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havard
Apr 3, 2009, 7:00 PM
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Am I the only one that climbs harder outside than in the gym? norwegian winter makes rock climbing outdoors impossible for 4-5 months, and then I go to the gym. And I headpoint alot harder outdoors than I redpoint in the gym, and that's a bit strange, since most of my buds have it the other way around..
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talia
Apr 3, 2009, 7:13 PM
Post #52 of 95
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I find that gym climbing is more social than anything. You meet a bunch of different people, find new partners, and can make plans to work out or climbing plans for the following weekend.
For me, the gym helped to build my technique, strength and confidence. I went climbing outside for the first time last summer and I was petrified of multi-pitch climbs and just being so exposed, but i also lacked confidence in my climbing abilities. In the past year, I've become such a better gym climber and I have hopes of that confidence transferring to outside climbing.
Gym climbing is frustrating sometimes though because i have more bumps and bruises from plastic holds than anything. I'm also more terrified to lead climb in the gym than I am outside. I've been outside once so far this season and it was awesome. I did my first trad lead on a 5.5. Yea so what i can climb 5.11c in the gym...i'm more excited about my little 5.5 trad lead :o)
Gym climbing isnt for everyone...it just helps my head more...I'd much rather be outside any day of the week though 
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jaablink
Apr 3, 2009, 7:38 PM
Post #53 of 95
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ladyscarlett wrote: jaablink wrote: I have taken people out from the gym who claim to climb 12+. They could not follow 9 outside. They had a very difficult time staying on routes (no tape… ,hahah) and they were shaking once they got above 50 feet high or so (mental fucking breakdowns). They burnt out quick, tried to power through all the moves, over gripped everything, had a hard resting on holds to remove gear, couldn’t smear worth of shit, and had very poor footwork in gen. I have also taken people inside to a gym who learned outside. They lead any route they wanted fearlessly. Their endurance was astronomical compared to the local jocks ,( jock : “my forearms are pumped”) hahaha lol… jump to the blue floor... You are definitely describing me when my buddies first took me outside, not that I ever climbed anything about a 10, gym or otherwise. That being said, once I went outside, realized what I needed to improve upon, I was able to go back to the gym and train...for the next time outside. There are gym rats who are just waiting to get their outdoor cherry popped! I can confidently say that if it weren't for the gym, I know that I wouldn't be able to physically keep up with my outdoor buddies. I'm a weak weak girl, who needs constant maintenance to keep the body physically able to climb. My Buddies laugh at me, but suffer my gym habits because it means that I am able to at least follow the routes they want. Somehow it's just not as easy for me to stay in climbing shape as it is for them. Looking at my winter habits, I could say that I'm a gym rat. That being said, the time spent on a gym wall means less time stuffing my face with pastries - a definite plus! However, outdoor season is here! Huzzah for outdoor mountain time!!! my 2p ls
I don’t have a problem going to the gym on occasion. I saw an earlier post about Go Vertical . I am friends with and know the owner many years now. Once or twice a year I drive the 2 hours down there , run laps around the gym, and on the overhangs. Though going to a gym is usually my last resort. There are too many other options. I don’t even mind going for long runs, muddy bike rides, or swims when its raining .
The times I have taken climbers out from the local gym, who were the “strongest ”or the owner told me they showed good potential. I was more disappointed with their attitude than with their ability. I knew before I brought them out, that they would not be able to pull the high grades they pull in a gym, it takes time to undo the bad form they learned.. I needless to say I am very despondent about training gym climbers . I have been mostly giving instruction to women who are as far as I am concerned better and more graceful hands down . They seem to have a cleaner mind . They tend to focus more on form and technique - and because of this , they excel at and astounding rate, as well as being so much nicer to look at.
I was contacted by someone on partner find not to long ago. He wanted to eventually get into trad climbing. He had been out climbing before , so I started him on some easier climbs to get an idea where he was at…that first day he had a very difficult time with it all. I took him to a bouldering area and showed him some long slab traverse problems. Later that week I showed him another area with more slab to vertical problems. I met up with him yesterday and it was very apparent that he had been practicing. His footwork improved 10 fold and he ran up a 80’ 5.6 5 or 6 times, each time cleaner than the last. This kid is an out door kid. He does other outdoor activities and shows a respect for his environment. Most of the gym born climbers I ever met just want to compete with everyone, or think they are better than everyone because they can pull hard on plastic. They come outside and chalk ball all the holds, hangdog, have no respect for local ethics, and conspire to place bolts everywhere and have been….I have been finding new bolts everywhere. Its sad to think that this new breed of climber coming from the gyms is going to take the adventure away from many generations to come. They don’t want to bring themselves up to the level of the rock and environment they are in . They want to change it to suit them. That is what I see coming out of the gyms around here these days. So I am sure my opinion is predigest.
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nthusiastj
Apr 3, 2009, 7:41 PM
Post #54 of 95
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havard wrote: Am I the only one that climbs harder outside than in the gym? norwegian winter makes rock climbing outdoors impossible for 4-5 months, and then I go to the gym. And I headpoint alot harder outdoors than I redpoint in the gym, and that's a bit strange, since most of my buds have it the other way around..
I'm the same as you. I onsight outside, the same grade I have to work in the gym.
I think it's a matter of caring. I really don't care if I onsight the pink arete route.
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IsayAutumn
Apr 3, 2009, 7:43 PM
Post #55 of 95
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If it weren't for climbing gyms, sadly, I probably wouldn't be a free climber at all. Even in a mild climate like DC, there are at least 4 months out of the year when you really can't climb outside on rock. Plus, I am a cubicle jockey and can't climb outside after work.
Given how frustrated I get when I can't climb something I think I *should* be able to, I would have quit long ago. But since I can train in the gym after work and in the winter, I'm much stronger for the start of the outdoor season and for my weekend warrior trips.
Plus, if you can't climb outside, gym climbing > anything else you can do on a weekday night with your clothes on.
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krusher4
Apr 3, 2009, 7:56 PM
Post #57 of 95
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Parkerkat wrote: I'm willing to bet most of those who trash gyms so bad are those who live in the best climbing locations... like some of the posters...well at least one is from colorado, where there is shitload to climb... so why go to a gym when outside access is so easy! Many times they don't take into account that most of us are stuck in places with very little access to decent climbing and therefore Need the gym in order to scatch the climbing itch. To use arguments like people in a gym think they can climb 12s then go outdoors? well..thats not the gym's fault, thats just stupidity on behalf of said over confident climber. I for one, Need the gym, given I can't get on real rock as often as I like.. I've even grown to love it as the community is great, I've learned a lot from harder climbers then I and there's beer right down the street for afterwards!
well I made the choice to MOVE to a great climbing location Boulder, CO....it wasn't too hard to put my crap in a van and drive out.
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havard
Apr 3, 2009, 8:02 PM
Post #58 of 95
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angry wrote: havard wrote: Am I the only one that climbs harder outside than in the gym? norwegian winter makes rock climbing outdoors impossible for 4-5 months, and then I go to the gym. And I headpoint alot harder outdoors than I redpoint in the gym, and that's a bit strange, since most of my buds have it the other way around.. I can climb 12a, and sometimes, very rarely 12b in the gym. I've sent 13a trad. I think the gym is hard.
Funny, you're going to climb around me selling hotdogs while I fall off my hardest projects, but the difference indoor/outdoor is the same, one full number grade.
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Parkerkat
Apr 3, 2009, 8:03 PM
Post #59 of 95
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Good for you bud.. you are lucky but should not expect that others are capable of that same change. Climbing is the single biggest part of my life, but that does mean it completely trumps careers, staying close tothe ones you love, being close to family etc. For people like me, who have obligations it simply isn't possible to pick up right now and move, so I climb in a gym most of the time and head outdoors every possible chance. YOu cannot possibly expect anyone who wants to climb to change their entire life to do so in lieu of everything else they have. I make time to climb, and love it.. and perhaps one day I'll be able to do what you did.
See..the gym has become the whipping boy. Do you blame car for the crash? Nope, So stupid people coming out of gyms are not a product of the gym..they are simply stupid. They Exist, get used to it people!
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jaablink
Apr 3, 2009, 8:10 PM
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boadman wrote: I have to call bullshit. If they were actually pulling 12+ moves in the gym, they could do moves of the same technical difficulty outside. If it's a trad/sport issue, a strong climber who sucks at trad climbing will quickly become stronger than a weak climber who's good at trad climbing. Good climbers tend to train in the gym, unless they live somewhere that allows them to climb outside all year round. jaablink wrote: I have taken people out from the gym who claim to climb 12+. They could not follow 9 outside. They had a very difficult time staying on routes (no tape… ,hahah) and they were shaking once they got above 50 feet high or so (mental fucking breakdowns). They burnt out quick, tried to power through all the moves, over gripped everything, had a hard resting on holds to remove gear, couldn’t smear worth of shit, and had very poor footwork in gen. I have also taken people inside to a gym who learned outside. They lead any route they wanted fearlessly. Their endurance was astronomical compared to the local jocks ,( jock : “my forearms are pumped”) hahaha lol… jump to the blue floor...
First , good outdoor climbers who have an established concept of form , climb in the gym when they have too. They would rather be outside, and I do not consider them to be gym rats. They were not born in the gym, they were born to the rock.
I will take that bet. A gym born climber against an outdoor climber. The gym climber comes outside to learn trad in 2 weeks verses an out door trad climber. Who goes inside to sport climb. They should be able climb the same grade in their respective environments . So a 12 gym climber verses a 12 trad climber. 2 weeks to in each others environment to adapt…. What do you think the outcome will be? After the rat is retrained to use their feet and properly place gear strategically, do you really believe his mind will adapt to the an outdoor environment enough to pull high grades? (I think he would bitch out) Where the trad climber who climbs with on average 10 to 15 lbs of gear, no will have pre clipped draws and only a rope tailing behind and no fear… ya sure… go fish
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IsayAutumn
Apr 3, 2009, 8:27 PM
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Just because someone climbs in a gym does not make them a soulless rat that has no respect for the outdoors and is going to over-bolt every route he finds outside. Some people have no choice but to climb inside if they want to climb at all.
Also, it is primarily a matter of experience. If you spend most of your time training in the gym, then odds are you will pull harder inside than out. If you spend all your time working routes outdoors, then you'll be used to the kinds of moves outdoor climbs require and therefore will be better at them than a gym rat.
I also reject the notion that gym climbers will wet their panties when they climb outdoors.
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TJGoSurf
Apr 3, 2009, 8:31 PM
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The gym I go to has a picture of a sign from somewhere that says, "Outdoor and Indoor climbing are not the same sport". I'm sure everyone has seen it.
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jaablink
Apr 3, 2009, 8:31 PM
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I did not say everyone. I said most of the ones I met in this area… I have found the adverse on occasion in other areas. That generally reflected a good instructor.
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jaablink
Apr 3, 2009, 8:35 PM
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Love to stay and play . Its raining here. So I am going to Hot yoga class. Later gym rats….
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TJGoSurf
Apr 3, 2009, 8:36 PM
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IsayAutumn wrote: I also reject the notion that gym climbers will wet their panties when they climb outdoors.
Most will. Too many gym climbers I've taken outside cant perform the way they will claim to. And most never come back.
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zeke_sf
Apr 3, 2009, 8:38 PM
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IsayAutumn wrote: Just because someone climbs in a gym does not make them a soulless rat that has no respect for the outdoors and is going to over-bolt every route he finds outside. Some people have no choice but to climb inside if they want to climb at all.
If it weren't "gym rats," it'd be some other group of people the misanthropes of our sport would whoop on in order to feel better about themselves. It's probably just a watered down version of the "sport climbing is neither" mentality. I find it interesting somebody like Alex Honnold was a self-professed gym rat and yet probably climbs harder than anybody posting to this thread. I am positive that he climbs bolder.
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Parkerkat
Apr 3, 2009, 8:50 PM
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I would counter that by saying most people you bring to crag probably won't hop on lead and you'd probably scar them too into not climbing again... its the same shit, Ur just looking for a scapegoat here.
Gyms are a tool, a resource a priveldge for climbers to have. Young kids can try it out and find a passion, other can bolster their outdoor skills. Aparently even the dread Sharma started in a gym...
Most people who try climbing the first time get scared nd won't come back...that ain't the gyms fault.. I think in fact the gym does better to prepare you then nothing at all.... and some people aren't gonna drive out to a crag (I'm from a big city) just to Try it out.
(This post was edited by Parkerkat on Apr 3, 2009, 8:52 PM)
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TJGoSurf
Apr 3, 2009, 9:13 PM
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I don't force anyone to lead, and if they're coming right out of the gym I put them on a top rope.
And here is a great example, I took a girl outside she did well, way better than I expected. We went to the gym and she sucked worse than Superman Returns.
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cracklover
Apr 3, 2009, 10:24 PM
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havard wrote: angry wrote: havard wrote: Am I the only one that climbs harder outside than in the gym? norwegian winter makes rock climbing outdoors impossible for 4-5 months, and then I go to the gym. And I headpoint alot harder outdoors than I redpoint in the gym, and that's a bit strange, since most of my buds have it the other way around.. I can climb 12a, and sometimes, very rarely 12b in the gym. I've sent 13a trad. I think the gym is hard. Funny, you're going to climb around me selling hotdogs while I fall off my hardest projects, but the difference indoor/outdoor is the same, one full number grade.
Thank you, that image made me laugh very hard! I hope you don't mind, I pictured you with a viking helmet on. It only seems fair, since I gave Angry a hotdog stained apron to wear.
Reminds me of a joke:
Q: What did the zen buddhist ask the hotdog vendor?
....
....
A: Make me one with everything.
Cheers!
GO
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I_do
Apr 3, 2009, 11:15 PM
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brownie710 wrote: I_do wrote: All climbers I know (including guys who have done serious ice and trad and FA's and the whole shebang) enjoy the gym as well as climbing outdoors, Cheers Ido Not true, I'm a trad and ice climber and work 200 yards from a 50' climbing wall with multiple routes that i can use for free and can't stand going.
So refresh my memory, where did we meet again?
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caliclimbergrl
Apr 4, 2009, 1:52 AM
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I like climbing cracks and other than crack climbing one of the major things I like about climbing is that it's outside in the sunshine.
In my opinion, gym climbing and climbing are two completely different sports. I climb in the gym in the winter when it's raining, wet, and cold everywhere else. It's a social thing for me and my friends -- a chance to catch up and day dream about when climbing season will start again. I won't say I hate it, but it's nothing like climbing outside -- getting awesome jams in the cracks, placing gear, climbing pitch after pitch until you finally top out, enjoy the view from the top, and then hike back down. And I even like cragging MUCH better than gym climbing. If I had and unlimited amount of time to climb (i.e. I didn't have to go after work on week days) and the weather was always good, I would never climb in the gym. But I am glad they are there for the days when my time is limited and the weather sucks.
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herbertpowell
Apr 4, 2009, 3:54 AM
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Gyms just aren't much fun for me. I only climb in them when it is too hot to climb outside. I find gyms to be very boring. I usually only tolerate an hour or so in the gym before I have to leave. Gyms are really ugly too. I get blisters pulling on plastic holds. I prefer cuts and bruises to blisters.
In contrast, I can carry a heavy pack all day in the mountains, and wonder how the time went by so fast.
Sometimes I get strange questions in the gym too, like:
"What is that weird gear loop on your harness?" in reference to an ice tool holster.
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shockabuku
Apr 4, 2009, 4:07 AM
Post #73 of 95
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I like the gym. I get a regular climbing based workout, I get to meet partners and make friends, my kids like to climb there and it's a lot better place with a lot better people than hanging out at the mall. Sure, it's not outside, so what? I get outside when I can but working on a Ph.D. in physics doesn't allow for a lot of getting outside (of the building), much less climbing outside which is a minimum of 45 minutes away to the closest, decent, albeit small, climbing area. People who castigate gym climbing are no better than any other bigot.
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curt
Apr 4, 2009, 4:32 AM
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boadman wrote: I have to call bullshit. If they were actually pulling 12+ moves in the gym, they could do moves of the same technical difficulty outside...
Ha. Haha. Hahahahahahaha.
Curt
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jt512
Apr 4, 2009, 5:45 AM
Post #75 of 95
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jaablink wrote: boadman wrote: I have to call bullshit. If they were actually pulling 12+ moves in the gym, they could do moves of the same technical difficulty outside. If it's a trad/sport issue, a strong climber who sucks at trad climbing will quickly become stronger than a weak climber who's good at trad climbing. Good climbers tend to train in the gym, unless they live somewhere that allows them to climb outside all year round. jaablink wrote: I have taken people out from the gym who claim to climb 12+. They could not follow 9 outside. They had a very difficult time staying on routes (no tape… ,hahah) and they were shaking once they got above 50 feet high or so (mental fucking breakdowns). They burnt out quick, tried to power through all the moves, over gripped everything, had a hard resting on holds to remove gear, couldn’t smear worth of shit, and had very poor footwork in gen. I have also taken people inside to a gym who learned outside. They lead any route they wanted fearlessly. Their endurance was astronomical compared to the local jocks ,( jock : “my forearms are pumped”) hahaha lol… jump to the blue floor... First , good outdoor climbers who have an established concept of form , climb in the gym when they have too. They would rather be outside, and I do not consider them to be gym rats.
Remind me again why we are supposed to care about what you consider anyone to be.
Jay
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