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jefffski
Jun 21, 2003, 5:40 PM
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hey vtposer,
i think i saw you at the crag. you're the kewl dude whose dog sh*t on my rope! actually we all know you-you're the one with the boom box blasting awy while you and your friends top rope the hell out of the first pitch of the best multi pitch climb, beta your way up through the 5.11 crux with 10 hangs and then when you come down brag about how you 'sent' that one.
we don't like you vtposer because you give climbers a bad name.
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alpinestylist
Jun 21, 2003, 6:02 PM
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Ya'll sound like a pretty stodgy crowd.
Noone else has gone climbing blitzed before???
I believe it has a well documented history. My highlight list of stupid things I've done...
Drunk as shet passed out halfway up after six after having a gladiator solo race up it.
Soloing marathon on Lumpy ridge on mushrooms.
The herb comes and goes in my life, at times I've puffed every pitch (yes, multipitch). Others only back at camp. Pretty much don't know that it has ever slowed me down. Best memory is sitting on Awahnee ledge, totally vegatative, my sober partner laughing at my giggle as he handed me the rack for the top block. CTC 7 hours.
Not everyone is the same in regards to attentiveness with a buzz. We all know you get better with practice. To paint the climbing community as straight laced and sober is to suggest you aren't well traveled or experienced. Name me ONE campground where people aren't drinking beers in camp and burning at the crag?
I'm not advocating getting sloppy and dropping your partner. Or soloing and dropping the rack. But come on...
VTPoster, very much like your experience I remember having a few at the end of a day in Vedauwoo. As the sun was going down we rolled over to the Cupcake boulder with a nice buzz, steady nerves and good times.
Lighten up folks.
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grayhghost
Jun 21, 2003, 6:20 PM
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"Downward Bound" (the greatest climbing book ever) gives tips on how to haul wine up the Nose. Now how can you deny that climbing and drinking are not paired for eachother?
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vtposer
Jun 21, 2003, 6:21 PM
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I love all these holier than thou people who say "you give climbers a bad name" FU buddy! I give a F*CK weather or not you like me? I've met some great friends through climbing and most if not all drink and smoke and climb and we all have a blast giving climbers a bad name. what a joke. its people like you Jeffski that give climbers a bad name, quick to judge and care to much about what others think about you. and if I did have a dog I'd train him to sh*t on your rope.
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psych
Jun 21, 2003, 6:24 PM
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vtposer and others who admit to climbing blitzed, you're just doing yourself out of potential partners here, you realize this, right?
I personally love the 1 beer buzz, it's my salvation from work...but there's no WAY I'd do that before climbing, even just one beer. First off, halfway up I'd have to take a leak and I can't even imagine how that'd work. But secondly, my judgements would be just a bit off, not a lot, but enough that if I took a fall, would I do the right things?
Mike...
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alpinestylist
Jun 21, 2003, 6:53 PM
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If you folks are so quick to condemn me, or generalize and paint these conservative views of life, then dare I say sir "I would choose not to climb with you".
As far as "outing" myself to potential partners...there are very few of you whom I would enjoy getting out with. And any of them, while they maybe sober, aren't pompous pricks.
Besides...I doubt you could keep up. Take a look around, midnight lightning, the problem you'll fall off the first holds of if you ever make it to camp IV, was concieved while not "high on life".
Harding is a perfect example of living life and climbing.
If you people can't be COMPLETELY responsible for yourself and your actiions, yes even in a climbing situation, after just ONE beer,
then your noone I would count on with MY life.
I know there are times when you need to be completely sober when climbing.
As an example of NOT needing to be sober I offer the following...
I was soloing the Shortest Straw in 2000. I just climbed the pitch going into the grey circle when a rope snaps down at the bottom of the pitch. Some dudes on Zodiac had whipped, busted his wrist and needed help off. They offered some of life's finer pleasures if I helped. I joined their team (cuz when climbers ask for help, YOU HELP).
They fed me King Cobras, and filled my lungs with vile things. About three in the afternoon, completely wasted, I decide that enuff is enuff and we are topping out that day. I hop on lead, lead all the pitches to the top while they haul, and we top out at 11...but darn it by then I was sober.
Again, maybe in the world you live in, alchohol ruines you and any ability you have to function. In mine, it is sometimes just part of life and doesn't ruin me.
I don't drive drunk (but would if it weren't illegal.). I have climbed in all areas of climbing. I'm sure at one point or another I have enjoyed a buzz while doing all of them.
Soloing and herb go together like yin and yang.
I do not mean to insult or flame anyone, I just think to say anyone that drinks or smokes while climbing is a worthless climber is foolhardy.
I could go on and on, but I won't.
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flamer
Jun 21, 2003, 7:38 PM
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Alpinestylist,
I'd climb with you anywhere anytime....
Not because you drink/smoke or not....
Because you're a fun cat to hang around!
And I know that stoned or not, you'd never drop me.
josh
P.S.
I have an Idea for something NEW at Lumpy...thought you might want to come along for some "rehab"....I'll carry the beer!
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fieldmouse
Jun 21, 2003, 7:46 PM
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a lot of the more grievous lines on el cap and half dome were put up by tripping, coked-up, drunk ass potheads.
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jefffski
Jun 21, 2003, 7:47 PM
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we don't have a responsibility to each other? think about the camp 4 proposal in the valley. many respected climbers got on that one for us and kept the development away. i would think that if the 'establishment' believed that we were all drunken a*holes, their pleas would have been ignored.
vtposer--it's the likes of you that do us no good in the efforts to keep crags accessible.
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addiroids
Jun 21, 2003, 8:49 PM
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Geez, I didn't know there were this many climbers who didn't climb inebriated at least a few times a season. I don't smoke la buen hierba (good herb) but do drink occasionally mid day. Most of the time this is at Josh when we have climbed hard crap all morning, then just don't need to climb hard anymore, so just start drinking and start slab climbing. No, I never have nor never could climb at my level while drinking, but do climb below my level after a few beers. I don't get "drunk" but do get a good buzz. I also don't solo drunk just incase something happens I am not found with any BAC. The funniest time was when I showed up at HVCG at 7am, in February this year, it was cold as hell, so I started drinking a bit, and my friends started blazing. By 9am it was warm, and they were high as hell. Needless to say, I did the leading that day since they could barely even think. I am safe and don't get too impaired to affect my true judgement and respect the danger of stuff and when it comes to serious stuff, I don't screw around.
But we don't need these holier-than-thou people who say drugs and climbing don't mix. Again, a lot of our heros from the 1970's (you better respect them!) were wasted more than not. And they climbed harder then many of you or I could ever dream of.
TRADitionally yours,
Cali Dirtbag
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vtposer
Jun 21, 2003, 8:56 PM
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Right on! thats usualy what we do, after pushing the grades all day we chill for a bit in the shade, tie one on and then tie in and do some slab climbing. makes for a great ending to a perfect day of climbing.
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pehperboy
Jun 21, 2003, 9:23 PM
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No disagreement about booze and herb being in the mix of the climbing lifestyle, and no one's saying climbers should be Mormon-like. The reality is that goofs like vtposer, who think it's a hoot to climb drunk or stoned, are putting themselves and others at risk.
Drink and drug and party to your heart's content - after the climbing is all done. Climbing requires a 100 per cent commitment to safety - something that's not all that easy to practice at times. But going about it while impaired pretty much wipes out the commitment - never mind getting to 100 per cent.
And if someone like vtposer makes that choice to climb drunk or stoned, then I don't want to be around to witness the carnage or have to assist in a rescue. If I see him at the crag drunk and stoned with boom box blaring, I'm leaving to find another crag or coming back another day. :evil:
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teagueblue
Jun 21, 2003, 9:47 PM
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Yeah. What he said. No one should smoke cigarettes or drink coffee either. I actually prefer a high colonic before climbing. Then I may be a bit extreme.
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stickclipper
Jun 21, 2003, 9:53 PM
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I don't think this thread was about getting absolutely hammered or dropdead stoned and then going climbing. Climbers make their own decisions. If you can handle a beer at lunch or a couple of tokes and continue on, and if your partner's cool with it, then by all means, please don't go asking everyone at the crag if they're ok with it. Go ahead. Just know your limits. It affects all people differently.
You people who think that you can't climb because you've downed a cold one are pretty close-minded. You probably think soloing should be outlawed too, becasue "it endangers you and everyone else" and "it gives climbers a bad rep". Would you pass up having sex because you've had a drink or two? Oh, that's right, it probably makes you flacid. Here, let me see your girlfriend for a sec, I think I know what to do...
I think we all know that beer and weed have been with climbers all along. I wouldn't say that either substance HELPS. But in moderation, I don't think it hurts either. It's you and your partners' choice. Climbing is as safe as you make it. If you're not a reckless asshole, then you're doing fine. Climb on.
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jefffski
Jun 21, 2003, 10:24 PM
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In reply to: My partner is the one who buys the beer and packs the bowls man! One time I had him tie beers to the haul line so I wouldnt loose my buz as I aided over the crux roof. all you guys who say you get tippsy after one beer are either quears or lightwieghts or both. I can have at least a three and my fine motor skills arent effected, period. As for mixing pot and beer, I find that after a few chokers the beer really helps with the cotton mouth.
does this sound ok to you?
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smiley
Jun 22, 2003, 9:25 PM
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Well, all I can say is this: a friend of mine lost her brother because he was drinking while climbing, zipped his bivy all the way shut, and well, you know how it ends. The saddest part is, this is the kind of thing that we tend not to think about too much. It won't happen to us, that's the important thing. But she'll never have her brother back, an who knows but he was just one of the masses that figured it wouldn't happen to him.
I'd want to figure out what is happening that is creating the edge that the drinks are removing. I'm in agreement that maybe you're climbing above your skill level. I always harp on the same thing, but there *is* a difference between confronting fear and suppressing your natural self-preservation devices. If you need to increase your risk of injury through drinking in order to decrease the perception of risk, it's time to step back and realize this climb doesn't need to be done today. IMHO
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roninthorne
Jun 22, 2003, 10:59 PM
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In reply to: Oh man, when I see sh*t like this going on at the crag I prefer to find somewhere far, far away. I bring my first aid kit, pullies and static line for myself and the people I climb with - just in case. Don't want to have to assist in rescuing some drunk/stoned dimwit.
Hilarious... and pehperboy, please understand in advance that I am not singling you out, but simply responding to all the sanctimonious crap I've read here so far...
Why are you contriving this connection between drinking a beer or two (or burning some fat dank) and climbing, and accidents at the crags, when it is in fact the stone-sober folks who fall to the ground and go "boom" 99.999% of the time? (Buzzer sounds) Sorry, nice try, wrong answer.
In reply to: If it's just you and your buddies, climb on. But you put other climbers in a situation where when you have an accident they forced to take responsibility for your drunken (sorry "glow on") screw ups.
Oh, re-a-a-a-al-l-llly? If its just me and my buds, then we don't put anyone in any situation, do we? We choose to place ourselves in different perceptual context, is all, and accept the consequences, confident (from past experience rescuing other, sober people) that we can deal with them.
In reply to: And I for one don't want to witness a fatality - under any circumstances.
And again I say that you better stop hanging around with that non-drinking, non-pot-smoking crowd, bro... they seem to be the ones that die by the dozens, while climbing, rapping, and hiking in or out, every year, from Iowa to Everest.....
BTW- you folks ever heard of Warren Harding? Top the final drilling efforts on the mega-epic FA of the Nose before you go bashing someone who drinks and climbs, 'kay?
(No, I am not advocating getting housed and sending your testpiece... but I am a practicioner and a survivor of years of killing one 16 oz Guiness between three people, usually to cure the smokey burning in our throats, before going on to climb for another two or three hours, usually while putting up new routes for all you teetotallers to enjoy. No sweat off my belay device... to each their own.... but judge not and be ye not judged, as De Man sez....)
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roninthorne
Jun 22, 2003, 11:04 PM
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In reply to: If I see him at the crag drunk and stoned with boom box blaring, I'm leaving to find another crag or coming back another day. :evil:
Wow... talk about making it up from whole cloth... now, apparently, drinking and smoking at the crags automatically creates a boombox in your location, which is automatically and irrevocably set to max volume! Incredible!
And all this time I had no idea we possessed these powers....
And, BTW, jeffski- about 90% of the folks making decisions about your public lands and mine have drug habits (caffeine/nicotine/sugar) and livers that look like sea coral....
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mhr2000
Jun 23, 2003, 12:39 AM
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In reply to: If you people can't be COMPLETELY responsible for yourself and your actiions, yes even in a climbing situation, after just ONE beer, then your noone I would count on with MY life.
I'm going to assume you didn't actually mean this the way it sounds. This has to be the most idiotic statement I've ever heard so it can't possibly mean how it sounds. And I'm not trying to slam you, just begging for clarification here.
I'm going to assume this statement does not include people who don't or never have drank? Please tell me it doesn't include them.
Even so, alcohol affects everyone different and it's quite possible for even the most brilliant sober person to become a complete dumbass after one beer yet some people have no problem. I don't drink and when around people who are drinking it's very easy for me to see how they change even after one beer.
In any case, I won't be climbing with anyone who is smoking pot, drinking or intoxicated while actually climbing, but any other time it's none of my business they can do what they want.
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corpse
Jun 23, 2003, 12:55 AM
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Some ppl really are affected differently. One girl I knew couldn't study without being high - she smoked EVERY morning b4 school, and was deans list honor roll all 4 yrs. Although I enjoy some - I can't see belaying or any serious climbing while on anything. It would be fun to get a bit hammered or sumtin and do some top-roping.. There is LITTLE room to get hurt on a top rope. The key there I think is a sober belayer. Therefore, ya just need to maintain a nice ratio of nighttime db'ers - the Designated Belayer :-) Then again, it's all about exposure and risk - some ppl like the risk I guess - or maybe it brings them more peace in climbing with the rock if they are stoned.
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teagueblue
Jun 23, 2003, 12:57 AM
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Breath-a-lyzer and piss tests at the crags might not be a bad idea. I'm actually thinking about starting a new movement HWJC (How Would Jesus Climb?) I'm thinking of whole line of merchandise, chalk bags and stuff with HWJC emblazoned. Anyone interested? Let's all join hands....
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weaselman
Jun 23, 2003, 1:04 AM
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it seems like the safest way to climb while drunk would be unroped bouldering, as there is no ropework or knot tying.
but still, being drunk hugely impairs your judgement, so it's probably not smart.
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styndall
Jun 23, 2003, 1:25 AM
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In reply to: Breath-a-lyzer and piss tests at the crags might not be a bad idea. I'm actually thinking about starting a new movement HWJC (How Would Jesus Climb?) I'm thinking of whole line of merchandise, chalk bags and stuff with HWJC emblazoned. Anyone interested? Let's all join hands....
WTFWJD???
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overlord
Jun 23, 2003, 8:15 AM
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In reply to: it seems like the safest way to climb while drunk would be unroped bouldering, as there is no ropework or knot tying. but still, being drunk hugely impairs your judgement, so it's probably not smart.
but it includes spotting. maybe indoors with a noce thick crashpad.
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redpoint73
Jun 23, 2003, 11:05 AM
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Is this thread a f_cking joke?
If you need to ask fellow alcoholics for reassurance, then its obviously not OK.
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