Forums: Climbing Disciplines: Alpine & Ice:
Ames Ice Hose, Colorado BOLTED?
RSS FeedRSS Feeds for Alpine & Ice

Premier Sponsor:

 
First page Previous page 1 2 Next page Last page  View All


damonjohnston


Feb 19, 2006, 2:26 AM
Post #1 of 41 (7691 views)
Shortcut

Registered: Nov 10, 2004
Posts: 10

Ames Ice Hose, Colorado BOLTED?
Report this Post
Average: avg_1 avg_2 avg_3 avg_4 avg_5 (0 ratings)  
Can't Post

In late January Chuck Burr, a beginner climber, found it necessary to place a bolt on the rock variation of the Ames Ice Hose. A little history: Lou Dawson, Steve Shea and Michael Kennedy first climbed the Ice Hose in 1976. Mugs Stump and Bob Sullivan climbed the mixed (rock and ice) variation not long thereafter (as far we know). Over the past three decades this route has seen countless ascents by climbers from all over the world. The Ice Hose has earned it place in history as one of Colorado’s finest climbs. Burr’s action demonstrates a lack of respect for the history of this route (for those who did the first ascent, as well as all thoes who have climbed it since) and has taken away the true challenge of this mixed climb. When someone climbs a new route, be it on rock and/or ice, for the first time they set the standard by which it is done by those that come after them. By placing a bolt on this very well established route Burr has disrespected the standard set by those who did the first ascent. In addition, he has brought the seriousness of this route down to a lower level of climbing (thus altering the level of challenge that will be experienced by those who will come after him). After having asked Burr to remove the bolt of his own accord to no avail, the bolt was recently removed by local climbers. Surly if the bolt is replaced it will be removed again and again…

My advice: respect those who came before you, know you limits and earn the climb.

Also see Charlie Fowler's Blog:
http://www.charlieontheloose.blogspot.com/

Damon


kachoong


Feb 19, 2006, 2:47 AM
Post #2 of 41 (7691 views)
Shortcut

Registered: Jan 23, 2004
Posts: 15304

Re: Ames Ice Hose, Colorado BOLTED? [In reply to]
Report this Post
Average: avg_1 avg_2 avg_3 avg_4 avg_5 (0 ratings)  
Can't Post

This is truly sad.... this is an outstanding climb, which, given time, is usually fully formed.... for someone to want to climb it in it's mixed state, they should respect it for what it is and not alter it's beauty.... or wait until it's formed and climb it as the fcuking fantastic WI5+ that it is.... If you can't sack up and climb it the way it was put up, then go shop for some more frilly panties....

I climbed Ames the day after the 98 Ouray fest and loved EVERY minute of it!

http://www.rockclimbing.com/...p.cgi?Detailed=31886


stymingersfink


Feb 19, 2006, 6:26 PM
Post #3 of 41 (7691 views)
Shortcut

Registered: Aug 12, 2003
Posts: 7250

Re: Ames Ice Hose, Colorado BOLTED? [In reply to]
Report this Post
Average: avg_1 avg_2 avg_3 avg_4 avg_5 (0 ratings)  
Can't Post

...and not just Colorado, you lilly-livered week-kneed sacks of shit! keep your fucking bolt-guns off of our alpine crags, PERIOD. If ya can't do it with gear, a screw or a pin, ya can't do it. BACK THE FUCK OFF!

Leave it for someone else to sack-it-up and run-it-out, or wait for better conditions later in the season or some year down the road.


Glad to hear it was chopped, too bad it was even necessary to discuss. (and what haas said, about respect and all.)


pyramid


Feb 28, 2006, 4:07 PM
Post #4 of 41 (7691 views)
Shortcut

Registered: Sep 30, 2005
Posts: 51

Re: Ames Ice Hose, Colorado BOLTED? [In reply to]
Report this Post
Average: avg_1 avg_2 avg_3 avg_4 avg_5 (0 ratings)  
Can't Post

What do you guys expect, ice climbing has become the latest
city-slicker dweeb sport. Where every young white man from
north to south, east to west wants to ice climb. I see it every
day, some fool with several thousand dollars worth of brand new
gear and its his first time climbing, Americans!


midwestishell


Feb 28, 2006, 4:23 PM
Post #5 of 41 (7691 views)
Shortcut

Registered: Nov 10, 2004
Posts: 147

Re: Ames Ice Hose, Colorado BOLTED? [In reply to]
Report this Post
Average: avg_1 avg_2 avg_3 avg_4 avg_5 (0 ratings)  
Can't Post

In reply to:
What do you guys expect, ice climbing has become the latest
city-slicker dweeb sport. Where every young white man from
north to south, east to west wants to ice climb. I see it every
day, some fool with several thousand dollars worth of brand new
gear and its his first time climbing, Americans!


Woo hoo! Not in the middle. Many of the sport climber punks here in St. Louis think I am insane for climbing ice. Keep the city slicker ice climbers on the coasts.

Th


slobmonster


Feb 28, 2006, 11:31 PM
Post #6 of 41 (7691 views)
Shortcut

Registered: Jul 28, 2003
Posts: 1586

Re: Ames Ice Hose, Colorado BOLTED? [In reply to]
Report this Post
Average: avg_1 avg_2 avg_3 avg_4 avg_5 (0 ratings)  
Can't Post

Here's chuck's letter to the editor, from today's Telluride Daily Planet

In reply to:
Dear Editor,

I have lived in the Telluride region for five years and have been mountaineering in one form or another for about that long. I have nothing to prove to anyone. I climb just because I love it. I mentor younger climbers as best I can in my spare time and enjoy learning from others.

After climbing the Ames Ice Hose several times this year, reviewing the antique state of the anchors, witnessing 30-foot and 50-foot ground falls with luckily just minor injuries, and seeing the rapid deterioration of the resource, the climb began to bother others and myself in the climbing community. The first anchor is made up of an old rusty piton and a rusty quarter inch bolt tied together by a rat's nest of webbing. Some climb past this anchor, while others top rope the first pitch. Plus there is no reliable protection for the first 30 feet of the alternative rock route being climbed this year because of lower ice levels; you basically have to free solo it before you can get any protection in. As a consensus among the people I climb with, we placed one bolt as a compromise, two are actually needed, to protect the 30 foot ground fall on the alternate rock route and planned to replace the first anchor as our next project. The original ice route remains untouched. Since the leaders in the climbing community were not policing themselves a new group had to step up to the plate. This was not an effort by just one person.


Feedback from local climbers I have received ranges from "I am so glad you put a bolt there, that is a death climb," to "what you did and the way you did it was highly inappropriate." The negative comments come primarily from those who have placed literally thousands of bolts themselves in the region or from the elite local guides. They make me feel that I have impinged on their territory or power structure in some way. The positive feedback comes from the regular climbers, other guides, as well as Search and Rescue instructors that often risk their own lives when someone else gets hurt.

Some of those with negative opinions have gotten a little out of hand. Folks who are supposed to be the award winning elite in our community have spammed my e-mail address which I had to change, given out my phone number, and blogged almost every major climbing magazine and Web site all about one lousy bolt placed with nothing but the best intentions. Not a single person with a negative opinion has taken the time to get to know me, to find out what route we are talking about, replace the dilapidated anchor, or just take a deep breath first. If this is how our most senior leaders and first ascenders behave, vengeful and angrily, then maybe we need new heroes.

As far as I am concerned, you can make climbing as scary as you and your family want, but safety first for the community at large. If you want to show off, then do not clip the bolt and run it out or free solo the entire route. It is hard to see how some climbers who have placed thousands of bolts in the region like a rivet gun, have anything to complain about one bolt on an alternative route. This is especially true for climbers who cannot lead the pitch or who do not even ice climb. I am sure you will be hard pressed to find a single regional route bolted by these folks with the first bolt 30 feet off the ground above demanding climbing with no logical, clean alternative.

As our weather warms or droughts continue, we are going to have to deal with more limited ice climbing conditions. Several southwest Colorado climbs are not climbable this year because of none or unprotectable ice on the first pitch. They include other classics such as The Talisman, The Ribbon and Birdbrain Boulevard. Do not shoot the messenger.

Then I get "you just have to be a better climber," from the naysayers. I am not the world's greatest climber, but I try to lead ice climb about three days a week. This year I have lead climbed the right side of Ingram Falls four times, the Ames Ice Hose four, plus Bridal Veil and Cornet a couple just to mention a few. If I am not ready who is? I have snow and waterskied for over 30 years, but I do not look down my nose at anyone who has skied less.

I have also had negative feedback from some of the original first ascent climbers to whom I meant absolutely no disrespect. I am disappointed in the first place some are more concerned about preserving their accomplishments than safety or getting the facts straight. For example, alluding that adding a bolt flies in the face of the original ethic. First, these climbers do not climb with the same gear they used 30 years ago either so what is their point. Importantly though, we are not talking about the original ice route; it remains untouched. Before you haul off and conjure up the meanest e-mail you can, get the facts straight.

Then, I hear, "you will just fall in the snow." Fine, be my guest, free solo up the first 30 feet and jump. I think this is where the term "social Darwinism" came from. One of my climbing partners was injured by a crampon when saving one of the parties who fell 30 feet. Remember, you are ground falling loaded with sharp ice screws, ice axes and crampons, plus there is a rock ledge to avoid on your way down and a log at the bottom under low snow conditions. And finally I get, "it has been climbed the same way for 30 years." Actually the alternative rock route is not the same. The bomber flake the first ascenders were able to grab has come off and the only seam to place a small aid nut is now almost busted out. The rock resource is deteriorating quickly from all the crampon traffic and must be preserved for future generations.

Most dedicated climbers have read "Into Thin Air" or "Touching the Void," but not too many have read "Where the Mountain Casts Its Shadow." The latter book tells the story of the wives that have lost their husbands on Everest and the personality profiles of those climbers. For me, I am not trying to make history every time I climb, get my picture in a guidebook, or be apart of an elite clique. I just want to get outside and come home to my family.

I am not telling anyone how he or she should think. Everyone is entitled to his or her own opinion. That is fine. But, if you do not have anything good to say, keep it to yourself, especially if you are a leader in the community and when you do not know the other person involved or the complete circumstances. I wrote this to enable those concerned about safety to be able to voice their opinion and not be intimidated by others.

If the bolt is replaced again, it will not be by me. But I guess it will mean that there are other climbers out there who realize climbing is just a sport. Live and let live.

Chuck Burr

Telluride


roy_hinkley_jr


Feb 28, 2006, 11:51 PM
Post #7 of 41 (7691 views)
Shortcut

Registered: Sep 8, 2005
Posts: 652

Re: Ames Ice Hose, Colorado BOLTED? [In reply to]
Report this Post
Average: avg_1 avg_2 avg_3 avg_4 avg_5 (0 ratings)  
Can't Post

FYI, the negative feedback he so readily discounts came from a broad spectrum of the climbing community. Among those who emailed disapproval were: Malcolm Daly, Duncan Ferguson, Charlie Fowler, Jack Roberts, Joe Josephson, Greg Child, George Lowe, Michael Kennedy (1st ascent), Lou Dawson (1st ascent)....

Climbing is just a sport. But the Ames Ice Hose is not just another climb.


moose_droppings


Mar 1, 2006, 12:56 AM
Post #8 of 41 (7691 views)
Shortcut

Registered: Jun 7, 2005
Posts: 3371

Re: Ames Ice Hose, Colorado BOLTED? [In reply to]
Report this Post
Average: avg_1 avg_2 avg_3 avg_4 avg_5 (0 ratings)  
Can't Post

Though I don't ice climb. it needs to be said. This is a new wave of thought coming down all avenues of climbing. Routes need to be safer, and there's a batch of people ready to do it.
Damn old farts, what were we thinking.


thinman13


Mar 1, 2006, 1:45 AM
Post #9 of 41 (7691 views)
Shortcut

Registered: Oct 5, 2005
Posts: 11

Re: Ames Ice Hose, Colorado BOLTED? [In reply to]
Report this Post
Average: avg_1 avg_2 avg_3 avg_4 avg_5 (0 ratings)  
Can't Post

I disapprove strongly of Chuck Burr putting in a bolt on the first pitch of the Ames Ice Hose. Not only is a bolt unneccessary, it is an atrocity visited upon one of the finest routes that I ever can hope to climb. I am outraged that he would consider to alter this climb, simply to make it safer for the climbing community. Safer does not equate to better. Guidebook descriptions make it clear that the first pitch is dangerous and should be treated very carefully. No doubt, hundreds of leaders have willingly taken the risk and gone for broke on the first pitch. Chuck has clearly made a mistake by placing the bolt, and I'm sure that he will come to regret his impulsive decision. I am glad to see that he is not going to replace the bolt, as the experience is much richer without.

On a lighter note, I am proud to say that a little over a week ago, I had the great fortune of climbing the Ice Hose with a great partner. We found no trace of the bolt, and we spent a bit of time looking for it. I have to disagree with Chuck about the anchors - they're fine! I had confidence in the fixed anchors on the first pitch (a rusted but solid piton and a bomber 3/8" bolt equalized), and I readily trusted it with my life. I enjoyed testing myself on the sparsely protected first pitch, and I think that Chuck overstates the dangers of the pitch. Bad protection is expected on the first pitch, period. That's part of the allure of the climb. You just hope you don't get to test the old "alpine crashpad."

I have the deepest respect for the first ascentionists of the Ice Hose. What vision and daring it must have taken. And how much easier it must be to climb the Hose with all the new gear of today. Chuck Burr's vision of the Ice Hose is a watered-down version of the real thing.


pyramid


Mar 2, 2006, 2:43 PM
Post #10 of 41 (7691 views)
Shortcut

Registered: Sep 30, 2005
Posts: 51

Re: Ames Ice Hose, Colorado BOLTED? [In reply to]
Report this Post
Average: avg_1 avg_2 avg_3 avg_4 avg_5 (0 ratings)  
Can't Post

Mr. Burr you have very little experience in the mts, that is obvious, why don't you just not climb Ames if it's so dangerous. If you can't climb it
with the conditions that day then climb elsewhere. That's the whole point
of a classic like that. You going to bolt up the Ribbon because there's no
ice for the first 100 ft.? I think you should stick to the Telluride ski slopes. :lol:


Partner tradman


Mar 2, 2006, 4:29 PM
Post #11 of 41 (7691 views)
Shortcut

Registered: Jan 14, 2003
Posts: 7159

Re: Ames Ice Hose, Colorado BOLTED? [In reply to]
Report this Post
Average: avg_1 avg_2 avg_3 avg_4 avg_5 (0 ratings)  
Can't Post

Chuck Burr,

If you can't climb the route, don't climb the route.

You claim you don't look down on other climbers, but yet you think they're so cowardly and unskilled that they need a bolt where you needed none.

Please stay away from the rocks and ice. They don't need a chipper like you.


healyje


Mar 2, 2006, 5:06 PM
Post #12 of 41 (7691 views)
Shortcut

Registered: Aug 22, 2004
Posts: 4204

Re: Ames Ice Hose, Colorado BOLTED? [In reply to]
Report this Post
Average: avg_1 avg_2 avg_3 avg_4 avg_5 (0 ratings)  
Can't Post

In reply to:
Since the leaders in the climbing community were not policing themselves a new group had to step up to the plate. This was not an effort by just one person.

Chuck, you completely misinterpreted the state of the climb - local leaders were completely fine with the current state of the route. You on the otherhand were completely irresponsible in your self-serving inference that the FA's and other long-time locals were in any way negligent.


In reply to:
As far as I am concerned, you can make climbing as scary as you and your family want, but safety first for the community at large.

This is a gross imposition of your personal opinion on the climbing community at large. I can assure you it is not shared and I actually find such consumer-oriented, risk-averse, suburban attitudes painfully out of place in the wild beyond the confines of your local gym. "Safety", first and foremost, is a personal responsibility in climbing - not one abdicated to any "community" nor imposed on any individual by the same. The "just don't clip them" argument is as sad and pathetic an argument today as it was yesterday and will be tomorrow. The actual operative phrase is "just don't climb it". Your attitudes, inexperience, failure to seek out longtime locals on the matter, and subsequent actions and verbage clearly give away the only thing painfully obvious in this sad episode - that you have no business bolting at all.


stymingersfink


Mar 2, 2006, 8:02 PM
Post #13 of 41 (7691 views)
Shortcut

Registered: Aug 12, 2003
Posts: 7250

Re: Ames Ice Hose, Colorado BOLTED? [In reply to]
Report this Post
Average: avg_1 avg_2 avg_3 avg_4 avg_5 (0 ratings)  
Can't Post

...what a tool. Chuck, why don't you stick to your lift-accessed skiing and leave the mountains for the real men (and women) to play in.

http://www.kepfeltoltes.hu/...824/eric_cartman.jpg If some girl tried to piss me off, i'd be like, hey missy! why don't you go ... mmmmake babies! (thats erics way of telling you to go fuck yourself, in case you couldn't tell, chuck.)


dingus


Mar 2, 2006, 8:20 PM
Post #14 of 41 (7691 views)
Shortcut

Registered: Dec 16, 2002
Posts: 17398

Re: Ames Ice Hose, Colorado BOLTED? [In reply to]
Report this Post
Average: avg_1 avg_2 avg_3 avg_4 avg_5 (0 ratings)  
Can't Post

Look, a retrobolt was added, a retrobolt was chopped. The bolter is chagrined over a public spanking and wrote a letter explaining himself and his rationale and concluded with the admission he would not attempt to replace the chopped bolt.

That's how things work here. Its how things are supposed to work. We are a self-policing community. There is no need for 5 pages of self righteous condemnation, the situation has been dealt with.

Jeezus Key Ryst, they're even chiming in from the old country! MYOB!

DMT


Partner brent_e


Mar 2, 2006, 9:42 PM
Post #15 of 41 (7691 views)
Shortcut

Registered: Dec 15, 2004
Posts: 5111

Re: Ames Ice Hose, Colorado BOLTED? [In reply to]
Report this Post
Average: avg_1 avg_2 avg_3 avg_4 avg_5 (0 ratings)  
Can't Post

In reply to:
In reply to:
Since the leaders in the climbing community were not policing themselves a new group had to step up to the plate. This was not an effort by just one person.

Chuck, you completely misinterpreted the state of the climb - local leaders were completely fine with the current state of the route. You on the otherhand were completely irresponsible in your self-serving inference that the FA's and other long-time locals were in any way negligent.


In reply to:
As far as I am concerned, you can make climbing as scary as you and your family want, but safety first for the community at large.

This is a gross imposition of your personal opinion on the climbing community at large. I can assure you it is not shared and I actually find such consumer-oriented, risk-averse, suburban attitudes painfully out of place in the wild beyond the confines of your local gym. "Safety", first and foremost, is a personal responsibility in climbing - not one abdicated to any "community" nor imposed on any individual by the same. The "just don't clip them" argument is as sad and pathetic an argument today as it was yesterday and will be tomorrow. The actual operative phrase is "just don't climb it". Your attitudes, inexperience, failure to seek out longtime locals on the matter, and subsequent actions and verbage clearly give away the only thing painfully obvious in this sad episode - that you have no business bolting at all.

VERY well put.


jeffrogers


Mar 8, 2006, 6:06 AM
Post #16 of 41 (7691 views)
Shortcut

Registered: Nov 3, 2005
Posts: 57

Re: Ames Ice Hose, Colorado BOLTED? [In reply to]
Report this Post
Average: avg_1 avg_2 avg_3 avg_4 avg_5 (0 ratings)  
Can't Post

Having never climbed the ice hose or climbed or visited the telluride area I have to say something disrespectfull and irrational to Chuck Burr and the people who removed the bolt....

Why don't all of you A-rabs just jump back on you camel and go back to China where you came from and then put bolts up and write letters where people don't even know how to read so you don't sound so stupid.

I really hope that my remarks put this conflict into perspective and help to resolve the matter in an amicable and timely fashion.


Thanks

Gary


slobmonster


May 2, 2006, 11:05 PM
Post #17 of 41 (7691 views)
Shortcut

Registered: Jul 28, 2003
Posts: 1586

Re: Ames Ice Hose, Colorado BOLTED? [In reply to]
Report this Post
Average: avg_1 avg_2 avg_3 avg_4 avg_5 (0 ratings)  
Can't Post

For the sake of completeness, here's a comment from yesterday's (5/1/2006) Telluride Daily Planet

In reply to:
Dear Editor,

You climbers really bust me up sometimes. In reference to Damon Johnston's letter to the editor in the Feb. 20 edition of the Telluride Daily Planet, earning a climb is a matter of perspective isn't it? As a non-climber, Damon, I see your approach to climbing as identical to Mr. Burr's. If you have to hang from a rope to drill holes in the rock for bolts that enable you to do the climb, your skills are lacking and you didn't earn the climb.

But far more importantly, Damon, I advise you to reconsider your attempt to publicly humiliate a San Miguel County neighbor, especially over something so very, very, petty. We are living in some very sad times. How many of our troops have died in Iraq and how many more are sure to follow? There are so many moral issues our nation is grappling with right now and you write about one silly little bolt like it's a moral outrage.


Damon, I'm sure climbing is very important to you but in the whole scheme of things climbing is just another form of play and not that important. And you should learn to play nice.

Personally, I think it would be so cool if the climbers/hangdoggers of the region played by the same rules as the rest of the backcountry users. Leave no trace behind. Why stop at snipping one bolt. Why don't we snip ‘em all and you know what Damon? You might find it very rewarding to start earning your climbs. But be careful - know your limits.

Tom Slocum

Telluride

I don't know if Tom climbs or not, but it seems he sure has that intuition for kicking the spurs into an argument.


skiclimb


May 3, 2006, 6:50 AM
Post #18 of 41 (7691 views)
Shortcut

Registered: Jan 11, 2004
Posts: 1938

Re: Ames Ice Hose, Colorado BOLTED? [In reply to]
Report this Post
Average: avg_1 avg_2 avg_3 avg_4 avg_5 (0 ratings)  
Can't Post

If you want to die climbin that is your problem.. not mine.


damonjohnston


Dec 11, 2006, 3:38 PM
Post #19 of 41 (5290 views)
Shortcut

Registered: Nov 10, 2004
Posts: 10

Re: [slobmonster] Ames Ice Hose, Colorado BOLTED? [In reply to]
Report this Post
Average: avg_1 avg_2 avg_3 avg_4 avg_5 (0 ratings)  
Can't Post

Poor Tom,

If I may make a correction to your last letter it would have to be just this simple: You are right you are a non-climber. BUT you are a non-climber who’s word I would not take seriously (you see Tom and I worked for the same company years ago and well he does not work there any longer—story—neither do I but for very different reasons). If you like Chuck, email him your thoughts, I’m sure he would like them, you both think alike (i.e., you both think highly of yourselves and have little if any respect for anyone else). I have placed many bolts, many on lead by hand, some hanging from hooks and in some cases I have rapped a route to see if it is climbable at all. BUT I HAVE NEVER, EVER, PLACED A BOLT ON A ROUTE THAT WAS ESTABLISHED BY ANOTHER CLIMBER. I have put up hundreds of routes, published two climbing guides and have climbed for 20 years this summer (2007). In that time I have never encountered someone so clueless as to goings on of climbers, their past and where they are trying to take themselves.

Best Luck Getting A Clue,
Damon


iceisnice


Dec 11, 2006, 8:36 PM
Post #20 of 41 (5207 views)
Shortcut

Registered: Jun 2, 2004
Posts: 874

Re: [damonjohnston] Ames Ice Hose, Colorado BOLTED? [In reply to]
Report this Post
Average: avg_1 avg_2 avg_3 avg_4 avg_5 (0 ratings)  
Can't Post

i get real tired of the "well, if you don't like the bolt you can just climb past it". the person saying that does not understand the mental aspects of this activity. yeah, i could climb past it without clipping it, BUT, i KNOW its there. i KNOW that it would be possible to bail onto a bolt if i get scared. its one thing to hop on a hard route not sure where it is gonna take you instead of hoping on a hard route and knowing the outcome....either way (i.e. bail or send). obviously, i agree with the other arguements about respecting FA ethics. if its too dangerous for you then stay the hell away until you've built up the skills necessary to do it. no more quick fixes for you pansies.


johnhemlock


Dec 12, 2006, 4:52 AM
Post #21 of 41 (5157 views)
Shortcut

Registered: Apr 10, 2004
Posts: 311

Re: [iceisnice] Ames Ice Hose, Colorado BOLTED? [In reply to]
Report this Post
Average: avg_1 avg_2 avg_3 avg_4 avg_5 (0 ratings)  
Can't Post

Now there are 3 bolts and they are the Petzl Longlifes that are very difficult to wrench out.

Perhaps I can hang my compressor from them.


asclepius


Dec 12, 2006, 5:44 AM
Post #22 of 41 (5139 views)
Shortcut

Registered: Apr 20, 2006
Posts: 61

Re: [johnhemlock] Ames Ice Hose, Colorado BOLTED? [In reply to]
Report this Post
Average: avg_1 avg_2 avg_3 avg_4 avg_5 (0 ratings)  
Can't Post

Are you serious? Please tell me this is a joke?


mankypin


Dec 12, 2006, 8:05 PM
Post #23 of 41 (5092 views)
Shortcut

Registered: Nov 3, 2005
Posts: 34

Re: [asclepius] Ames Ice Hose, Colorado BOLTED? [In reply to]
Report this Post
Average: avg_1 avg_2 avg_3 avg_4 avg_5 (0 ratings)  
Can't Post

Whomever (Chuck, et al) bolted the ice hose. Everytime you stand up after sitting down to piss, each time your frilly undergarments get in a bind while you're playing field hockey and when your constant fear of reality causes loss of control of your bowels for the second time in a day; you will remember that you deflowered an unwilling and beautiful climb just like your cellmates in prison did to you. How does or did it feel to be bent over and drilled by total strangers who didn't even get to know you first? The Ames Ice Hose knows and feels your pain.


lexmark


Dec 12, 2006, 9:38 PM
Post #24 of 41 (5054 views)
Shortcut

Registered: Nov 23, 2002
Posts: 90

Re: [mankypin] Ames Ice Hose, Colorado BOLTED? [In reply to]
Report this Post
Average: avg_1 avg_2 avg_3 avg_4 avg_5 (0 ratings)  
Can't Post

Interesting that nobody seems to understand that the reasons people don't want the bolt are also selfish.


asclepius


Dec 13, 2006, 6:16 AM
Post #25 of 41 (4513 views)
Shortcut

Registered: Apr 20, 2006
Posts: 61

Re: [lexmark] Ames Ice Hose, Colorado BOLTED? [In reply to]
Report this Post
Average: avg_1 avg_2 avg_3 avg_4 avg_5 (0 ratings)  
Can't Post

Three new bolts, terrible.

I tried the Ice Hose couple years ago, I hadn't been out on the ice much yet that season, so I backed off and decided to come back another day when I felt better... both mentally and physically. I moved to the midwest the summer after that. I am going back to the Ouray/ Telluride area for the first time in a couple years in a couple weeks. I plan to try it again, I don't intend to clip any bolts. But I believe it will feel different, it is different now.

I backed off when I decided that I wasn't fit and mentally prepared to commit given the current conditions. I left it for another day... unchanged, the same as I found it. Exercising some judgement on my part, that is pretty selfish.

Respecting the style in which the first ascensionists completed it, that is pretty selfish too.

Were the first ascensionist selfish in not placing a bunch of bolt? Styles and ethics change over time. At the time the first ascent was done, bolts were not in the vocabulary. Respecting tradition, way selfish.

First page Previous page 1 2 Next page Last page  View All

Forums : Climbing Disciplines : Alpine & Ice

 


Search for (options)

Log In:

Username:
Password: Remember me:

Go Register
Go Lost Password?



Follow us on Twiter Become a Fan on Facebook