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jengurl
Sep 25, 2006, 1:27 AM
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Not specifically climbing related, but was hoping someone here can help me out.
Years of borderline eating disorders (not eating, throwing up after meals, binge and purge, laxitives, ect) have left my metabolisim completely trashed. I really want to start eating helthy, but whenever I eat anywhere near a normal ammount of food, I gain weight. And trust me, I do not need more weight (BMI of 23) - in fact, I would like to lose some. But I eat around 1000-1200 calories a day to maintain my weight, even with climbing, kayaking, skiing and hockey. I'm afraid to eat less than this for fear of slowing my metabolisim down further and I'm pretty active... I fit as much exercise into my schedule as I can.
So I was wondering if anyone had suggestions on how I can lose some weight without ruining my metabolisim further?
Thanks
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redlegrangerone
Sep 25, 2006, 1:44 AM
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You might want to hook up with a good nutritionist. 1000-1200 calories is not enough intake for even a sedentary person. The average person needs around 2000. More if you are being active or training.
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joeforte
Sep 25, 2006, 4:21 AM
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Wow, running every morning at the ass crack of dawn. Yay. If that doesn't get you excited, then try this.
Find something active you love to do, maybe even take up a new hobby. Bike, scramble on rocks, hike, anything but sit on an excercise machine. You'll be more likely to do it often, and you'll enjoy it more. The more you enjoy it, the harder you will go. You're not going to get inspired on any machine, but if you fall in love with something, you'll find yourself getting up early and staying up late to do it, just cuz it's FUN. Don't kill yourself. Your metabolism will readjust slowly. Give it time. Enjoy this life!!!!
By the way, you're obviously aware of your weaknesses, and admiting to them is a very strong and humble thing to do. Congradulations on your decision to get healthy! I'd wait on the professional help. They'll just prescribe you something. Listen to your body, You seem like an inteligent person, your body will tell you what is good and what is bad.
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lena_chita
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Sep 25, 2006, 6:45 PM
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I second (third?) the nutritionist advice given your history.
I know someone who also claims that she is eating 1300-1400 calories and claims to be active and still can't seem to lose weight. I believe that she is 1) over-estimating her activity level 2) under-estimating her calorie intake 3) possibly has a thyroid problem. WHether that in any way applies to you I wouldn't know...
I don't think you will get any solid advice by asking a quiestion like that online where people don't know you, and have no way of judging how accurate your self-assessment is. But I can only say that there are serious health problems associatied with eating disporder history, so you sholud be even more careful than an average person when taking advice of strangers regarding your exercise plan and eating.
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fracture
Sep 25, 2006, 10:21 PM
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We all know restricting caloric intake too excessively doesn't work in the long run (so anorexia is as bad of a weight loss strategy as the fad diets), but out of curiousity, do any of our resident nutrition gurus (i.e. Jay) know if vomiting after meals actually works? (As in, can you lose weight that way and keep it off in the long run, not as in is it "healthy" or will it damage your esophagus.)
It seems like it could be hard to accurately gauge caloric intake, but maybe if you're careful you could. (e.g. eat some, puke, brush teeth, and then eat the planned amount of calories for the meal :lol:)
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jengurl
Sep 26, 2006, 3:46 AM
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From expereince, voimiting does work, at least to lose weight, as do laxitives, as long as you do not binge as well. Binge and purge, in the long run, will result in weight gain.
And thanks for your suggestions
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mixedphat
Sep 26, 2006, 1:04 PM
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i second (4th now?) the idea of going to a proper nutritionist or even just your family doctor.
but i'll tag some advice on the end like everyone else:
along with the extra excise and actually monitoring the calories you consume i'd look at how you are consuming those calories. i'd try and fit in eating you daily quoter over a 6 separate small meals, this lets your body have a steady stream of energy to burn off and keeps your metabolism working all through the day, rather than just in bursts at breakfast, lunch and dinner.
good luck
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mountain_racer
Sep 26, 2006, 1:26 PM
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jengurl,
Try having someone reevaluate your workouts. Be more focused on a steady increase in the amount of work you do in order to increase the number of calories you burn. Your body is probably in survival mode, saving itself from the starvation you have subjected it too in the past (not a condemnation just an observation). Try, in addition to a nutritionist, seeking out a trainer in order to better optimize the time you do have for exercise. Most of all try to focus on improving your performance in the activities you love, make the weight a secondary or tertiary goal!
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keinangst
Sep 26, 2006, 1:33 PM
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This study just came out this morning, made me think of this thread:
ST. LOUIS -- Women athletes watching their waistlines could be more susceptible to leg pain and stress fractures, a small study says.
A Saint Louis University study looked at 76 women college athletes and found that abnormal and low-calorie eating habits could put them at greater risk for injury.
"I wanted to understand if two people were undergoing the same exercise regime, why only one of them would have leg pain," said Dr. Mark Reinking, a physical therapy expert who led the study.
The old-school prescription for sore legs -- running less or wearing different shoes -- doesn't really alleviate the pain, Reinking said. Diet appears to be the single most important factor, he said.
The study found women with "disordered eating," including bulimia and anorexia, and those who take in too few calories because of dieting, experienced decreased estrogen production, a key factor in bone development.
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tradmanclimbs
Sep 26, 2006, 2:14 PM
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beeing Anni Physicaly screws up your heart and bones. It also mentaly messes up your head and generany makes you extremly dificult to get allong with. Don't be that bag of bones who still thinks she is fat. Its a horrible way to live your life and misrebal for you as well as the people who love you and care about you. You have to learn to love yourself and be comfortable with your body type. You have to eat otherwise you will turn into a pscyco. eat good healthy food and work out hard. You may never look like that bimbo on the cover of 17 mag but who freaking cares :roll: Its more important to be healthy and happy.. best of luck.
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lena_chita
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Sep 26, 2006, 2:34 PM
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In reply to: ST. LOUIS -- Women athletes watching their waistlines could be more susceptible to leg pain and stress fractures, a small study says.
Hmmm... I am not sure what's so novel about this 'small study', since "Female athlete triad" -- a combination of three conditions: disordered eating, amenorrhea, and osteoporosis/stress fractures -- has been recognized a long time ago and has been studied quite a bit, I think...
Yeah, playing sports too hard without providing adequate fuel for the body will do that to you. Why is that news again?
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schveety
Sep 26, 2006, 3:09 PM
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I'm no psychologist, but it sounds to me like you may still be having some issues with assessing your body image. A BMI of 23 is considered in the normal body weight range (18.5-24.9), so I'm not sure why exactly you're trying to lose weight? Maintaining your weight is okay, but losing some?!? Cutting calories would definitely hurt you here because any less than 1200 would probably start to slow your metabolism, but I don't see anything wrong with eating only 1200 calories to maintain your weight.
I would definitely check out some nutrition books, and keep a normal exercise schedule. Don't be that person at the gym 3 times a day for 12 hours, there is more to life than your weight. Keep your BMI in the limit, your cholesterol down, and your heart and lungs in good shape and don't worry so much about being ultra-skinny.
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tradmanclimbs
Sep 26, 2006, 3:17 PM
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Shes trying to lose weight because she is Anni, its what they do.. somehow you have to move on. be healthy and eat..
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mtn_eagle
Sep 26, 2006, 3:23 PM
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BMI measurements make little sense for athletes. It is a ratio of weight to height and those with a lot of muscle mass will have higher BMI's but not necessarily more fat.
To the original poster: decide whether you want to be an athlete or a leggy supermodel and then eat accordingly.
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mtn_eagle
Sep 26, 2006, 3:24 PM
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BMI measurements make little sense for athletes. It is a ratio of weight to height and those with a lot of muscle mass will have higher BMI's but not necessarily more fat.
To the original poster: decide whether you want to be an athlete or a leggy supermodel and then eat accordingly.
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tradmanclimbs
Sep 26, 2006, 3:25 PM
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She is trying to lose weight because she is anni, its what they do. somehow she has to get over it and move on.. Don't eat crap junk food but eat good healthy meals and excersise...
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mtn_eagle
Sep 26, 2006, 3:44 PM
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For those who would like to calculate your basal energy expedditure, this is the Harris-Benedict Equation that we use in the ICU to figure out how much to feed people on tube feeds.
Men:
BEE (Kcal) = 66.5 + (13.75 x wt in kg) + (5.003 x ht in cm) - (6.775 x age in yrs)
Women:
BEE (Kcal) = 665.1 + (9.563 x wt in kg) + (1.85 x ht in cm) - (4.676 x age in yrs)
All the decimals are in the right places. The formulas are very different for men and women but have been validated. These are the numbers of Kcals someone needs to avoid catabolism, or the breaking down tissues to make up for Kcal debt (AKA starvation). For really sick people with life threatening infections we usually multiply the number of kcal by 1.2. For an athlete it all depends on how much you are exercising and there is no great formula to use.
If you were a 25 year old women who is 5ft 8in tall and have a BMI of 23 your BEE is about 1500 Kcal. If you were 5ft 6in with the same BMI and age it would be 1460 Kcal. If you are eating equal to or less than your BEE and are exercising regularly you are guaranteed TO BE HURTING YOURSELF.
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keinangst
Sep 26, 2006, 4:10 PM
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Great formula, thanks!
2028 kcal...I need to eat more. I actually have a really hard time staying fully energized when out climbing. I'm thinking about switching from gatorade to Ultra Fuel or another similar carb-dense beverage. I just can't wolf down enough calorie-rich food to keep from feeling lethargic. I used to find that was an easy way to keep my cals up during 2+ hour workouts, maybe the OP should consider it.
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sawtooth_ridge
Sep 26, 2006, 5:10 PM
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An earlier post along this line:
***1000-1200 calories is not enough intake for even a sedentary person. The average person needs around 2000. More if you are being active or training.***
New research suggests that this is not the case at all. In one of the more recent "bio-dome" studies conducted in the US, participants were unable to produce (grow) enough food to achieve the usual 2000 calorie/day level assumed to be required for normal health. They only achieved about 800-1000 calories/day, and, after 2 or 3 months of eating this diet (which was composed of low-cal foods with very high nutritional content otherwise), they experienced a dramatic reduction in chronic health problems associated with diet. I'm talking blood pressure, cholesterol, and general "feeling" of health. Members of the study have largely chosen to remain on this diet after the study.
This event has lead to calorie-health studies with mice/rats that have affirmed the bio-dome results. Mice fed 1/2 the usual "accepted" caloric requirement (but still, very high-nutritional content food) live dramatically longer lives, statistically speaking. The observed and validated reason for this is that increased calories also equal increased consumption of free-radicals, and associated cell damage caused by free-radicals.
Most of us in the Western world feel "hungry" if not eating 2000+ calories/day, however this is in-part because our bodies have adjusted to processing this amount of food. Sugars especially, have a dramatic effect on the body's perceived need for sustenance. Most of the developed world is fully addicted to massive doses of sugar, and sugars account for a significant amount of the usual 2000 calorie/day "requirement". On the other hand, many people in the developing world are physically fit (athletically speaking), and could easily out-perform any of us in terms of athletic ability, day-in day-out, while consuming half the calories that we do. Of course, most of the developing world has poor health care and/or less than ideal nutitional content/calorie as well.
It should be noted that the bio-dome participants were not undergoing any sort of intense physical activities, other than possibly stretching. It should be common sense, that, if you routinely lift weights, climb, bike long distances, etc., you will accelerate the rate at which you use calories and must account for that.
The point I am trying to make is that "caloric requirement" is largely a subjective and arbitrary mark, based largely on societal eating habitats instead of on genuine physical need. Other new evidence suggests that our genetic heritage plays a large role in this as well. (For instance, if you are caucasion, it has been suggested that you are genetically adapted to large meals AND to heavy workloads........Genetic heritages originating in the tropics show the opposite trend......the tropical environment contributes to "unhealthier working conditions" and thus, slower metabolisms (ever tried to "work-out" in 110 degree heat and near 100% humidity over a lifetime? It is no myth that our genetics determine, in part, our caloric needs).
The real message is to choose foods that have very high nutritional content/calorie, and ignore foods that don't have these qualities. Sugar is most likely the worst "bad guy", in that none of us are truly adapted to refined sugar. If, you are physically active and remain hungry or lethargic after eating a quality diet, increase your intake of starches and proteins, and continue to avoid simple sugars..........
There's more than 2 cents, and I don't mean to over-simplify the discussion at all. However, it is very likely that a small woman does not need to eat more than 1200 calories per day to remain healthy. If she wants to build muscle mass, or exert herself dramatically, the caloric requirement changes......
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lena_chita
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Sep 26, 2006, 6:41 PM
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Sawtooth_ridge, I remember reading about it. There are quite a few studies out there about mice on on "starvation diet" and reduced risk of cancer associated with it, and there are couple high-profile cancer researchers who have been living on it for years. Supposedly people on a low-calorie diet get reduced body temperature, so there is less energy required to maintain it, and get some other benefits like reduced mutation rate and delayed aging...
But it is a dangerous thing to suggest to a recovering anorexic! B/c just the calorie-count are not the whole story.
I think all the calorie-count plans don't take into account the quality of food. It is one thing to estimate the amount of calories needed to maintain life by feeding someone through IV. I am sure the counts are accurate (LOL, they better be!). But is is not meant to be a long-term scenario. Surviving on IV glucose and being healthy while fed IV glucose are different things entirely...
The 1100-1200-some calories that I personally need to avoid catabolism according to the calculations from mtn_eagle could come from couple TBSP of olive oil and X teaspoons of sugar, and while that would provide the calories all right it obviously wouldn't cover the body needs in any way, even if you supplement that with 100% RDA of every vitamin that is out there and throw in some of those fiber supplements for good measure. :P
There is a great diet that I believe in: It is a no-food-label diet. As much as possible you eat things that don't come in bags and boxes labeled with portion sizes and calories. And get a bonus if those things are grown within 100 mile radius from where you live and eaten as soon as possible after picking ... LOL, double bonus if you grew them yourself organically and expended calories on weeding the garden. ( and No, I'm not a vegetarian -- I just have friends who keep chickens, sell me eggs, and occasionally even treat me to home-made goat cheese :lol: )
I actually have no idea how many calories I take in and how many I spend. Not the faintest idea. But as someone who weighs 105 lb at 5'2'' and has been there stably for about 18 years except for 3 pregnancies that pushed the weight up by 25 lb before it bounced right back, I'd say that my diet plan is working so far.
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sawtooth_ridge
Sep 26, 2006, 7:50 PM
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quote referring to my earlier post....
***But it is a dangerous thing to suggest to a recovering anorexic!***
Absolutely correct and an important point. I probably should have been more sensitive to the situation of the original poster.......
I agree 100% with the "no-label" diet, although I certainly endorse labelling laws on pre-packaged foods. I also agree 100% that supplements are in no way a substitute for pesticide-free, fresh produce.....whether or not the fertilizers are organic is less important to your personal health and more relevant to whole-earth health. (i.e., fertilizing with ammonium nitrate won't hurt YOU via produce directly, but it does indirectly create by-products from the manufacturing process that aren't very friendly)
Another suggestion is to explore the world of ethically-collected wild foods. In the Pacific Northwest, for instance, huckleberry (or wild blueberry, depending on where you are) picking for personal use is a great way to get outdoors, have a wonderful weekend, and secure delicious berries for your whole year. Of course, if it's really good, there are likely commercial harvesters out there ruining it for everyone......Do your homework concerning local plants, and explore the benefits of harvesting them or growing them (if native stocks are impacted). It's a calorire-burning, cultural connection that most of us desperately need, but have lost.........
Weeding is excellent exercise, as is harvesting produce and cooking/canning it as well. If you live rurally, consider cutting your firewood manually, rather than with a chainsaw, etc. Kneading bread is much more physical than people realize, and there are psychological benefits to "doing things the hard way" as well.
In any case, "losing weight" is something that no one should ever consider. Rather, set goals such as "reduce body fat percentage while simultaneously increasing useful muscle mass" Lifting weights to "bulk up" will not give you benefits over the long term.......choosing a lifestyle that requires daily use of dense muscle tissue will.
Enough from me. I'm beginning to sound preachy and foolish, when I should be picking the last of my beans or sawing firewood (and getting buff!).
Take care, all!
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jt512
Sep 26, 2006, 7:51 PM
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In reply to: An earlier post along this line: ***1000-1200 calories is not enough intake for even a sedentary person. The average person needs around 2000. More if you are being active or training.*** New research suggests that this is not the case at all. In one of the more recent "bio-dome" studies conducted in the US, participants were unable to produce (grow) enough food to achieve the usual 2000 calorie/day level assumed to be required for normal health. They only achieved about 800-1000 calories/day, and, after 2 or 3 months of eating this diet (which was composed of low-cal foods with very high nutritional content otherwise), they experienced a dramatic reduction in chronic health problems associated with diet. I'm talking blood pressure, cholesterol, and general "feeling" of health. Members of the study have largely chosen to remain on this diet after the study. This event has lead to calorie-health studies with mice/rats that have affirmed the bio-dome results. Mice fed 1/2 the usual "accepted" caloric requirement (but still, very high-nutritional content food) live dramatically longer lives, statistically speaking. The observed and validated reason for this is that increased calories also equal increased consumption of free-radicals, and associated cell damage caused by free-radicals. Most of us in the Western world feel "hungry" if not eating 2000+ calories/day, however this is in-part because our bodies have adjusted to processing this amount of food. Sugars especially, have a dramatic effect on the body's perceived need for sustenance. Most of the developed world is fully addicted to massive doses of sugar, and sugars account for a significant amount of the usual 2000 calorie/day "requirement". On the other hand, many people in the developing world are physically fit (athletically speaking), and could easily out-perform any of us in terms of athletic ability, day-in day-out, while consuming half the calories that we do. Of course, most of the developing world has poor health care and/or less than ideal nutitional content/calorie as well. It should be noted that the bio-dome participants were not undergoing any sort of intense physical activities, other than possibly stretching. It should be common sense, that, if you routinely lift weights, climb, bike long distances, etc., you will accelerate the rate at which you use calories and must account for that. The point I am trying to make is that "caloric requirement" is largely a subjective and arbitrary mark, based largely on societal eating habitats instead of on genuine physical need. Other new evidence suggests that our genetic heritage plays a large role in this as well. (For instance, if you are caucasion, it has been suggested that you are genetically adapted to large meals AND to heavy workloads........Genetic heritages originating in the tropics show the opposite trend......the tropical environment contributes to "unhealthier working conditions" and thus, slower metabolisms (ever tried to "work-out" in 110 degree heat and near 100% humidity over a lifetime? It is no myth that our genetics determine, in part, our caloric needs). The real message is to choose foods that have very high nutritional content/calorie, and ignore foods that don't have these qualities. Sugar is most likely the worst "bad guy", in that none of us are truly adapted to refined sugar. If, you are physically active and remain hungry or lethargic after eating a quality diet, increase your intake of starches and proteins, and continue to avoid simple sugars.......... There's more than 2 cents, and I don't mean to over-simplify the discussion at all. However, it is very likely that a small woman does not need to eat more than 1200 calories per day to remain healthy. If she wants to build muscle mass, or exert herself dramatically, the caloric requirement changes......
100% bullshit.
Jay
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tradmanclimbs
Sep 26, 2006, 8:01 PM
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Thankyou JT!! The last thing that a sick person needs is bullshit theorys that support starvation :roll: when your system is so screwed up from starvation that you haven't menstrated in a year and you have a heart murmer from you flesh consuming itself you don't think too clearly and are easily influenced by anything that supports your twisted thought process.
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fracture
Sep 26, 2006, 8:16 PM
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In reply to: From expereince, voimiting does work, at least to lose weight, as do laxitives, as long as you do not binge as well. Binge and purge, in the long run, will result in weight gain.
Don't take this the wrong way, but I'm not particularly interested in anecdotal information. You can find people who will attest, "from experience", to the effectivity of just about any diet-technique. False, but convincing-sounding information on this topic spreads extremely rapidly (see above), and personal experience can be deceptive.
Also, by the way, I don't mean to imply that post-meal vomiting is potentially a good choice as a weight-loss technique. But to me it is on precisely the same level as the Atkins Diet or the South Beach Diet or things of that sort. That is to say, it is something people widely do in order to lose weight, without a scientific understanding of whether it is effective or safe.
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maldaly
Sep 26, 2006, 9:11 PM
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jengurl,
I feel your pain. Lots of good advice here...and some that's supect. I don't have much to add but I'll reiterrate some prior words. Eat only the highest quality foods you can get. Organically grown, close to the source and nutrient-dense. Don't eat anything white except for frech coconut. Lose the white flour, white sugar and white rice. There's nothing good in them and lots bad. Eat salmon. Use olive oil. Saute in grape seed oil. Don't use mayonaise...use hummus instead. I could go on and on but I think you get the drift. Best rule I've ever followed is to pay attention to what I put in my mouth. If I think about everything that passes my lips I usually get it right.
Good luck,
Mal
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collegekid
Sep 30, 2006, 10:17 PM
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My biochemist girlfriend says that staying well hydrated might help.
From personal experience:
Start doing 1 hr of *high intensity* physical activity a day. You'll notice yourself getting hungry frequently--so eat frequently!
Also, make sure to eat a lot of fiber (whole grain breads/cereals), fruits, veggies, and keep the intake of meat and high-fat dairy low. Diet is key to losing weight, but exercise is the lock.
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milominderbinder
Oct 1, 2006, 1:05 AM
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First, I would wonder how accurate your estimates on caloric intake are.
Then I would inquire as to how much strenuous activity you get per day (and way to play hockey, hockey rocks).
Also, you will not boost your metabolism without eating. You can work out all you want, but your metabolism still needs exposure to higher levels of calories before it adjusts to it.
I would not worry about eating less, and not worry about losing weight, with your bmi. But eat a healthy amount of calories, of a well rounded and healthy diet, with appropriate fats and all, and your metabolism should increase, and if you are working, your body will develop strength and all that.
But most of all, I reiterate that you probably should not be concerned with weight. Just keep up the activity.
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cjsimpso
Oct 1, 2006, 1:41 AM
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Don't listen to anything anyone here says. I know you want advice, and you've got a lot of well intentioned (and probably in many cases, well informed) opinions. But these are issues that can only be properly addressed by trained medical professionals who have seen you and examined the specifics of your history. I'm sure many things said here are probably good, sound suggestions, but given your past struggles with these issues, you really should see a professional in person.
Sorry to be a downer.
PS
You should, however, listen to anything positive and encouraging that has been said here, since there are clearly a lot of people trying to offer you support. Climbers are sweet like that.
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cjsimpso
Oct 1, 2006, 1:43 AM
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Don't listen to anything anyone here says. I know you want advice, and you've got a lot of well intentioned (and probably in many cases, well informed) opinions. But these are issues that can only be properly addressed by trained medical professionals who have seen you and examined the specifics of your history. I'm sure many things said here are probably good, sound suggestions, but given your past struggles with these issues, you really should see a professional in person.
Sorry to be a downer.
PS
You should, however, listen to anything positive and encouraging that has been said here, since there are clearly a lot of people trying to offer you support. Climbers are sweet like that.
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cjsimpso
Oct 1, 2006, 1:44 AM
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Don't listen to anything anyone here says. I know you want advice, and you've got a lot of well intentioned (and probably in many cases, well informed) opinions. But these are issues that can only be properly addressed by trained medical professionals who have seen you and examined the specifics of your history. I'm sure many things said here are probably good, sound suggestions, but given your past struggles with these issues, you really should see a professional in person.
Sorry to be a downer.
PS
You should, however, listen to anything positive and encouraging that has been said here, since there are clearly a lot of people trying to offer you support. Climbers are sweet like that.
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cjsimpso
Oct 1, 2006, 1:45 AM
Post #31 of 41
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Don't listen to anything anyone here says. I know you want advice, and you've got a lot of well intentioned (and probably in many cases, well informed) opinions. But these are issues that can only be properly addressed by trained medical professionals who have seen you and examined the specifics of your history. I'm sure many things said here are probably good, sound suggestions, but given your past struggles with these issues, you really should see a professional in person.
Sorry to be a downer.
PS
You should, however, listen to anything positive and encouraging that has been said here, since there are clearly a lot of people trying to offer you support. Climbers are sweet like that.
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mountain_racer
Oct 1, 2006, 1:59 AM
Post #32 of 41
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In reply to: Don't listen to anything anyone here says. I know you want advice, and you've got a lot of well intentioned (and probably in many cases, well informed) opinions. But these are issues that can only be properly addressed by trained medical professionals who have seen you and examined the specifics of your history. I'm sure many things said here are probably good, sound suggestions, but given your past struggles with these issues, you really should see a professional in person. Sorry to be a downer. PS You should, however, listen to anything positive and encouraging that has been said here, since there are clearly a lot of people trying to offer you support. Climbers are sweet like that.
What the !@#$? Did you even read what every one wrote? Did you even read what you wrote your self? Damn I wish I was able to rate, never mind I'll come back when I can to fling the stinking pile of poop at your post that it deserves! I'll be nice and try to stay civil for jengurl's sake. Seems to me that almost every other post to this topic suggested her getting professional help (nasty name edited prior to posting)
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htotsu
Oct 1, 2006, 2:39 AM
Post #33 of 41
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In reply to: From expereince, voimiting does work, at least to lose weight, as do laxitives, as long as you do not binge as well. Binge and purge, in the long run, will result in weight gain.
Jengurl, kudos for your honesty here. I have to say that it sounds like you are not over your disorder because you describe vomiting and laxatives as things that "work" to lose weight. So does cutting off your leg.
Vomiting "works" at destroying your esophogus, and your teeth, and your breath. It also keeps your body from getting the nutrients it needs to fuel body function.
Laxative abuse "works" at causing laxative dependency (you really don't want that), messing with your fluid and electrolyte balances, and causing irritable bowel syndrome.
Please do see that nutritionist, and know that for active people numbers on the scale lie. Muscle helps your body in obvious ways, but on this topic more muscle mass -> higher metabolism, which is why someone recommended weight training earlier. This is not about "bulking up" - anyone who knows anything about weight training should know that you have the choice of toning long and lean muscles (low weight, high # repetitions) or building bulky ones (high weight, low # reps).
In any case, weight training or not, when people try to lose weight and are active in whatever way, they often freak because they don't end up at the weight they originally wanted. That's because they don't factor in that muscle weighs more. Losing fat is great, and gaining muscle is better. Ultimately getting in better shape makes your body more efficient, and more solid. So let go of the scale and focus on how you feel. Eat healthy, get help from a nutritionist so you can educate yourself on how to make good food choices, and stay physically active in things you enjoy.
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cjsimpso
Oct 1, 2006, 6:53 AM
Post #34 of 41
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In reply to: In reply to: Don't listen to anything anyone here says. I know you want advice, and you've got a lot of well intentioned (and probably in many cases, well informed) opinions. But these are issues that can only be properly addressed by trained medical professionals who have seen you and examined the specifics of your history. I'm sure many things said here are probably good, sound suggestions, but given your past struggles with these issues, you really should see a professional in person. Sorry to be a downer. PS You should, however, listen to anything positive and encouraging that has been said here, since there are clearly a lot of people trying to offer you support. Climbers are sweet like that. What the !@#$? Did you even read what every one wrote? Did you even read what you wrote your self? Damn I wish I was able to rate, never mind I'll come back when I can to fling the stinking pile of poop at your post that it deserves! I'll be nice and try to stay civil for jengurl's sake. Seems to me that almost every other post to this topic suggested her getting professional help (nasty name edited prior to posting)
I didn't mean to suggest that I was the only one suggesting that she get professional help. And I certainly wouldn't try to imply that anyone here meant anything but constructive help. But I did mean to emphasize my point once again because I believe these disorders can be life-or death situations, and I don't think many people on this forum are qualified to help others deal with them, certainly myself included. I wasn't criticizing anyone in particular (Although I could easily have been, what with people suggesting that body image and eating disorder problems can be cured with BEE calculations, more exercise, or "just eating more.") I'm sorry if this offends you.
And Jengurl, once again, I want to point out that everyone here, myself and mountain racer included, are just trying to look out for you here and offer our support, and clearly from all the suggestions and debate, we all wish for you the very best.
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cjsimpso
Oct 1, 2006, 7:14 AM
Post #35 of 41
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In reply to: In reply to: Don't listen to anything anyone here says. I know you want advice, and you've got a lot of well intentioned (and probably in many cases, well informed) opinions. But these are issues that can only be properly addressed by trained medical professionals who have seen you and examined the specifics of your history. I'm sure many things said here are probably good, sound suggestions, but given your past struggles with these issues, you really should see a professional in person. Sorry to be a downer. PS You should, however, listen to anything positive and encouraging that has been said here, since there are clearly a lot of people trying to offer you support. Climbers are sweet like that. What the !@#$? Did you even read what every one wrote? Did you even read what you wrote your self? Damn I wish I was able to rate, never mind I'll come back when I can to fling the stinking pile of poop at your post that it deserves! I'll be nice and try to stay civil for jengurl's sake. Seems to me that almost every other post to this topic suggested her getting professional help (nasty name edited prior to posting)
I'm not trying to imply that I'm the first to suggest that she get professional help. Nor am I trying to say that anyone here meant anything but the very best, and perhaps were even speaking from past experiences. But I am trying to emphasize how important it is to get professional help from a medical professional. I know many people said this, but I also know that many people had a variety of suggestions that might make it seem like eating disorders and body image problems can be cured with a bit of determination or a change in eating habits. I believe that these sorts of disorders can be life threatening, and that only those properly trained should be trying to cure them. I didn't mean to dig at anyone in particular (although perhaps I could have, with the ideas that BEE calculations, more exercise, or "just eating more" could be all this person needs). I'm sorry if this approach offends you.
And Jengurl, once again, I want to point out that everyone here, myself and mountain racer included, are just trying to look out for you here and offer our support, and clearly from all the suggestions and debate, we all wish for you the very best.
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mountain_racer
Oct 3, 2006, 12:39 PM
Post #36 of 41
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In reply to: Don't listen to anything anyone here says.
This is the most turd worthy part of your post BTW, and so it gets one. (and apparently so did mine, but whoever did didn't have the guts to say why)
In reply to: I didn't mean to suggest that I was the only one suggesting that she get professional help.
Except that is exactly what you did imply by your first statement. And so you continue to contradict yourself. Keep peddling....backwards. The best way to get yourself out of a hole is ....... to stop digging.
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headchop
Oct 3, 2006, 2:13 PM
Post #37 of 41
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In reply to: In reply to: Don't listen to anything anyone here says. This is the most turd worthy part of your post BTW, and so it gets one. (and apparently so did mine, but whoever did didn't have the guts to say why)
That was me. And you should be honored - it's the first post I've ever bothered to rate.
And do you really need me to explain why I thought it was just about the most turd-worthy post I've read on this board in quite a long time? Seriously? Go back and read it again yourself.
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sweetchuck
Oct 3, 2006, 3:33 PM
Post #38 of 41
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I don’t want to encourage starvation or anything like that, just wanted to provide a data point. I would have thought that a woman eating 1100 calories a day would definitely lose weight. Well, my (brand new) girlfriend (that I am plumb crazy about, whooo hooo!) has to take prescription meds for a condition she has, and those things really slow her metabolism down. She had it professionally checked and she burns 1100 calories a day (she’s 5’4 and weighs 140 lbs!). Amazing! She works out every day and eats grass, wild onions and twigs (well, fruits and veggies and a little protein), and has a hell of a time keeping her weight under control. I had no idea meds could do that to you. Man, if I had to take them I would be a cow! We are working hard this month to eat good, and see if we can trim a few pounds (both of us). I just wanted to throw that in there just in case it might be a factor. Oh yeah, you can lose weight fast and keep it off forever by simply cutting off limbs, let’s be serious.
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udaho
Oct 3, 2006, 4:43 PM
Post #39 of 41
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You'll notice that I'm new here, at least for posting purposes. With the many threads I've read and the information about climbing that I've gleaned, this has been a great site for me, but after a couple of pages or so, people seem to get all up in arms for some reason :evil: . About this particular problem, to the OP, there has been a wealth of information given about metabolism, nutrition, weight, etc., that can be very helpful - I even have my own advice to give :wink: . One thing that should be glaringly apparent by now is that it's more information than you ought to try to understand, sift through, and implement by yourself. As this is a life/death (or at the very least Quality of Life) situation, please do yourself a favor and talk face to face with a nutritionist, or other qualified person with whom you can interact. You are a unique and special person, not just a BMI or number on the scale! If you indeed have a history of medical conditions of this nature you must seek external help. It has the best chance of getting to the root of the problem, as well as treating your symptoms. Book learning and online interaction will not affect the change that you need. The personal relationship you foster will also help you gather the strength for what you will need the most - commitment and follow-through. Best wishes, and please let us know how it goes!
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cjsimpso
Oct 24, 2006, 5:24 AM
Post #40 of 41
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Jengurl -
I'm just checking in to see how things are going for you at this point. I hope you're healthy and happy and climbing well.
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twistedpixie320
Dec 7, 2006, 2:59 PM
Post #41 of 41
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[quote "lena_chita"]I second (third?) the nutritionist advice given your history.
I know someone who also claims that she is eating 1300-1400 calories and claims to be active and still can't seem to lose weight. I believe that she is 1) over-estimating her activity level 2) under-estimating her calorie intake 3) possibly has a thyroid problem. WHether that in any way applies to you I wouldn't know...
I don't think you will get any solid advice by asking a quiestion like that online where people don't know you, and have no way of judging how accurate your self-assessment is. But I can only say that there are serious health problems associatied with eating disporder history, so you sholud be even more careful than an average person when taking advice of strangers regarding your exercise plan and eating.[/quote]
this is good advice. i eat probablly 1300 calories a day, excercise atleast 2 hours a day (climbing or cardio) and i have been gaining weight so i am now going to the drs for blood work to check for thyroid problems. It just takes simple blood tests but if you dont get it checked out it could lead to something serious
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