alone, hanging, in the dark. If you practice like that you'll have no problems setting it up.
|
|
|
|
|
robbiehirsch
Apr 1, 2005, 8:18 PM
Post #6 of 9
(2476 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Oct 21, 2004
Posts: 54
|
In reply to: The most important thing to do is to 'flag' yer ship before ye set sail. That is, assemble your ledge on the ground and never dissemble it on the climb. Clip it assembled at three points to your haul line. This puts your pig below your ledge. When you get to your anchor clip the ledge to the highest point possible and clip your pig so it hangs below or to the side - you often don't have much choice. Avoid hanging your ledge on a low angle wall. I think i've posted a photo of my ledge 'flagged' and i know there are other photos and descriptions of the process on this site. enjoy
Wouldn't hauling your ledge assembled wear out the fabric pretty quickly?
|
|
|
|
|
guanoboy
Apr 3, 2005, 5:26 PM
Post #7 of 9
(2476 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Jan 2, 2004
Posts: 244
|
Your ledge is certainly more likely to rub against something when flagged as opposed to wrapped up in the haul bag, but..... As it turns out your ledge is clipped by crabs to your haul rope. This allows your ledge to spin easily around the rope. When the ledge bumps into a roof it will typically swing into the path of least resistance and not rub against anything. Similarly, even though you've put this huge sail out in the wind, the ledge finds the path of least resistance, like a weathervane, and doesn't cause any problems.
The terrific benefit is that you dont have to waste, what was for me about half hour, in the morning and evening fiddling and stressing about setting up and dropping your ledge. If someone knows how to attach a photo you can go to 'guanoboy's photos' and attach the photo of my flagged ship.
flag yer ship matey!
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
brutusofwyde
Apr 11, 2005, 8:17 PM
Post #9 of 9
(2476 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Nov 3, 2002
Posts: 1473
|
In reply to: image is a link to itself.
Note how low-angle this wall is.
Flagging is good in some situations. Not all. For example, on Skull Queen on the Column, just below the OW pitch, is a tree. I challenge anyone to haul a flagged portaledge through that tree.
Regardless, I recommend you do what kungfuclimber described. But do it outside, in a 30-mile-an-hour wind, with someone occasionally turning a garden hose on you full force. Drinking a case of Old E beforehand will help simulate the mental state induced by a full day on the wall.
Brutus
|
|
|
|
|
|
