|
ambler
Mar 31, 2006, 6:04 PM
Post #16651 of 22774
(520101 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Jul 27, 2002
Posts: 1690
|
In reply to: I just wanted to share some Mass Climber news with you all. An elated, exhausted and bruised Chris called me last night from the top of Epinephrine (2000', 15 pitches or so, 5.9) in NV, a route at the top of his Redrock to-do list. It seems he is having quite an adventure! At least he is walking away relatively unscathed after taking a big (35 ft??) whipper and decking on a ledge (after a hold broke) followed by a headlamp summit in the dark. Congrats Chris, come home safe! See ya soon!!
Looking forward to the TR.
|
|
|
|
|
core
Mar 31, 2006, 6:11 PM
Post #16652 of 22774
(520101 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Jul 29, 2003
Posts: 1102
|
I can't say with certainty, but I believe he said somewhere in the area of P3 or P4. The ledge fall didn't sound too severe, but nonetheless still scary!
I wonder if he has a new favorite cam...
|
|
|
|
|
notch
Mar 31, 2006, 6:36 PM
Post #16653 of 22774
(520101 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Jul 13, 2005
Posts: 599
|
In reply to: Good story, notch! The only thing that prepares you for leading is leading. At least TRing teaches you how to climb, but mock-leading is *counterproductive*! It teaches you nothing about leading that you can't learn better from just ground-school (practicing placing gear), but messes up your head for real leading. /rant GO
That's interesting. I'd like to hear other's opinions also. One thing I like about it is that it takes the question of where I'm going to place the gear. I agree with you though in that it doesn't change the mental game, for me it just takes at least some of the tactical thinking out of it.
|
|
|
|
|
ambler
Mar 31, 2006, 7:21 PM
Post #16654 of 22774
(520101 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Jul 27, 2002
Posts: 1690
|
In reply to: I can't say with certainty, but I believe he said somewhere in the area of P3 or P4. The ledge fall didn't sound too severe, but nonetheless still scary! I wonder if he has a new favorite cam... |
|
|
|
|
ambler
Mar 31, 2006, 7:33 PM
Post #16655 of 22774
(520101 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Jul 27, 2002
Posts: 1690
|
In reply to: In reply to: The only thing that prepares you for leading is leading. At least TRing teaches you how to climb, but mock-leading is *counterproductive*! It teaches you nothing about leading that you can't learn better from just ground-school (practicing placing gear), but messes up your head for real leading./rant That's interesting. I'd like to hear other's opinions also. One thing I like about it is that it takes the question of where I'm going to place the gear. I agree with you though in that it doesn't change the mental game, for me it just takes at least some of the tactical thinking out of it.
Then too, leading often is dangerous, obviously and unavoidably so. And that (more than gear-fiddling, which can be practised on flat ground) is the challenge we have to learn how to manage.
|
|
|
|
|
core
Mar 31, 2006, 7:54 PM
Post #16656 of 22774
(520101 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Jul 29, 2003
Posts: 1102
|
In reply to: [snip]...dangerous, obviously and unavoidably so. And that (more than gear-fiddling, which can be practised on flat ground) is the challenge we have to learn how to manage.
I think this is an important point. Facing the danger and managing the fear allows you to focus on the technical part of the game. (climbing, safety, fun etc). I'm not sure I've even been gripped on TR. :)
|
|
|
|
|
cracklover
Apr 1, 2006, 12:42 AM
Post #16657 of 22774
(520101 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Nov 14, 2002
Posts: 10162
|
In reply to: In reply to: I can't say with certainty, but I believe he said somewhere in the area of P3 or P4. The ledge fall didn't sound too severe, but nonetheless still scary! I wonder if he has a new favorite cam... Hmm, there's some easy but perhaps crumbly stuff at the start of P3. P4 is the big chimney, more solid, but you'd hate to fall in a chimney. I think Gabe has a story about walking one #4 Friend up that pitch because some sandbagger advised him not to take double sets.
Jesus, after P1, I can't think of a good place to fall until you get into the big chimney. P2 through (3?4?) are all *very* ledgy. Sounds scary.
Anyway, congrats to Chris! Epinephrine, while it is a trade route, is still a major accomplishment.
GO
|
|
|
|
|
cracklover
Apr 1, 2006, 12:50 AM
Post #16658 of 22774
(520101 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Nov 14, 2002
Posts: 10162
|
In reply to: In reply to: Good story, notch! The only thing that prepares you for leading is leading. At least TRing teaches you how to climb, but mock-leading is *counterproductive*! It teaches you nothing about leading that you can't learn better from just ground-school (practicing placing gear), but messes up your head for real leading. /rant GO That's interesting. I'd like to hear other's opinions also. One thing I like about it is that it takes the question of where I'm going to place the gear.
That's what sewing up easy routes is for. You get on something where the climbing is *way* below your level, and you can manage the fear of being on lead at a very low level, while learning how to look for gear, how to place it from a one-handed stance, etc. I think there's some decent opportunities for this at Hammond Pond, and also at the Black and White Rocks. Sadly, most trad leading in the Boston area is pretty steep, or ridiculously chossy. The Gunks aren't ridiculously far away, though...
In reply to: I agree with you though in that it doesn't change the mental game, for me it just takes at least some of the tactical thinking out of it.
I think it makes the mental game harder once you really do start to lead. Mostly because you have tricked yourself emotionally. Your body and mind feel that you should be able to handle the things you mock-led, and then once you're up on them, or something equivalent to them, all goes fine until suddenly something happens that you weren't honestly prepared for, and it throws you for a loop.
I've helped other folks mock-lead at their insistence, and I once mock-led an aid route that was too hard for me to lead. In both cases I thought it'd be helpful. In both cases, I was mistaken.
GO
|
|
|
|
|
gymnastc
Apr 1, 2006, 12:55 AM
Post #16659 of 22774
(520101 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Jun 21, 2004
Posts: 121
|
Hey all! I'm at the library now during a rest day (maybe the first of a few...I'm so sore!) So basically my friend was off a little on P2 so I started up the most obvious line on the next pitch. I went to grab a hold which felt solid, and after I trusted it, it blew off and down I went. It was about a 35 ft fall, and luckily enough, I had my camelbak tied off below me, and I think I fell mostly onto that. I don't think I broke any bones, but I definitely broke the camelbak pouch, a bottle of antibacterial wash, and my camera! I'm so bruised, but we finished the climb. The decent was quite heinous in the dark. I'll write more when I get home.
By the way Cory, my new favorite cam is the 1.25 Friend!
Chris
|
|
|
|
|
jakedatc
Apr 1, 2006, 1:03 AM
Post #16660 of 22774
(520101 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Mar 12, 2003
Posts: 11054
|
NICE Chris.. proud send.. and a kickass story since you're ok.. thats what your 2nd trad whip this year.. not including a certain top rope incident.. crazy. hehe camelpak air bag.. sucks about ur camera though
we gotta hit up rumney or the gunks sometime soon.. climbing with ya is fun times.
Jake
|
|
|
|
|
cracklover
Apr 1, 2006, 5:12 AM
Post #16661 of 22774
(520101 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Nov 14, 2002
Posts: 10162
|
Just glad to hear you're okay, Chris! And congrats. I really think Epinephrine is a proud line. Course that probably has something to do with the fact that I couldn't get up it last time I tried. LOL!
GO
|
|
|
|
|
jakedatc
Apr 1, 2006, 6:04 AM
Post #16662 of 22774
(520101 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Mar 12, 2003
Posts: 11054
|
you should come boulder sunday and get strong ;) and you wont even freeze this time..
|
|
|
|
|
choueiri
Apr 1, 2006, 4:02 PM
Post #16663 of 22774
(520098 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Oct 15, 2003
Posts: 272
|
Anyone interested in doing some climbing today? I was thinking of heading over to Metrorock in the afternoon but if someone is going outside I would love to join.
Tony
|
|
|
|
|
orangekyak
Apr 3, 2006, 12:24 AM
Post #16664 of 22774
(520102 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Jun 30, 2002
Posts: 1832
|
Amanda and I took a friend of mine from work out to Crow Hill today. We started on an easy climb on the end crag, which had only the slightest seepage in a couple spots.
We scouted the rest of the cliff, finding that the place is in mid-July condition. Climbs like Diagonal and Tarzan, which are typically swims this time of year, were entirely dry. The practice face was dry. Even Thin Line and Frannie's had only small seeps going on.
We did a couple laps on intertwine and called it a fine morning.
Best part? No bugs. Early season CH rocks.
|
|
|
|
|
cracklover
Apr 3, 2006, 12:36 AM
Post #16665 of 22774
(520102 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Nov 14, 2002
Posts: 10162
|
In reply to: Amanda and I took a friend of mine from work out to Crow Hill today. We started on an easy climb on the end crag, which had only the slightest seepage in a couple spots. We scouted the rest of the cliff, finding that the place is in mid-July condition. Climbs like Diagonal and Tarzan, which are typically swims this time of year, were entirely dry. The practice face was dry. Even Thin Line and Frannie's had only small seeps going on. We did a couple laps on intertwine and called it a fine morning. Best part? No bugs. Early season CH rocks.
I had just been wondering what the second-driest March in Eastern-Mass history would mean for Crow Hill. Coarse it's too late for me to head out now, but glad you got a chance to enjoy it!
GO
|
|
|
|
|
jakedatc
Apr 3, 2006, 12:54 AM
Post #16666 of 22774
(520102 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Mar 12, 2003
Posts: 11054
|
Had a good time at the woods today.. was out with kate, her friend emily from home, and our friend steve and his girlfriend.
brilliant me thought it would be a good idea to warm up on Tombstone nose.. somewhat rough deadpoint out to a good hold.. semi campus to a jug.. and then an unresolved top out (that means i failed haha) that left my shoulder feeling like crap.. oh well little pulled muscle.
really warmed up a bit.. hung out with Willy and "officially" met Kayleigh aka girlyoutalkto
did some stuff at Sit down area and then back at Lower heart. Got steve's gf up a few routes.. first time out climbing she did well and said she'd come out again.
temps going up.. Friction is heading south.. so heading north soon will be good for me.. i have a list of rumney stuff i'd like to do. and gunks also
|
|
|
|
|
girlyoutalkto
Apr 3, 2006, 12:59 AM
Post #16667 of 22774
(520103 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Oct 13, 2005
Posts: 90
|
Went to LW as well, "met" Jake, lol. It was nice to really meet you btw. Spent some time @ the sit down area, worked on a problem there that kept throwing me off but I finally sent it after about a million tries... that felt good. I really need to work on my footwork... :oops:
But Willy and a bunch of other people went down to the Pond Cave area and were working on Leap Frog (I think that's the name)... Jason took a really bad fall and landed on his hand, thought he broke it... needless to say, that put an end to the day. Luckily nothing is broken, but it was really, really scary... looked like he was going to land on his head. Definitely the worst fall I've ever seen. His hand was pretty much useless after that, though he can *sort of* bend it. Hopefully it'll get better quick. Other than that, though, it was a good day... any day climbing is a good day. :) Ill post pictures later.
|
|
|
|
|
robbovius
Apr 3, 2006, 1:09 AM
Post #16668 of 22774
(520105 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Nov 20, 2002
Posts: 8406
|
In reply to: ... My mind went south from here....
Notch, I totally agree with gabe, that only leading prepares you for leading. regarding mock-leading, I 've done it exactly twice, but only as practice to find stances on routes I was intending to lead soon after, namely "Paradise Lost" at Purgatory, and "Excersize Left to the Reader" at College Rock.
Tony mentions a similar mini-epic I had on Outside Corner, where I kicked out a tricam I'd placed at the bottom of the final handcrack, just as I climbed past it. the Terror was strong and instant, and what I chose to do was downclimb back to the ledge and reset the piece. it was a sketch downclimb, and I was pretty much panic-stricken for a few moments before I could reset my head, replace the piece, and continue the climb. as it was I pumped out just about at the top, and so made a desparate grab for the anchor, which kept me from whipping.
but then, couple weeks ago though I got back on it, and got it solid.
About the most important lesson I have learned since I began leading in 12/03, is that the leader has to accept that leading involves being terrified occasionally, and has to have a repertoire of fear-management behaviours in order to keep on making moves and excersizing effective and deliberate - if not calm and settled - decision-making. Learning effective fear management is one of the most important tools in the leader's skillset, which mock leading does absolutely ZERO towards.
Chris, glad you're safe, waiting for the TR!
As for myself, topday Pam and I hiked Purgatory, CHarlies loop...everybody , this is a very happy time for both of us, and especially Pam, as this time last year she was recovering from her first hip replacement, prior to which she couldn't even get up the stairs to my appt without significant agony...now she's walking and hiking 1-2 miles at a go up and downhill, over boulders...why, I can even see her getting up the first two pitches of Dike Route at White Horse.
Today during parts of the hike, she practiced slab footwork, and I even got her on a small foot traverse and a .1-.2 easy, stairs-y 12 foot slab. way out back in the trails I found some 15-20 foot outcropppings that made for fun impromptu hiker-clad bouldering...good times!
|
|
|
|
|
jakedatc
Apr 3, 2006, 2:55 AM
Post #16669 of 22774
(520138 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Mar 12, 2003
Posts: 11054
|
I agree.. leading will get you better at leading. But there are other ways of going about it other than jumping straight to the sharp end with a shiny rack. I always see my path as way different than most of the folks here because i went from a) top rope to b) bolts to c) trad seconding then to d) trad lead.
The folks going straight from TR to trad lead are braver than i.. i was taught that the seconding time was important and i believe it
Finding clipping stances are key and for me moving through the grades on bolts was a lot easier and less stressful. I know where a bolt is.. there is a stance somewhere.. just have to position myself accordingly. While seconding i go ahh there is where they put that nut.. i gotta find where they stood. then you put it together.. find the placement.. and find the stance or visa versa if there is a really good stance.. find something that fits.
It also worked out some of the head games.. and alot of the physical element.
what i have learned.. REST.. from the folks ive climbed with i think jeremy rests as close to as many times i do than anyone else.. I think it's smart, if you got this great stance.. enjoy it.. de pump.. check the route out ahead.. plug gear and away you go. Also recognize when you're getting pumped, snag a quick marginal rest to shake out on so you can make it to the next good spot. For me i split routes into boulder problems.. from one spot to get gear or rest to another, in between it's climbing and maybe a dip of chalk. I think if you look for gear the whole way then you are spending too much time in the wrong area. i guess that comes from only having the bolts so in between i have no choice in the matter.
the combo of mental and physical that calms me down is that it's usually warm up level, if bolted. i decided i wanted to climb trad because it gets me places i cant get on bolts.. i'm not in it for the engineering challenges or the purity of the thing.. i like the change in scenery.. so doing 5.7-8 all day doesnt bother me (take that who say im just a number chaser.. hehe)
Trad through sport! Fall on bolts.. be strong on trad :) that is the path less chosen :)
Kayleigh that sucks that Willy crashed hard on Leap frog.. which is really bad since he knew he wasnt feeling strong and maybe shoulda talked himself out of it.. ah well at least it's not broken and he'll be back soon
oh and news from NEclimbs that will make jeremy a bit sad.. a good hold at the end of the traverse on Romancing the Stone broke off. not sure what resulted but they said it didnt change the route much... just may not have a good rest there.
|
|
|
|
|
jumaringjeff
Apr 3, 2006, 1:38 PM
Post #16670 of 22774
(520138 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Nov 30, 2001
Posts: 1838
|
Jake, excellent take on approaching trad leads. I think of it in a very similar way. Also, I agree that spending a considerable amount of time seconding is a very good way to go when learning the ways of the trad. It's also the traditional method.
Heather and I messed around over at HP yesterday for a few hours. We both got a lead in, and did some hard TRing. I've lost 20 pounds and it really made a difference; I hadn't climbed in months and I could still pull my weight up small crimpers. Felt good. Heather is getting better with her gear and she's got a very cool lead head by default, so I figure if I can get her out a lot this summer she'll become a great ropegun. :twisted:
|
|
|
|
|
choueiri
Apr 3, 2006, 1:41 PM
Post #16671 of 22774
(520138 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Oct 15, 2003
Posts: 272
|
Anyone have the day off today? I have everyday off for at least another month... :D
Tony
|
|
|
|
|
rhonius
Apr 3, 2006, 3:19 PM
Post #16672 of 22774
(520135 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Sep 20, 2003
Posts: 136
|
hey guys it is great to finally have to nice weather. i don't know if anyone else was there and i hope that none of you were subjected to that disaster. But i was down a QQ on sunday and i have never seen so many people there. At one point there were 6 or 7 lines on M face and 4 or 5 on J. It was nuts actually ended up leaveing cause I could not take that many people.
|
|
|
|
|
choueiri
Apr 3, 2006, 3:30 PM
Post #16673 of 22774
(520135 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Oct 15, 2003
Posts: 272
|
In reply to: hey guys it is great to finally have to nice weather. i don't know if anyone else was there and i hope that none of you were subjected to that disaster. But i was down a QQ on sunday and i have never seen so many people there. At one point there were 6 or 7 lines on M face and 4 or 5 on J. It was nuts actually ended up leaveing cause I could not take that many people.
Well, that explains why Metrorock was empty... :D
Tony
|
|
|
|
|
core
Apr 3, 2006, 3:30 PM
Post #16674 of 22774
(520135 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Jul 29, 2003
Posts: 1102
|
Nice, the MCT is humming with activity!
Yesterday was my first Rumney visit for the season, what a great day. We warmed up Glory Jeans on the Parking Lot Wall and just kept working our way right. After that we hit Bonsai, then Upper Vader. Despite being a rather low key day, I did manage to sneak in a clean send of Peer Pressure, man I love that line.
|
|
|
|
|
jakedatc
Apr 3, 2006, 4:32 PM
Post #16675 of 22774
(520010 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Mar 12, 2003
Posts: 11054
|
Thanks senor jefe it has worked for me.. i need to do a few easier things to start out this year and really plug a shitload of gear to orient myself with my new rack and then will be able to try and close the gap between my sport and trad grades a bit more.
Cory thats sweet.. i love Peer pressure.. such awesome moves
|
|
|
|
|
|
