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clumsychic
Nov 19, 2005, 9:02 PM
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I'm pretty new to the sport and I'm about to buy some of my first gear. I'm thinking of buying the Primrose Black Diamond harness and sapphire 5.10 shoes. I was just wondering if anyone knows whether those are good or bad or what. Also, I was told to go 2 shoe sizes smaller since they stretch a lot. Exactly how excruciating should new shoes feel?
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ninja_climber
Nov 19, 2005, 9:09 PM
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I went 1 size down with mine and the felt a bit ncomfotable t first but they stretch. I don't know about the 5.10s though. Also make sure the shoes arn't already downsized. Either way 2 sizes sounds a bit two much.
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holdplease2
Nov 19, 2005, 9:20 PM
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Howdy...
Sounds like you are at risk of falling victem to the "lets market some stuff to girls so we can get all the new climbers addicted to our stuff" marketing spin.
Don't let this happen to you! Unless that gear is really right for your climbing style and your body...
Step #1: Buddy up with somebody at your gym or crag and ask for some advice...or buy them a drink for making a trip to the gear shop with you.
Step #2: Regarding Harness: As a new climber, you will probably be spending plenty of time hanging in your harness...so hang on your harness in the store. For like 5 minutes. Try 2 or 3 in your price range. Things to watch for:
* How's it Hangin': You shouldn't be "tipping over backwards" in the harness too far. If you are, this means that it isn't fitting your dimensions just right. The ladies harnesses, such as the one you mentioned, are designed to have the correct "rise" for women...so this could be good for you. However, the Metolius line of harnesses have an "adjustable rise" the person in the store can help you adjust it.
* Comfort: Are the leg loops digging in too hard? When you are new, "hang time" may happen more often than not. Be sure the leg loops don't cut your skin. Nothing will be super comfy, but some, like the Petzl line, can be pretty sharp along the edges of the leg loops.
* Adjustability: If you think you will be climbing in cold weather or your weight fluctuates, you may want harnesses with buckles on the leg loops so that you can adjust the size. If your really get into climbing, your body may change quite a bit. The waist belt adjustment is important, too. Make sure you don't get harness that is big on you now...when you trim down, the "swami" or belt of the harness could become too loose.
Regarding Shoes:
New Climber - Comfort First: When you are new, you won't be doning a ton of "highly technical" stuff. Super tight shoes can help with super technical stuff. But when you are new, and your feet are weak and vulnerable, and your holds are the size of coffee tables, best to get a shoe that you can be comfortable in. Your feet will thank you.
What does this mean?: If you look at the shape of shoes, some have a huge "Cup" in the heel, others have a heel more like a normal shoe. For women especially, the more normal type heel is probably going to be more comfortable. The cup is really like a sligshot driving your toes into the bottom of the shoe...this can be hard on new climber feet and won't help much, anyway.
Shoe Selection: You can spend $50 dollars on shoes, or $150 on shoes. What should you do? As a newer climber, your technique will probably be pretty bad. You will scrape your toes, drag your toes on the rock, and burn through your first pair of shoes kinda quick...if your gym has textured walls or your outdoor rock is really grainy.
Also, as a new climber, the first pair of shoes you get may not be the ones you stick with for a long time. So spending less on your first pair may not be a bad idea. Try Madrock. They wear faster, but you'll enjoy the sticky rubber and they have plenty of nice designs to chose from.
Stiffness: Some shoes which do not have laces or velcro are referred to as Slippers. These shoes often have very flexible soles. (Twist and bend some climbing shoes, see the difference.) A super-flexible shoe works best for someone with strong feet already. You might want to get a shoe that is a happy medium...letting you climb for longer and giving your feet time to adjust to climbing shoes.
Size: Street to climbing shoe translations vary. If at all possible, just try on shoes. Look for gaps and air pockets around your toes, in your arch, or in your heel. If these exist, your shoes are too big. If downsizing to eliminate these pockets means your shoe has to really hurt, then the shoe isn't right for your foot. Try another. Try like 10. You'll figure it out.
Regarding the Prima: I think this shoe is not so good for a new climber. It is made like crap (or so it seems), seems too floppy for a first shoe, and is (IMO) just one more example of marketing crap to female climbers who want to be girly. My opinion, take it or leave it. Anyway. I tried some on and was disgusted. Try some real shoes, and the Prima. If the prima is perfect for your foot, then it is perfect for you. Otherwise get something else. Don't be a victem of "girls will buy it" marketing.
Anyway, time for me to go get a life.
Have fun.
:)
-Kate.
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fulton
Nov 19, 2005, 9:40 PM
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Hey Buddy - Take this advice.
Buy some books. Moutaineering Freedom of the Hills (now in its 7th ed.) is the single most important peice of 'gear' you need (John Long's books are also critical).
Don't trust people's advice because in you think they're an awesome climber - do your own homework and become a student of this craft.
Gear doesn't make you not suck - knowlage will help make you not suck. (wow, now that's deep)
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holdplease2
Nov 19, 2005, 9:48 PM
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If you get knowledge from a sucky source then the knowlede sucks and you will suck more but think that you do not suck, which is way sucky. If you suck knowledge, use a filter on the straw...common sense.
With enough gear and if you suck enough, you will default to aid climbing...which, of course, sucks.
Try the Yates Shield and some Scarpa Lite Ascents.
:)
-Kate.
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avue_striker85
Nov 19, 2005, 9:59 PM
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Im also new, bought the mad rock phenioxs and they feel great on my foot, a little tight but Im sure they loosen up a bit. Anyway I just thought Id say, you found a great sight, the people on here have been great about answering my questions and what they say is 100% correct. Do your homework ask people on RC, go to a local club or gym and hang out talk to people and read...there is a lot of very affordable books out there on climbing that will get you familer with terminology and basic "tech". Of course your greatest gain in knowledge is climbing, you will learn more from trying to climb (with help if needed) than any other form of learning because the more you climb the more youll understand the how tos and whys of every movement and desition.
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grovehunter
Nov 19, 2005, 11:40 PM
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Registered: Sep 29, 2005
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I agree with Kate.
Hang in the harness for at least five minutes. I grabbed a book and sat there and read for twenty mins. I might be able to sleep in my harness and be comfy. Shoes, ask if you can walk around the store in them a while. I wasn't looking for a particular brand as much as I was the best fitting gear!!! Like kate said don't fall victim to the gotta get brand X because it's supposed to be best. The most comfortable shoes and harness of any quality brand is the one for you!!
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jimdavis
Nov 20, 2005, 3:05 AM
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I know a few people that use the saphires and love them...not beginners though, so i dunno what beginners think of them.
get the most comfortable harness you can afford. I bought the men's version of your harness, then started working with an instructional program...hung in the harness a lot, got tire of it got a new one. joined a high angle rescue team...lots of hanging in the harness, bought a new one. put up 200+ holds the other day in a new gym, spent hours hanging in the friggin thing...buying a new harness as soon as i can afford one.
spend the money on a good one if you can. it'll be well worth your while.
cheers,
Jim
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tarzan420
Nov 20, 2005, 3:37 AM
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Registered: Jun 19, 2002
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I know several women who climb in the La Sportiva Women's Mythos, every one I've talked to likes them. The men's mythos might not be bad to consider either, as plenty of women have been climbing in those for years. The biggest drawback to the mythos, however, is the price. They're not cheap.
Nothing new to say about harnesses - buy one that feels good after you've hung in it for a couple minutes.
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stymingersfink
Nov 22, 2005, 9:55 PM
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Registered: Aug 12, 2003
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If you've read anything past what Kate had to say, you've read too far. Now go back up here and read it again.
(If your shoe salesman doesn't know at least this much:
Lined or synthetic shoes = no or minimal stretch
unlined leather = variable stretch (the tighter you buy them, the more they'll stretch. to a point)
shop somewhere else. and NOT online.)
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tnmountainman
Nov 22, 2005, 11:02 PM
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Registered: Oct 19, 2005
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I read this thread topic and thought, :shock: wow I can post inteligently on this because I have been a beginner for about 5 years now :lol:
Then I read kate's post and well, got noting to say. Hope that you have tons of fun in the greatest sport there is :D
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girlyoutalkto
Nov 22, 2005, 11:31 PM
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Registered: Oct 13, 2005
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I have the Sapphires and I love them, personally. They're my first (and only, currently) shoe and they're great. They fit perfectly to my foot. I take a size 8.5-9 in reg. shoes and I got an 8 in the Sapphires, which seems to be the perfect balance between performance and comfort, especially for a beginner. Hope this helps!
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kirsten00
Dec 13, 2005, 1:57 AM
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Registered: Dec 12, 2005
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I have a pair of Sapphires also and they do me just dandy.
I also have a pair of Mad Rock, I like them a lot :)
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bobruef
Dec 13, 2005, 2:56 AM
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My wife tried the saphires and really liked them. Another great shoe is the madrock flash. A great all-around shoe for seventy bucks. I'd find a pair of shoes that are comfortable, but fairly snug. Don't go two sizes smaller. Leather shoes like the saphires stretch, but synthetics like the madrocks don't stretch as much.
As for a harness, as everyone else has said, try quite a few. Black Daimond makes a great harness for the money. If you don't mind spending twenty or so extra bucks, Petzl Harnesses are extreemly comfortable. The buckles are auto-doubled back too, which makes getting in and out of them a dream.
Good luck and Have fun.
WATCH OUT, ITS ADDICTING AS HELL!!!
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hereandthere
Dec 13, 2005, 3:03 AM
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If I were you I would try on as many shoes as you can and get a comfortable pair, then later on get a more technical tighter fitting pair. then you'll have a pair for multipitch and a pair for bouldering and the shorter stuff.
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sbaclimber
Dec 13, 2005, 3:18 AM
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In reply to: Anyway I just thought Id say, you found a great sight, the people on here have been great about answering my questions and what they say is 100% correct.
I really, really hope you didn't mean that!
btw, it is a website not a websight (although, some of the photos tend to show some pretty nice 'sights' :wink: )
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