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climbingpride
Jul 30, 2002, 3:09 AM
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Am about to buy a good number of draws and am wondering what type to get. I know it has been posted asking what is your favorite draw but I just want to know "Wiregate or no Wiregate?" I don't know about you other climbers but a solid gate makes me feel more comfortable safety wise but does it really matter? Have you used Wiregate Draws? Why or why not did you like them?
Pride
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peas
Jul 30, 2002, 3:19 AM
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I have some draws with wired gates and some with no wired gates and like them both equally well. I find that my non-wired gate biners which are BD Enduros catch webbing a bit easier than the wire gates.
Some wired gate biners have small gate openings, so watch out for that if that's a concern for you. I guess that's something to watch with any biner.
If I were to get draws again soon, I'd probably get wired gates because they're light. That or something like Petzl Spirits because they're light and notchless(but $$$)
[ This Message was edited by: peas on 2002-07-29 20:20 ]
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blindslap
Jul 30, 2002, 3:43 AM
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weight. hold ten BD enduros, then some BD nutrinos (sp) and you'll feel a difference. Also wire gates help against lash, and are a little bit stronger. (1 kn)
Find a draw that fits well into your hand and is easy to clip, that's the most important.
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pir8penguin
Jul 30, 2002, 3:54 AM
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if you're just looking at the caribiners when it comes to draws, i'd consider two things: weight and ease of clipping. consider which is more important. if weight is, then go with the wires, ie BD nuetrinos (95g). else, i'd go with a KEYLOCK standard gate draw, like the BD positron (113g). bit of a weight disadvantage, but kelocks are smooth all around even when open, so the rope won't get caugh. not to mention the open gate won't get caught in webbing or bolts as easy.
[ This Message was edited by: pir8penguin on 2002-07-29 20:54 ]
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climbinganne
Jul 30, 2002, 4:57 AM
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go to http://www.northernmountain.com and look up stubai draws at 8.99 @ the wiregate have nice big openings compare all the #'s...it's a great deal on a quickdraw!!
I have BD's and wild country and i use these more and paid less $$. Have fun!!!
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earsen
Jul 30, 2002, 5:54 AM
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I'm real fond of the Omega JC5.7 One wire/ One non wire. Takes weight and safety into considerationa and balances them both. The Gate clearance on the wire gate is friggin huge also. Check em out here http://www.climbonrock.com/biner%20page.htm
[ This Message was edited by: earsen on 2002-07-29 22:55 ]
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mikedano
Jul 30, 2002, 3:51 PM
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I used to think all draws were the same, so go cheap.
However, now that I own some wires and a largish rack, I say GO LIGHT, GO WIRES. Like someone said before, just hold a few regulars and a few wires and you'll see the difference. Now pretend you're 200 ft. off the ground at the crux and you've got a big ol rack--could've been significantly lighter if you had wires!
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stevematthys
Jul 31, 2002, 1:42 AM
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just know that if cross load a wire gate on a big fall there is a chance the wire gate will cut the rope.
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pir8penguin
Jul 31, 2002, 3:17 AM
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that's been proven nearly impossible in another thread. the gate would break first.
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coldclimb
Jul 31, 2002, 5:08 AM
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And that's any better?
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climbingcowboy
Aug 1, 2002, 8:17 AM
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Dude the only way to go is with wired biners for that safer, stronger, wont open on a bad fall if it hits the rock, and most important a hellva lot easier to clip with,
if you dont get the thing about opening when it hits the rock take a regualr biner oval or bent gate and hit it against your leg youll here and see it open then try a wired gate wont happen.
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overlord
Aug 1, 2002, 9:15 AM
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i love wiregates. they are lighter, stronger and the gates are easier to open when cliping, ant the rust doesnt affect their action (opening).
CLIMB ON
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pir8penguin
Aug 1, 2002, 12:04 PM
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steve and coldclimb: a caribiner breaking is about 50 times better than your rope cutting. if you have to ask that question, it worries me, but i'll explain with an example: say you're working your way up pitch three, you're on lead. you're ready to place again, and your last pro has all the sudden walked out on you. you get sketched, and you fall. say by some freak chance the gate on the caribiner at your last placement breaks off. at least theres another one below it, and your belay is anchored in...you're probably gonna have a nasty fall, but you'll make it.
now, same scenario, but the ROPE is cut. you've lost your connection with the next placement, and your belay. you're grounding unless you can fly or grab something on the way down. bet you can't do either.
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clymber
Aug 1, 2002, 1:43 PM
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I hate wire gates..just dont feel safe with them. Im sure for ice climbing they would be good but i dont ice climb..i like the sound od the gate snapping on the biner when its clipped in..gives me a warm and fuzzy feeling inside and also i know that the rope was clipped when i hear that sound when im the belayer
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stevematthys
Aug 1, 2002, 7:45 PM
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pir8penguin, way to state the obvious. i know that i would rather have a biner break then the rope cut. i was just stating the point that some people have talked about wire gates cutting the rope on big falls, and one major company (i forget who) said it could happen.
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natec
Aug 1, 2002, 8:27 PM
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Stevematthys,
No major company has said it could happen. In fact the exact opposite has been stated by Chris Harmstead, the equipment safety tester for Black Diamond.
Another proof that wires are good is that every major company makes them except Petzl.
I personally don't have a preference between wires and standard gates. All of my gear is racked on Kong Helium biners because they are outrageously light and have a kelock gate. My quick draws and slings all have wire gates on the rope end. This is largely due to the fact that I haven't been able to come up with enough money to buy Heliums for all my draws.
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pir8penguin
Aug 1, 2002, 8:35 PM
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steve...i didn't mean to include you in that post, sorry man. the other dude made the comment about "and that's better?". again, my apoligies.
also, i'd be happy to go around asking every major caribiner manufacturer if they stated that wire biners cut ropes if i had any idea that it were true.
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okieterry
Aug 1, 2002, 8:50 PM
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I like wire gates but I have ran into a problem with two different designs from Omega. After just a season, most of my omega wire gate biners are in my "don't use" pile of gear because the gate action is real slow or sticks open. I've tried cleaning them and lubricating them and it does help for awhile and then they stick again. On the other hand, I've got a bunch of black diamond wiregates that I've never had a problem with. I wish I had a whole rack of neutrinos!
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stevematthys
Aug 1, 2002, 11:42 PM
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hmm, i thought i remebered someone here saying that a major company said that could happen. i guess i did not remember that correctly. or they were wrong.
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punk
Aug 2, 2002, 12:13 AM
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I have the 26 Nutrino, 10 hotwire, 12 WC Ascent, 24 Trango lightweight II, 10 Kong wire and 36 Omega ISO 4 all in wiregate no problems love them all never any problems I also have 24 Positron, 26 spirits and 12 Kong Top and I love them too as I saw in all of my time climbing the situations that u describe in carabiner failure are extreme far between and absurd with a likelihood of Zero to none ill say get what u like and can afford and pay no mind to a false alarm like this one….you probably will have more chances getting hit by a bus then having this scenario happening but yet I haven’t heard of you being in Isolation Booth for the rest of your life to prevent from running to a bus…
[ This Message was edited by: punk on 2002-08-01 17:37 ]
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tradklime
Aug 2, 2002, 9:24 PM
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My opinion, go with a key-lock for the hanger end and a wire gate for the rope end. Key locks for not snagging when you are desperate and the wire gate for preventing gate slap. I also don't like bent gates.
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