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aelita
Sep 20, 2002, 8:17 PM
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I know women can do pull ups, I've seen them do it, and on a good day I can maybe do one... but not from a hanging position. Its like I get halfway up and I get stuck and for the life of me can't pull myself up higher! (very frustrating) but I can lock off for ages in this position! I am not sure if this is lack of strength or what, but my partner (also a woman) who is a better climber than I has the same problem.
My male climber-buddies can't believe that neither her nor I can actually do a single pull up from the hanging position. We both climb fairly decently in the lower 10's. I lead 8's and 9's and 10a's on a good day, she leads up to 10b's and higher sometimes. Although we prefer slabby balancy climbs, we do overhangs, bulges and small roofs as well.
The weird thing is - it FEELS like its not the lack of strength, but... as if I just can't physically do a pull up no matter how hard I try. My partner tells me she feels the same way. Anyone had experience with this? I have read a thousand times that pull ups are not essential, but still, its frustrating, why can't I do one?
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mother_sheep
Sep 20, 2002, 8:24 PM
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Lucky me. . .I can do 3. My partner last night did 18 and that was after we climbed for hours. I couldn't believe it. I think I'm strong and I really don't weigh that much so I don't get it either.
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astone
Sep 20, 2002, 8:27 PM
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Many gyms have machines that allow you to do pullups with less than your body weight. This allows you to develop good form, which then gives you the ability to focus on building strength.
I've got my girlfriend on one of these machines. She'll be cranking out 3 sets of 10 full pullups before long!
Keep pulling down.
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airscape
Sep 20, 2002, 8:29 PM
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I have watched many woman climbers... and there are very few things more beautifull to watch climb... (Besides the fact that i am a man and women are beautifull to watch in any case) The reason being that when male climbers have a hard move to do, they usually just power thru it, But woman go thru the same moves with such finesse and style without using any really powerfull moves it's amazing.
I once saw this girl go up a really tough move that i couldn't do unless I really went all out with the power, i have no idea how the hell she did it so effortlessly...
Most women i know in any case can't do a single pull up.
I think more women should climb.... In fact I think more women should climb with me
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dune
Sep 20, 2002, 9:21 PM
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Look at it like this. It's like arm wrestling. You can be a good arm wrestler yet not bench press or curl very much weight. I've seen it many times and it's just weird. Certain powerfull moves that seem related in similar athletic motion sometimes just simply have no direct corrolation with one another. Pullup strength has remakably low impact on overall climbing ability, although some (certain climbs require it). And don't forget, there are two kinds of strength, dynamic and static. It's the static strength that helps most with climbing but it's the dynamic kind that helps most with pullups. Also, when doing pullups, you don't have the advatage of using your feet and twisting your body into it's most powerful pulling stance like you do when climbing.
That said, you could definately benefit from a bit of weight lifting. It will help your lockoff stamina and maybe extend your lockoff reach up a few inches. But don't worry if you never become a pullup queen, you're still a good climber, eh.
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yami
Sep 20, 2002, 9:47 PM
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I just recently got my first pull up! yeah me! I was pretty excited...anyway, the tip that helped me most was to use your whole body not just your arms. Concentrate on your entire body lifting you past the half way point (that's where I used to get stuck too) I think one of the most important muscles to concentrate on is the abs. It's all about coordination. I still can only do about 5 pullups in one set but hey that's better than none.
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fixxervi6
Sep 20, 2002, 9:54 PM
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Its more than your arms and abs, lots of lats in there too, depending on how you hold the bar depends on which muscles are pulling, the closer your arms, the more bicep and abs, the farther apart, the more of your back, even if you hands are so close together they touch, your back is still workin a little there, a strong back will help you stick to the rock, espicially when bouldering, and its good for climbs that make you lean outward.
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lilred
Sep 20, 2002, 10:01 PM
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Wheather you can or can not do a pull-up has no relavence to your climbing ability what so ever...I can do oodles of pull-ups and climb okay, but my partner Fi in Denver can only do one or two, yet she cranks 12's off the couch!
There is also a guy climber (a very well known climber) who can't do a single pull-up, yet he is elite in his class...(anyone want to help me out with his name???)
I use to be big into weight training. Mon, Wed, Fri upperbody, Tues Thurs lower...I took protein, supplements, you name it, I popped it...but my climbing didn't improve...I was SOOOO frusterated. Then, I realized climbing was more mental and spiritual to me, and I started practicing yoga and pilates (GREAT isometric excercizes, strengthens the core muscles, which are the most important) and I quit lifting. I lost about 5 lbs of bulky muscle, and my core strength shot thru the roof, and that was when my climbing improved...
You may want to check out Pilates and yoga...if your core strength is lacking, your external muscles will be weak as well...
Yoga is great for improving flexibility and also helps to prevent muscle tears...
PS...try posting this in the ladies room forum too!
Hope that helps!
-Meghan
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missedyno
Sep 20, 2002, 10:07 PM
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i can do pull ups... i can do crimper pull ups i can do 2 finger pull ups...
doesn't have much to do with my climbing ability though... i just like if i'm stuck using a crimper and it looks so small i can say "hey i can pull up off that" and that helps the mental block and i get on with climbing.
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cedk
Sep 20, 2002, 10:13 PM
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Aelita: I think maybe you just need to build up a bit more lat strenth. Do you have access to a gym? If so try and develop a workout that includes seated row, lat pulldown and assisted pullups. I'm not gonna suggest how many reps or sets you do because everyone has an oppinion. You can do some research and come to your own conclusion. I think that if you do your routine 3 times a week for 3 months though you'll be doing multiple pullups. The best time to do this is in the dead of winter when it's too cold to climb outside. Also be sure to work opposing muscles to avoid injury.
Your new strength will allow you to power through moves with the sloppy technique you'll have after 3 months off climbing and you'll never have to suffer the embarassment of not being able to do a pullup again. Good luck.
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grigriese
Sep 20, 2002, 10:15 PM
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I had my boyfriend install a pull up bar in our house and a couple of months ago I struggled to do one. I can do 5 now and I have definately noticed a difference when I climb steep routes. The other thing I've noticed is that when I do pull ups I focus my strength at my stomach muscles, even though it's my arms and back pulling me up it seems that my core strength is what keeps it all together. The reason I mention this is because I've noticed I now use that same focus of core strength when I climb and has really helped me a lot.
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farasnyl10
Sep 20, 2002, 10:24 PM
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I think there's a huge mental aspect to being able to do a pull-up, and just getting used to the feel of the movement. About six months ago, I would get on a pull-up bar and just hang there- no progress. I got so frustrated that I ended up just buying one of those telescoping bars that you can stick in your doorway, and everytime that I walked by in the course of a day I would give it a go, and I still wasn't getting anywhere. But---if you put a chair underneath, and just try to focus on the movement, and adjusting the amount of weight you actually have on your arms, you can make pretty fast progress.
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missedyno
Sep 20, 2002, 10:53 PM
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now i like to do figure eights, lower myself down from side to side, all sorts of spins on pull ups. but i don't want to do too many and get huge muscles... it's a novelty to me...
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sportgirl
Sep 23, 2002, 8:39 PM
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I think it is important for women to be strong. We need strong muscles and bones! Don't worry about getting big muscles - it takes forever and a ton of hard work to get those. You should be able to do some pull ups if you are climbing a lot. I can do about 8 good ones and have noticed that it truly helps on steep, overhanging routes. I don't get as pumped and can pull myself over some hard moves if my feet aren't in a good spot (like way under me.) I dont weigh a lot either, but it never hurts to weigh less and have more strength if you are trying to push yourself. Take some time in the gym to do lat pulldowns and assisted pull ups. Then, find a corner or something where you are comfortable trying pull-ups. Once you start doing them, you will find a challenge within yourself to see how many you can do each week...
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jmlangford
Sep 23, 2002, 9:07 PM
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Shouldn't this thread be moved to The Ladies Room?
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ecocliffchick
Sep 23, 2002, 10:33 PM
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I too struggled with my lack of pull-up ability. For four years I tried with little success (once I managed 3) Then I just decided, who wants to be able to do a pull-up? I mean, come on, how often are you on a route and all the footholds just disappear for an entire body length, and the rock is as slick as glass and you can't even smear - NEVER. If you want to improve your climbing strength, try bouldering steep routes. Now I can't do a single pull up and I'm climbing harder than I ever have. You can climb hard without doing pull-ups.
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jt512
Sep 23, 2002, 10:54 PM
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It would be interesting to know how hard those of you who can't do pull-ups are climbing vs. those of you who can do pull-ups. There may be a lot more important climbing skills than the ability to do pull-ups, but it's hard to see how the strength could hurt.
-Jay
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sportgirl
Sep 24, 2002, 5:40 PM
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Hey - I don't think that we should be discouraging female climbers from increasing strength. It Helps, regardless. I broke my ankle six months ago and during my recovery I intensified my upper body work out, including pull-ups. I can truly say that the strength has helped my climbing ability - I am able to lead pumpy stuff and overhangs where I couldn't before. Sure, a lot is in technique, but come on, there is definitley an element of strength in some harder climbs. I think the strength will help your endurance as well.
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aelita
Sep 27, 2002, 4:22 AM
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Hey everyone,
Thanks for all the feedback, this is very cool. So I did find a local gym here and they FINALLY fixed the assisted pull-up machine. My partner and I have decided to do two gym-sets a week - trail-running plus pull-ups and abs. We started this week but I found that doing that twice a week plus climbing twice a week in the gym plus climbing outside one or both days during the weekend is really tough! (hehe... I know, trying to do too much at once). The pull-up machine is awesome though, I'd never had a chance to try it since its been broken at the gym here for a few months! I think in a couple of months if I can keep up the twice a week routine I might be able to do a pull up!
I don't think strength training is bad, especially for women. In the last six months that I have been climbing, both my technique AND my strength have improved dramatically just from climbing as much as possible. Feeling strong gives me confidence on overhanging routes, but I am still putting a lot of effort into my footwork. I think being able to finally do a pull-up would be a good mental boost too We shall see!
Climb on!
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ecocliffchick
Oct 1, 2002, 1:28 PM
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To jt512 - when I was working hard at trying to do pull ups I could climb 10b's outside- but not necessarily consistently. Now that I've just focused on climbing more I have onsighted 3 10d's, 3 11a's and have been working mid 11's - and I couldn't do a pullup to save my life now.
I'm not telling women not to work on their strength, I'm just saying that I don't think pull-ups are the best way to gain climbing related strength- nor do I think the ability to crank out 20 pullups qualifies you as a strong climber.
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climberchic
Oct 1, 2002, 2:06 PM
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*Failproof way to increase your pull-up strength*
A good friend taught me how to do this and it can be done by anyone that can hang in a lock-off postion. This shouldn't be too hard as it takes much less strength than actually getting there. There are 2 parts.
Part 1- Strengthening Your Arms
1) Stand on a chair or step up on something until you can reach the pull-up bar (or holds) at chin level.
2) Grab the bar, lock-off and hang there. This will start to improve your finger and arm strength a little at a time.
3) Now slowly start to lower yourself in small increments and try to hang in each position (about 15 degree angles at a time).
4) Let yourself down all the way, but don't just hang on your arms (dead hang). This can cause shoulder damage in the long run. Keep repeating this until you feel that you are building up strength in your arms and want to start working on the "going up" part.
Part 2- Pull-ups
1) Repeat #1 and #2 in Part 1.
2) Now start to lower your self down in the first small increment. Pull your self back up.
3) Lower yourself down to the first, then hold, then the second small increment and pull yourself back up.
4) Keep doing this until you can no longer pull back up. Keep working from the angle you last left off.
Eventually, you will be able to lower yourself down lower until your are all the way down and can pull yourself back up.
Voila...one pull-up.
~Erica
jt512~Personally, I think pull-ups are important for certain types (roofs, steep) of climbing. When on steep routes at higher grades, it is very importatnt to improve your lock-off technique which can sometimes require two or one-arm pullups if the feet are bad. I know I couldn't even do one for a while, and after I worked on them using the above technique, my climbing ability increased.
However, as ecocliffchick said, it may not be necessary for everyone. I know one woman that is a very good climber and has wonderful technique, but she claims she can't do a pull-up.
jmlangford~She knows where the Ladies Room is. She may want this where she left it because it will then appear on the FP and solicit more responses. aelita~If you want it moved, let the forum moderator know.
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ramylson
Oct 1, 2002, 6:19 PM
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The best work out for climbing is climbing. Period.. sure, limited amounts of strength training can help, but it's not the end all method. Muscle mass is heavy, having to much can hinder your performance on the rock. Heck, there's even evidence within this post. Don't go for pure muscle mass, you'll recieve better results with toning. There are some excellent training ideas listed in "Performance Rockclimbing" (can't remember the authors) but I think it might be out of print.
Now, as far as pull-ups relating to women climbers. My girlfiend has been working on this a bit which decent results. In order to build up upper body strength (if you can't do a full pull up yet) would stand on a chair and start from the top position. Lower yourself as slowly as possible. Repeat. After awhile, you'll be able to do a single pull up. At that point, start doing slow pulls up wihtout lock offs. That way you're toning the muscle all the way through, instead of at one point. Frenchies (mention previously) are nice, but personally I feel they make "power points" instead of muscle all the way through. This method eliminates that potential problem. So, you do a slow pull up and a slow down. At this point, add pyramids into the workout. One pull-up, one minute rest, two pull-ups, one minute rest.. etc, until failure. Then, back down in the same fasion. Always helps to do this with a friend. Also, don't forget to work to muscles in opposition as well. We've been doing 2 sets up 15 push-ups as well, including core muscle exercises.
Oh.. women are better climbers typically because they use balance and technique, versus male climbers who will power through cruxes. I've seen my girlfriend cruise through portions of climbings that I'll have issues with. Yoga can be a benefit to anyone's climbing.. something to consider.
[ This Message was edited by: ramylson on 2002-10-01 11:22 ]
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