Yesterday I climbed my first v8, a longtime (well, summer long anyway) project. This was for me a moment of elation as i had been eyeballing it for several years and I considered it something of a milestone. It got me to thinking. I'm not sure i can really call my self a v8 climber yet after a first ascent. So the question i'm posing here is this: At what point can you start telling people that you climb at a specific grade? I know personally that certain types of route are easier for me than others...I might climb 5.10 on slab but be able to bust up an overhanging 11+/12 with relative ease. Is the first time you send the grade? The tenth? Or is it a percentage? Let me know what you think
I voted grades are bogus. You're in the wrong frame of mind (in my opinion) if you climb for grades.
Grades of course have their value. They help you judge your progress, help you explain a route and hopefully stop peoplef rom jumping on a wall and getting in way over their head.
Let m,e put it this way; your average chick down at the pub won't give a fuck if you can do a 5.13 or what ever.
I climb alot better than my partner (I have alot more technique and I'm stronger) but we climb around the same grades (5.11a's). He has to push himself alot more and takes him more attempts but can still do the climb.
We both consider myself the better climber and I will usually take the lead
A V8 problem is still a V8 problem at the end of the day. Congrats [/;)] I have my eye on leading an extreme overhang 5.10b at my gym, time will tell
IMO, you can call yourself a 5.whatever climber if you can consistently climb the grade without a protracted amount of projecting. Now, how much projecting is too much is a bit subjective but if you cannot consistently send in under 12-15 burns you are not climbing at that level, again just my opinion.
I personally find grades useful for being able to focus my efforts on climbs that are at a level I find enjoyable to climb. I prefer to climb around my onsite level, I just enjoy the experience more than projecting a route. Grades have there place but I wouldnt suggest making a grade your goal Just climb the best, most aesthetic routes you can, grades be damn.
Unless you are a top climber, grades are just something you spray to your friends about.
I meet an older hard man in the Red last year. He was responsible for bolting a lot of .12 and .13 in a local sport area.
I meet him while trad climbing at this relatively untrafficed trad wall. He was leading .7's and was having a great time, while also teaching another kid, who looked like he could climb in the .12's on sport. The guy said that the most important part of his day was enjoying himself, and making memories that last. After looking back on that moment, and the 5.whatever we were climbing, I can't believe the knowledge I picked up from a 2 hour conversation from this man.
Anyway, in the grand sceme, grades are good as judging your own ability and defining what is just to hard, that is all. Climbing with your friends, climbing fun routes, and making memories of the times is what counts.
Do this: go to a wall where you know nothing is to far above your head, but maybe has a grade you would not normaly try. Write down the directions, but don't look at the route discriptions, and leave the guide book at home. Just go there and climb what looks good. I promise a good time and you might climb harded by not limiting yourself.
I have to agree with the above mentality. I'm into climbing for the aesthetics and the pucker factor of climbing. The grades give me something to gauge my fitness but it doesn't really mean much to other people.
I personally find a smooth 5.8 or 9 in a beautiful and quiet area to be more fulfilling than a 5.11 in an over-populated area with a loud audience.
Some people climb for grades and some people climb for the experience
There were some kids at the gym where I work, they started climbing, enjoying themselves, then they started to get good, soon they were climbing high grades, then they started bashing other climbers and the routes they made/were working on.
No one climbs with these guys anymore, and they hardly ever come to the gym either.
I would recommend having your technical skills and climbing skills at about the same level, this makes for good all-around climbing.
I would recommend having your technical skills and climbing skills at about the same level, this makes for good all-around climbing.
What?
Can you explain the difference between technical and "climbing" skills? Because I don't get it.
Where I come from, if you climb, say, 5.11, you're climbing harder than 5.6- Thus, somebody might say you have more "climbing skill" than the 5.6 guy*. And 5.11 tends to be more technical than 5.6- trickier gear, trickier stances, tricker foot placement and body english- Ergo, if you're proficient at 5.11, then you probably have more "technical" skill than that 5.6 dude.
*But then, a 5.11 gym climber can have sloppy footwork and just campus shit while not even knowing how to clip, while an old codger who can't climb 5.11 can make a 5.6 hand crack look like poetry in motion. So clearly one has more skill than the other. Enter the same tried debate as to which guy that is... which will typically include the "grades don't matter" line...
...which will then drift into quoting Lowe, which will then drift into discussing the merits of slippers versus lace-ups, then the demons of gym climbers, global warming, Libertarians, Hummers and Majid...
YAY RC.COM!
Back to your previously scheduled "zomg grades suck/rule/rule at sucking" chatter...
climbing a grade i've never done before gives me a great sense of accomplishment and adds to the experience...plus it's a good way to help me push myself beyond what i think i can achieve. i think grades do matter to a certain extent, but i also believe someone should avoid climbing JUST to improve what grade they can send.
to answer the poll question, i'd agree with notapplicable. if you can't send grades consistently without trying more than 10 or so times, i think it would be a misjudgement to call yourself an x-grade climber.
when the chalk settles, it's how much you enjoyed climbing that matters.
First of all, this is really two questions and should be broken up into to forums. Do grades count? and At what point can you call yourself a Vx or 5.x climber?
I won't answer the first question because it is so overdone on this site.
For the second question, I have heard a few things. I have heard from "pro" climbers that it's 5 routes/problems before you can call yourself that. In my personal experience, if I do about 10 of a certain grade, I can usually start projecting a grade higher (boulder grades that is). I however, would never dream of calling myself (even to myself) a Vx climber if I had only done one problem at that grade, but a good milestone nonetheless. Also, I disagree with some other claims that it matters how many attempts before sending. Some of the hardest routes/problems ever climbed were projected for years/months. It shouldn't make a difference unless you're talking strickly about something like onsight level.
flint wrote:
Unless you are a top climber, grades are just something you spray to your friends about.
And if you're a top climber they're not? Some of the top climbers are the biggest sprayers out there!
Do grades count? It sounds like they do to you, and that is what should matter to you.
When can you call yourself a 5.blank climber. I'd say when you can onsight a grade with some consistency. That just comes from my personal love of getting out on fresh rock and challenging my mind and body.
This became a minor issue in terms of an Adult Climbing League at my gym. For purposes of handicapping, team members had to declare their grade (so that a 5.7 climber couls have as much fun/be as valuable to their team as a 5.12 climber). The problem is that a few people, either out of modesty or gaming the system, are rated too low and are subsequently gaining points way out of proportion to the norm. I have not seen anywhere an objective system, as exists in golfing and bowling, to handicap climbers so that those of dissrent abilities can climb together. I took it to mean "the grade that you can usually climb either immediately or after a few tries" as my grade...its not for bragging rights, its to give people an ideas what they can expect from you.--and to have a sense of improvement.
When can you call yourself a 5.blank climber. I'd say when you can onsight a grade with some consistency. That just comes from my personal love of getting out on fresh rock and challenging my mind and body.
I realize that's a personal opinion based on your own experience so I'm not going to attack you, but I respectfully disagree. We have to look no further then the handful of 5.14 climbers out there to see the problem with this argument. Most, if not all of them, project these problems and do not onsite at that grade. Are you saying you wouldn't be able to call them 5.14 climbers? If so, fine, but I think it's generally accepted to call this elite group 5.14 climbers.
I've talked to some high-level climbers about this very issue, and a couple of them thought that to say I'm a 5.blank climber means you can onsight that grade, anywhere on any type of rock, trad or sport. Thus, I call myself a 5.4 climber even though I'm comfortable leading 5.8 trad and can usually follow .10. This is because I refuse to lead some runout 5.5 friction climbs.
I'm not saying that's the way it should be defined, but that's the way some people do it.
This became a minor issue in terms of an Adult Climbing League at my gym. For purposes of handicapping, team members had to declare their grade (so that a 5.7 climber couls have as much fun/be as valuable to their team as a 5.12 climber). The problem is that a few people, either out of modesty or gaming the system, are rated too low and are subsequently gaining points way out of proportion to the norm. I have not seen anywhere an objective system, as exists in golfing and bowling, to handicap climbers so that those of dissrent abilities can climb together. I took it to mean "the grade that you can usually climb either immediately or after a few tries" as my grade...its not for bragging rights, its to give people an ideas what they can expect from you.--and to have a sense of improvement.
HAHAHAHA Sure thing. "Climbing League's". Ha ha! Whatever.
Holy crap, now I get it. This MUST be why Tommy Caldwell sawed his finger off.
To handicap himself for bowling..errr, climbing league. Do you all wear the same colored pretty pink or blue shirts?
All I know is watching a groups' "strong" 5.12 climbing leader (in the gym) drop gear and hang on a 5.8 at the local trad crag is highly satisfying. YMMV.
2 /
4%
[/;)] I have my eye on leading an extreme overhang 5.10b at my gym, time will tell 
and some people climb for the experience
Some of the top climbers are the biggest sprayers out there! 
1
