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hosh
Sep 17, 2007, 6:04 AM
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Has anyone been brave enough to get any of the new Aliens? Doesn't http://www.Tradrack.com still carry them? I was just wondering if anyone has had enough guts (or lack of sense?) to pick up and fall on the new ones? I still love Aliens, but I can't really bring myself to buy them...
hosh.
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fenderfour
Sep 17, 2007, 3:43 PM
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yes. I have some offsets with the new nylon sleeve. I use them for aid climbing. No whippers, but they have held bounce testing just fine.
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CaptainPolution
Sep 17, 2007, 9:06 PM
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I actually ordered some from mtntools but it was going to take like a month or something to get them so I canceled the order. Good luck!
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gblauer
Moderator
Sep 17, 2007, 9:43 PM
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I had my old aliens tested and they are back on the rack.
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gimmeslack
Sep 17, 2007, 11:07 PM
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I just bought four brand new shiny Alien Death Cams.
Couple of weeks ago I borrowed a friend's and it was love at first sight.
Maybe I won't fall. Really.
Gumby death awaits me I suppose...
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hosh
Sep 18, 2007, 12:23 AM
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Yeah, but has anyone taken a fall on the new Aliens? Or tested them substantially? I really like Aliens, and would like to be able to trust them again, since they're such great cams (QC issues aside).
hosh.
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krosbakken
Sep 18, 2007, 1:34 AM
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gblauer wrote: I had my old aliens tested and they are back on the rack.
Where did you have that done? Or did you do it yourself?
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gblauer
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Sep 18, 2007, 2:32 AM
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I sent the aliens to CCH and they stress tested them for free.
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joeforte
Sep 18, 2007, 2:38 AM
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Oh boy
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spoon
Sep 18, 2007, 3:18 AM
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someone correct me if i'm wrong. wasn't one of the more recent failures a cam that had been stamped tested by cch?
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vegastradguy
Sep 18, 2007, 4:06 AM
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gblauer wrote: I sent the aliens to CCH and they stress tested them for free.
i wouldnt rely on that test- or anything that cch is doing, really. better to find someone else to test them- maybe Fish?
or bounce test them nicely somewhere close to the ground (i did this for the one new hybrid alien i own)....
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Points
Sep 18, 2007, 4:12 AM
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If you don't mind my inquiring, who/what is Fish?
Nevermind, I had forgotten the, don't be stupid and do a forum search first rule.
(This post was edited by Points on Sep 18, 2007, 4:19 AM)
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vegastradguy
Sep 18, 2007, 6:17 AM
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Points wrote: If you don't mind my inquiring, who/what is Fish? Nevermind, I had forgotten the, don't be stupid and do a forum search first rule.
http://www.fishproducts.com/
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hosh
Sep 18, 2007, 8:17 AM
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The only Aliens that I own that were affected by the recall were tested. I happen to have a friend who owns some fancy pants equipment and he agreed to test them for me. They're back on the rack as well, but I find myself a little slow to use them even still... Again, has anyone fallen on the new ones...?
hosh.
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cellardoor
Sep 18, 2007, 2:37 PM
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I haven't fallen on the new ones yet, but just as a suggestion, i tested all my old ones by placing them above a bomber nut or in a couple cases, a random sport bolt and wipped on them. All of them held various medium sized wippers so i concluded that they were not defective. I probably won't need any new cams until next season (or if a sale hits, then of course i'll need more ). So if anyone has any, try that and report back.
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notch
Sep 19, 2007, 8:18 PM
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gblauer wrote: I sent the aliens to CCH and they stress tested them for free.
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NSFW
Sep 19, 2007, 10:57 PM
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notch wrote: gblauer wrote: I sent the aliens to CCH and they stress tested them for free. I've seen a number of people post this and I just can't get my head around it. If you can't trust a company to quality control a product the first time, how can you trust the same company to do a stress test? I want to hear from the person who's sent their cams back to CCH and been told they've failed. From what I've heard, every cam CCH has tested has passed. Possible? Sure. Likely? I'm not nearly as certain...
They had a QC issue, and maybe they didn't handle it as good as they could have at first indication. It happens a lot in manufacturing. But for every instance of a company not reacting sufficiently for any given issue there are 1000 of someone over-reacting to something innocuous. They're trying to avoid both, and it's not as easy as it may seem. Unfortunately only in hindsight can you be sure of the correct path. It can be difficult on the other side of the fence... it's probably easier to sit on this side and make assumptions and accusations.
Did they fuck up? Sure. But does that mean that I don't trust that they pull tested something that they said they did? No. Pull testing isn't rocket science and I don't believe that they are so morally evil that they would just say they did for the hell of it.
Now, would I climb on them even after they've been pull tested? That's a different question for a different thread.
(This post was edited by NSFW on Sep 19, 2007, 10:58 PM)
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renneberg
Sep 20, 2007, 1:09 AM
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I have tested many "New Aliens" Stamped tested etc. Photos of the test have been posted here and on Supertopo. FISH agrees with and supports the test.
I have had 2 fail early, 1100# and 1200#.
Not cool. Dave now posts that the he does not approve of the test.... I bet he does not!
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notch
Sep 27, 2007, 4:15 PM
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NSFW wrote: notch wrote: gblauer wrote: I sent the aliens to CCH and they stress tested them for free. I've seen a number of people post this and I just can't get my head around it. If you can't trust a company to quality control a product the first time, how can you trust the same company to do a stress test? I want to hear from the person who's sent their cams back to CCH and been told they've failed. From what I've heard, every cam CCH has tested has passed. Possible? Sure. Likely? I'm not nearly as certain... They had a QC issue, and maybe they didn't handle it as good as they could have at first indication. It happens a lot in manufacturing. But for every instance of a company not reacting sufficiently for any given issue there are 1000 of someone over-reacting to something innocuous. They're trying to avoid both, and it's not as easy as it may seem. Unfortunately only in hindsight can you be sure of the correct path. It can be difficult on the other side of the fence... it's probably easier to sit on this side and make assumptions and accusations. Did they fuck up? Sure. But does that mean that I don't trust that they pull tested something that they said they did? No. Pull testing isn't rocket science and I don't believe that they are so morally evil that they would just say they did for the hell of it. Now, would I climb on them even after they've been pull tested? That's a different question for a different thread.
Not suggesting they're evil, just perhaps incompetant. Knowing nothing of pull testing, my thought is, "How do I know they're doing that right?"
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j_ung
Sep 27, 2007, 4:52 PM
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NSFW wrote: They had a QC issue, and maybe they didn't handle it as good as they could have at first indication. It happens a lot in manufacturing. But for every instance of a company not reacting sufficiently for any given issue there are 1000 of someone over-reacting to something innocuous. They're trying to avoid both, and it's not as easy as it may seem. Unfortunately only in hindsight can you be sure of the correct path. It can be difficult on the other side of the fence... it's probably easier to sit on this side and make assumptions and accusations.
Given the available information, which by now is pretty much everywhere, that's ridiculous to the point of being very ridiculous. I had to re-read it several times to make sure it said what I thought it said. To write criticism off as 20/20 hindsight is is completely incorrect. Most of sat and watched as CCH made error after error, resisted the truth and damned near killed people all while ignoring advice from pretty much everybody who gave it.
You understand that units marked tensile tested by CCH have been documented failing at unacceptably low loads, right? I'll believe Russ Walling over Dave Waggoner any day.
In reply to: I don't believe that they are so morally evil that they would just say they did for the hell of it.
Neither do I. But, I for damned sure believe they're incompetent enough to think they tested something they didn't actually test and then send it back with their little seal of approval.
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cracklover
Sep 27, 2007, 5:06 PM
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notch wrote: Knowing nothing of pull testing, my thought is, "How do I know they're doing that right?"
You don't. But their screwup rate is still very low. So their chances of screwing up twice is infinitessmaly low. It's simple math. If they screwed up 1/5,000 cams, your chance of having a faulty cam is 1/5,000. If you send that cam in for testing, and the tester forgets to test 1/5,000 of the cams that come in the door, your chances of getting a faulty and untested cam are 1/5000*5000, or 1/25 million.
Oh, and I didn't send any of mine or my friends' in. I tested them all myself, personally, to around 5kN. :)
GO
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sevrdhed
Sep 27, 2007, 5:13 PM
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Don't worry Hosh, if some of the new cams fail in a fall, you'll be sure to hear about it here. Having not seen any 20000 page threads about Aliens recently, I'll assume that they haven't hurt anyone yet.
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shimanilami
Sep 29, 2007, 6:17 AM
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The only complaint I have is that they're harder to find nowadays. I've been waiting months for Mountaintools to send me a yellow (to complete my third set).
The new ones are sweet. The nylon sheath and the solid wires are clear improvements. And they all catch falls just fine.
And if you don't trust them, then STFU and buy something else.
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vegastradguy
Sep 29, 2007, 7:00 AM
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shimanilami wrote: The only complaint I have is that they're harder to find nowadays. I've been waiting months for Mountaintools to send me a yellow (to complete my third set). The new ones are sweet. The nylon sheath and the solid wires are clear improvements. And they all catch falls just fine. And if you don't trust them, then STFU and buy something else.
dude, call Desert Rock in Vegas- Travis has like...4 full sets of them just hanging on his wall, including hybrids. I'd bet Neptunes and Rock and Snow also have a bunch. The last time I was in the Mountain Shop in the Valley, their racks were full. getting Aliens is not a problem these days because not very many people are buying them anymore....
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