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GunnerFrits
May 27, 2009, 1:29 PM
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Has anyone ever been banned from a gym for no reason?
I was told never to return to a local climbing gym, and when I tried to speak to the management about WHY I was told that I wasn't owed an explanation and that I needed to grow up and get over it.
I was under the assumption that even IF a member/non-member were to do something wrong, they should at least be warned beforehand. And if that behavior is not corrected, then a banning may occur. I have to this day never been given and explanation directly from staff/management/owner. I tried to call the manager and he told me that he didn't owe me an explanation. I tried calling the owner of the gym (friends with manager) to find out why i was banned and he won't pick up my calls.
Climbing is my passion so regardless of the inappropriate behavior of the manager I still would like to be a member of the gym.
Is there any action or recourse i can take to get back in the gym?
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roadstead
May 27, 2009, 1:38 PM
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GunnerFrits wrote: Has anyone ever been banned from a gym for no reason? I was told never to return to a local climbing gym, and when I tried to speak to the management about WHY I was told that I wasn't owed an explanation and that I needed to grow up and get over it. I was under the assumption that even IF a member/non-member were to do something wrong, they should at least be warned beforehand. And if that behavior is not corrected, then a banning may occur. I have to this day never been given and explanation directly from staff/management/owner. I tried to call the manager and he told me that he didn't owe me an explanation. I tried calling the owner of the gym (friends with manager) to find out why i was banned and he won't pick up my calls. Climbing is my passion so regardless of the inappropriate behavior of the manager I still would like to be a member of the gym. Is there any action or recourse i can take to get back in the gym?
You just don't get 86 for nothing... what did you realty do?
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coolcat83
May 27, 2009, 1:39 PM
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what happened?
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GunnerFrits
May 27, 2009, 1:49 PM
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To preface, me and the manager are not friends, we don't get along.
I had stop coming to the gym for about 3 months because i had money issues and didn't have enough to pay for membership.
The day i did have money, i went back in and paid for a day pass to climb. As soon as the manager saw me there, he flipped out and locked himself in the office for about an hour or so.
When i was done climbing, he approached me and said he spoke to the owner and said that they were uncomfortable with me being there (which is news to me because I was actually friends with the owner before). I left out of anger without asking why i was banned. But later i found out from the managers friend that the reason that i was supposedly banned was because i was either a thief or inappropriate in front of kids. When i found this out, i was shocked at the audacity of the outlandish claims and then i demanded justification for these assertions. I called the manager and his reply to me was "i don't owe you an explanation. Stop being immature, grow up and get over it," and the conversation ended like that, curtly.
I then tried calling the owner but he doesn't respond to my messages or ignores my calls.
To make claims like me being a thief or being inappropriate in front of kids would warrant some kind of proof, right?
Mind you that outside of the gym I climb with parents and their kids in their wall garages (since the banning), and I personally know the coach. I even asked the coach as an aside if i had ever been inappropriate in front of kids and he was shocked at the question. So i know those claims are bogus.
I get along really well with all the members in the gym and they always ask me to come back to the gym, or that they wish i was able to still climb there.
Should i start a petition?
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c4c
May 27, 2009, 2:16 PM
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find a new gym
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mturner
May 27, 2009, 2:26 PM
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Sounds like you should have got a better explanation. But starting a petition probably won't get you anywhere. If the owner and the manager want to be dictators about who they let in, then you probably should take their advice and just get over it...they're not likely to change.
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GunnerFrits
May 27, 2009, 2:50 PM
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mturner wrote: Sounds like you should have got a better explanation. But starting a petition probably won't get you anywhere. If the owner and the manager want to be dictators about who they let in, then you probably should take their advice and just get over it...they're not likely to change.
Well, members have given me advice saying that i should become a member of organizations such ABS or USA climbing so that they would have to let me compete at their gym, and if they didn't they'd HAVE to give an explanation to the orginization as to why i'm not allowed to climb in the gym.
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Johnny_Fang
May 27, 2009, 3:01 PM
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do you climb with a potato in your pants? that's gotten me almost kicked out of too many gyms to mention. the uncomfortable part is when i have to prove it's not a potato.
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acorneau
May 27, 2009, 3:41 PM
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While a warning/explination would have been the professional thing to do, you have to remember that a business can choose whom they do business with at will.
I'm sure you've seen the signs that say, "We reserve the right to refuse service to anyone." Well, they exercised their right.
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jt512
May 27, 2009, 4:22 PM
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acorneau wrote: While a warning/explination would have been the professional thing to do, you have to remember that a business can choose whom they do business with at will. I'm sure you've seen the signs that say, "We reserve the right to refuse service to anyone." Well, they exercised their right.
And of course those signs are complete bullshit, with no legal standing.
Jay
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Johnny_Fang
May 27, 2009, 4:24 PM
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classic
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vegastradguy
May 27, 2009, 4:25 PM
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GunnerFrits wrote: mturner wrote: Sounds like you should have got a better explanation. But starting a petition probably won't get you anywhere. If the owner and the manager want to be dictators about who they let in, then you probably should take their advice and just get over it...they're not likely to change. Well, members have given me advice saying that i should become a member of organizations such ABS or USA climbing so that they would have to let me compete at their gym, and if they didn't they'd HAVE to give an explanation to the orginization as to why i'm not allowed to climb in the gym.
at which point they'd say you were a thief and/or inappropriate in front of kids. although, in all honesty, i doubt the agreement with USA Climbing says anything about lifting bans- the gym owner can likely say- this person is banned from my gym and cannot compete here, and i doubt USA Climbing can/would do anything about it.
the reality is that its a private business and as acorneau noted, they have every right to choose who they let in the door- and they dont have to be polite about it, not to say thats good business, but thats their choice.
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majid_sabet
May 27, 2009, 4:26 PM
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Making gym manager or employee pregnant will ban you if you start been irresponsible dad.
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Gmburns2000
May 27, 2009, 4:46 PM
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jt512 wrote: acorneau wrote: While a warning/explination would have been the professional thing to do, you have to remember that a business can choose whom they do business with at will. I'm sure you've seen the signs that say, "We reserve the right to refuse service to anyone." Well, they exercised their right. And of course those signs are complete bullshit, with no legal standing. Jay
Huh? It's a private business. I'm not sure I understand your point.
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GeneralZon
May 27, 2009, 5:10 PM
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Especially if they are doods.
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drector
May 27, 2009, 5:12 PM
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GunnerFrits wrote: To preface, me and the manager are not friends, we don't get along. [snip] ... As soon as the manager saw me there, he flipped out and locked himself in the office for about an hour or so. [snip]
Wow. I think that the reason you are banned is because the manager is your sworn enemy and runs from you in fear. It's pretty obvious.
Now the next question is, why is the manager of the gym your sworn enemy. At some point, you were an ass and did some stuff that is unforgivable or he was an ass and did some stuff that, well, makes you unforgivable. So what did you do to make this guy hate you this much and run from you in fear? He is right about you or he is making stuff up but either way, something happened to start all of this. 'Fess up.
Dave
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brotherbbock
May 27, 2009, 5:15 PM
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GunnerFrits wrote: I was told never to return to a local climbing gym, and when I tried to speak to the management about WHY I was told that I wasn't owed an explanation and that I needed to grow up and get over it.
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camhead
May 27, 2009, 5:21 PM
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Gmburns2000 wrote: jt512 wrote: acorneau wrote: While a warning/explination would have been the professional thing to do, you have to remember that a business can choose whom they do business with at will. I'm sure you've seen the signs that say, "We reserve the right to refuse service to anyone." Well, they exercised their right. And of course those signs are complete bullshit, with no legal standing. Jay Huh? It's a private business. I'm not sure I understand your point.
uhhhh... Read the Civil Rights Act, or Americans with Disabilities Act, for one thing. Businesses can NOT simply refuse the right to anyone they want.
Oh, and to the original poster, how old are you, out of curiosity?
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petsfed
May 27, 2009, 5:22 PM
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Gmburns2000 wrote: jt512 wrote: acorneau wrote: While a warning/explination would have been the professional thing to do, you have to remember that a business can choose whom they do business with at will. I'm sure you've seen the signs that say, "We reserve the right to refuse service to anyone." Well, they exercised their right. And of course those signs are complete bullshit, with no legal standing. Jay Huh? It's a private business. I'm not sure I understand your point.
You can't refuse service based on race, religion, gender, etc. This, unfortunately for the business, means that you can litigate the business into giving you a good reason.
At the time of the "don't come back" phone call, they should've given a good explanation, followed by a "if you come back, we'll get the police involved" warning. It was the height of unprofessionalism to do otherwise. And this is typed from the desk of a climbing wall. If you have to punish somebody for anything, you have to tell them what they did wrong, otherwise they won't know not to do it again.
However, its not worth fighting over. Go somewhere else. If you get blackballed from the new gym over rumors of what you did at your previous gym, you've got a slander/libel case on your hands.
It sucks, but the amount of money and time it would take to fight this is probably well outside the resources of the kind of person who had to stop for 3 months due to money issues.
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Gmburns2000
May 27, 2009, 5:37 PM
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camhead wrote: Gmburns2000 wrote: jt512 wrote: acorneau wrote: While a warning/explination would have been the professional thing to do, you have to remember that a business can choose whom they do business with at will. I'm sure you've seen the signs that say, "We reserve the right to refuse service to anyone." Well, they exercised their right. And of course those signs are complete bullshit, with no legal standing. Jay Huh? It's a private business. I'm not sure I understand your point. uhhhh... Read the Civil Rights Act, or Americans with Disabilities Act, for one thing. Businesses can NOT simply refuse the right to anyone they want. Oh, and to the original poster, how old are you, out of curiosity?
That aside, to say that a business has no legal standing to keep people from frequenting the joint is a little extreme. Businesses certainly have legal standing to do so. It may not be all the time, but they can certainly refuse service.
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GunnerFrits
May 27, 2009, 5:42 PM
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There aren't any local crags near by and the closest climbing gym is pretty far. I can't just up and move yet, so if I want to climb my only viable option is getting back into this gym.
There would be no tension on my part. Even before being banned I had stopped going to the gym if I knew that the manager would be there. I didn't want any problems I just wanted to climb. Same thing now. I can overlook unwarranted banning, or set aside the slander they have committed. I JUST WANT TO CLIMB!!!
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Gmburns2000
May 27, 2009, 5:43 PM
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petsfed wrote: Gmburns2000 wrote: jt512 wrote: acorneau wrote: While a warning/explination would have been the professional thing to do, you have to remember that a business can choose whom they do business with at will. I'm sure you've seen the signs that say, "We reserve the right to refuse service to anyone." Well, they exercised their right. And of course those signs are complete bullshit, with no legal standing. Jay Huh? It's a private business. I'm not sure I understand your point. You can't refuse service based on race, religion, gender, etc. This, unfortunately for the business, means that you can litigate the business into giving you a good reason.
In some circumstances, you can. There are plenty of gyms in the Boston area that are for women only. There are plenty of schools that are for women or men only, too. They're private businesses and not only do they get away with it, but they thrive.
I don't have any good examples for the religious or race part, and to be clear, I'm not advocating such discrimination, but to say that it can't be done is not entirely accurate.
In reply to: At the time of the "don't come back" phone call, they should've given a good explanation, followed by a "if you come back, we'll get the police involved" warning. It was the height of unprofessionalism to do otherwise. And this is typed from the desk of a climbing wall. If you have to punish somebody for anything, you have to tell them what they did wrong, otherwise they won't know not to do it again. However, its not worth fighting over. Go somewhere else. If you get blackballed from the new gym over rumors of what you did at your previous gym, you've got a slander/libel case on your hands. It sucks, but the amount of money and time it would take to fight this is probably well outside the resources of the kind of person who had to stop for 3 months due to money issues.
I totally agree but professionalism isn't law. They probably should have done that, but that doesn't mean they were legally required to. I could only see them being legally required to state their reason if a judge ordered them to do so.
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c4c
May 27, 2009, 5:46 PM
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are you a minority or gay or fundy christian or something? if so we might have a case.
find a new gym.
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