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findaway
May 9, 2002, 1:27 PM
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Recently I was fortunate enough to stumble upon some amazing boulders in the middle of nowhere. The problem is a couple of really nice problems have some sharp rocks underneath them. We really want to try these problems but nobody wants to get impaled so I was wondering about the techniques/ethics of clearing landings.
Keep in mind that access is not a problem, nobody even knows about these boulders so it's really up to us how much we want to clear and how. I want safe landings but I kinda cringe at the idea of a couple of the guys I know (who so far havn't been told the exact location) lugging up sledgehammers and pick axes hell bent on demolishing anything in thier way. I'm looking more towards trimming a few branches (no major cuts) and rolling whatever rock we can out of the way.
Thanks for any suggestions or advice, I really want some different points of view.
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sauron
May 9, 2002, 1:59 PM
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Lots of crash pads.
- d.
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verticallaw
May 9, 2002, 4:19 PM
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just because know one knows about it does not mean that no one cares if you modify the surrounding area. I think you should ask the people resopnsible for the area and not us
Good luck
Mike
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findaway
May 9, 2002, 4:42 PM
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To the best of my knowledge nobody is responsible for the area. It is not on any private property, it is just in the middle of nowhere. Newfoundland hills, owned by no one yet just accessible enough to make for some awsome bouldering.
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killclimbz
May 9, 2002, 4:45 PM
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There are a few things you can try. Rolling the rocks away is not such a bad thing. After all they probably dropped there in the first place. Consider how it is going to effect the appearance of the area and where you are going to move the rock to. It should look natural to the untrained eye.
Branches, I don't know if this will work for you, but you may be able to try it. I have a traverse problem at a state park that I like to work out on early season. The problem was that some tree branches were growing into the traverse and making it a pain. I didn't want to cut the branches, so I took some climbing tape and taped the branches back to the main part of the trunk. The next season I removed the tape and the branches were growing away from the rock. Problem solved and no damage to the vegetation. Hopefully this may work out for you.
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djpuckle
May 9, 2002, 6:04 PM
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I would say sledgehammer = bad idea sence this will ring loud and echo far far away. Not to mention the little tiny pieces of rock flying everywere (And into the eyes). and it probubly won't level anything good enough. I've tried it.
But an axe with a little hook thingy on the back is a great idea. you can use it to dig around the 'problem rock' and then to lever it out. When moving these things LEVERS work better then anything! makes it soooo much easier to just roll the rock away away.
Happy trail making!
-Sean
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bmgard
May 11, 2002, 7:32 AM
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I agree that you should find a way to get around doing any permanent damage to the area. Crash pads and good spotters can go a long way towards making things safe. I don't like the idea of sledgehammers breaking up rocks. Seems like that is along the same lines as chipping. If you do decide to move some stuff around try to make it look natural, try to fill in the holes where the rocks where so the area doesn't start eroding.
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apollodorus
May 11, 2002, 8:35 AM
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Moving rocks around sounds fine to me. If you have to dig some of them out, still ok. If you want to pile sand and gravel at the base, why not? Pruning trees and bushes is probably good for them.
I would hold back on the sledge hammer and dynamite, though.
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gumby
May 11, 2002, 8:46 AM
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You can rent or buy a "come-along". They work wonders moving rocks. I would imagine that any rental center would have one to rent. Leverage and a mechanical advantage go a long way.
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crux_clipper
May 11, 2002, 11:09 AM
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If it's making it safer for other climbers, then do so. Just take some shovels and rakes, dig out the rock, fill 'em up, and rake it level again.
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offwidth
May 12, 2002, 2:45 AM
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I would leave it alone and bring a couple people that know how to spot!
Cleaning the landing area around boulders is becoming a big sore spot with a lot of land managers, at least in the States, and is a leading threat to future climbing access.
There are many classic problems with bad landings. For some people, a potential bad landing is part of the appeal. If the problem is too scary now, just come back to it when you are stronger and you really trust your spotters.
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mr_gondola
May 12, 2002, 3:22 PM
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As far as I understand it, it's okay ethcally to clear the landing if you are taking the FA. If it's an established route, you are obligated to tackle it the same way they did,...with a bad landing.
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lodi5onu
Aug 20, 2008, 3:43 PM
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In the attached picture, the red rocks underneath the black boulder represent the rocks in question....Can I break/remove these rocks in order to make a sit start out of this thing? They get in the way of the climber's legs. http://img179.imageshack.us/...9/6145/bldrexnw8.png
(This post was edited by lodi5onu on Aug 20, 2008, 3:49 PM)
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chossmonkey
Aug 20, 2008, 5:59 PM
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lodi5onu wrote: In the attached picture, the red rocks underneath the black boulder represent the rocks in question....Can I break/remove these rocks in order to make a sit start out of this thing? They get in the way of the climber's legs. http://img179.imageshack.us/...9/6145/bldrexnw8.png
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kyleshea
Aug 20, 2008, 8:51 PM
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its absolutely ok to change anything around that you like. as humans we are obliged to make everything on this planet, and others when we eventually colonize them, suitable for us and our own selfish needs. please dont ever think of dealing with the situation at hand as it is, it doesnt reek of anthropocentrism nearly enough.
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localshredder
Aug 20, 2008, 9:40 PM
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Take a come along with some chains to move any rocks out of your way. A razor tooth pruning saw will get rid of any branches, and you can use them to build up your landings. A pulaski and a shovel will help move dirt and chop roots to flatten out the ground underneath. Good luck. Also a step ladder will help get your new problems nice and clean. Scrub them well and brush chalk into all the holds before you start climbing.
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happiegrrrl
Aug 20, 2008, 10:26 PM
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....There surely "is" some sort of land manager responsible for the area, even if the OP doesn't want to accept that fact. If not - then hell - free land! He ought to go set up a homestead and see how far that idea goes.
But for simple practical purposes in the project he questions, he should know that very(very very) often rocks that are jutting out of the ground are like icebergs. What you see is just the tip.....
We removed an "ankle-breaker" from the cliffside trail just past the tree on the left of the "Welcome to the Gunks" route a few weeks ago. The exposed section was about the size of a basketball(shaped like an iron). I started to dig, and then dug some more. And then I came upon an offshoot that I couldn't tell if it was part of the same rock or another one wedged in tight next to it.....
Finally we hooked up the griphoist to it, when we saw it was probably about the size of a dorm room fridge, and began cranking.
Eventually it came out....but sheez.... It was a BIG mutha. hahahah.....It's set there at the side of the trail as a slope erosion blocker now. Big enough for two people to sit on and have lunch.
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kriso9tails
Aug 20, 2008, 10:41 PM
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chossmonkey wrote: lodi5onu wrote: In the attached picture, the red rocks underneath the black boulder represent the rocks in question....Can I break/remove these rocks in order to make a sit start out of this thing? They get in the way of the climber's legs. http://img179.imageshack.us/...9/6145/bldrexnw8.pngNo. Its only bouldering.
It's only bouldering?!?! The world needs boulderers. Why, it's mentalities like that that will cause the children of toque (beanie) manufacturers to go hungry. Why do you hate children?
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kriso9tails
Aug 20, 2008, 10:53 PM
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happiegrrrl wrote: ....There surely "is" some sort of land manager responsible for the area, even if the OP doesn't want to accept that fact. If not - then hell - free land! He ought to go set up a homestead and see how far that idea goes.
Meh. It's probably crown land. It's quite likely that such land could be used and lightly developed for bouldering without anyone noticing. Still, I imagine in six years that the OP has pretty much done or not done whatever they decided was appropriate already.
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patmay81
Aug 20, 2008, 11:09 PM
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if accessibility is good enough you should think about a pneumatic jack hammer
oh yeah, i didnt even notice the time span... oh well
(This post was edited by patmay81 on Aug 20, 2008, 11:20 PM)
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lodi5onu
Aug 21, 2008, 11:42 AM
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lodi5onu wrote: In the attached picture, the red rocks underneath the black boulder represent the rocks in question....Can I break/remove these rocks in order to make a sit start out of this thing? They get in the way of the climber's legs. http://img179.imageshack.us/...9/6145/bldrexnw8.png
no, I just posted this here so as to not create a new thread. It's a current issue
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patmay81
Aug 21, 2008, 9:06 PM
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its hard to tell whats going on (scale wise) base on your microsoft paint drawing. can you do a sit start with a knee bar or heel hook?
I have a couple of bouldering problems where I'm at that have rocks at the base, one is perfect to put my heel on and I rock up into a knee bar to reach for the crimp at the edge of the cave. Something like this could work if there is enough room to USE the rocks at the base as part of the climb.
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