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leeper_z
Aug 15, 2002, 4:21 AM
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Anyone have any insight into how to get my partner with attention deficit disorder to pay attention to the climber while belaying? Has anyone delt with this sort of problem before?
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chrisshaeffer
Aug 15, 2002, 4:52 AM
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Here's one thing I do with ADD kids- not sure if your partner will go for it. Probably not, but...
I give them a rubber band and have them loop one end around their pinky, take it across the back of their hand, then loop the other end around their thumb. They have to try and get it off without using their other hand.
Works like magic. The kid twists his hand around like mad trying to get it off, but can pay attention to whatever else he/she needs to.
So maybe if YOU do that (on your non-braking hand, of course) while belaying your partner saying its a trick you use to keep from getting bored while belaying, maybe your partner will give it a shot.
Maybe the principle behind it will give you (or others) some more reasonable ideas.
Best I could do on short notice. I'll think about it some more. I deal with ADD kids and adults a lot.
Chris
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apollodorus
Aug 15, 2002, 5:12 AM
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Gri-Gri. My partner swears by it when he's on lead.
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paintinhaler
Aug 15, 2002, 5:20 AM
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I think a few too many have this A.D.D.
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collegekid
Aug 15, 2002, 5:25 AM
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i know, throw rocks at 'em
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nailzz
Aug 15, 2002, 6:54 AM
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I agree with Apol... however you spell the rest of his name.
Gri-gri
It's not 100% secure but I'm pretty sure I've had a sleeping belayer catch me with one.
I guess it just depends on how desperate you are to have a belay slave.
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cragstar
Aug 15, 2002, 7:54 PM
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chrisshaeffer has the perfect solution. I have A.D.D. and all I need to pay attention to something is to have something else to pay attention to. for example when I do homework I cant concentrate unless I have the tv or radio on at the same time.
[ This Message was edited by: cragstar on 2002-08-15 12:55 ]
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pbjosh
Aug 16, 2002, 7:10 AM
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Sounds dangerous to me - remember, this is your life on the line! I'd personally look for a different partner. There are a lot of other times in climbing when a space-case partner (no offense to the ADD folks of the world) can be downright dangerous.
The Gri-gri suggestion isn't a bad one, but I don't like gri-gri's for lead belays (except on walls - static catches can be bad plus they INDUCE attention deficit through the concept of "hands free"). However wall belays can be SO LENGTHY and you already have a Gri-gri anyways 'cause they're SO USEFUL that you better use it so you CAN nap while your partner leads. Also, for a quick/hard clip it's hard to feed slack fast enough with a gri-gri. Somehow this isn't a problem on walls
josh
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wildtrail
Aug 16, 2002, 10:01 AM
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I have ADHD. I pay attention. I value my partner's life (not saying that your partner doesn't value you). It doesn't take much for me to pay attention when it comes to something like that. However, is he on meds? If not, get him to a shrink and get him on the appropriate meds.
Steve
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hangerlessbolt
Aug 16, 2002, 7:31 PM
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I would say that for most people, belaying is pretty boring...especially if you can't see the climber (i.e. multi-pitch routes on wandering terrain).
If you've ever belayed in the baking sun on the 6th pitch of a 15-pitch route...your mind's going to drift. You're going to think about water, or shade, or food, or work, or cleaning the route, or a million other things. You're going to pay out rope as you need to... and when that rope goes taught, it's going to take you a second to figure out whether your partner needs slack or is falling. Hopefully you'll lock down unless you hear a call otherwise.
But in any event...I find the best way for me to make sure that my belayer is alert or at the very least AWAKE is to talk to him/her.
“Hey bro, how are we looking…?”…”How do those first few pieces look?”…”Do you recall how long this pitch is?”…”Hey man, it’s really getting windy up here…it may be hard to communicate…so keep an ear out…”
Because even if all this jabber gets them irritated…they’re still paying attention.
*Grin*
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calamity_chk
Aug 16, 2002, 7:52 PM
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A slightly different perspective, and certainly more revealing regarding my own personal psychosis, but when I'm bored, I pretend like I'm fishing.
I keep my left hand up on the rope going to the climber and try to see if I can "feel" his movement. Of course, I also enjoy fishing. :shrugs:
On the other hand, if you dont feel safe, invest in finding another belayer ..
Side note: the rubberband idea seems fun.
[ This Message was edited by: clymbr_chk on 2002-08-16 12:56 ]
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msecoda
Aug 16, 2002, 8:31 PM
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I have 'advanced delusionary schizophrenia with involuntary narcissistic rage' and it never affects me
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wildtrail
Aug 16, 2002, 8:48 PM
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Hey Wes!
I don't have ADD. I have ADHD. That makes me better because it is two problems in one. Cool hey? People with ADD are just trying to be cool like us with ADHD!
Steve
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drewcoleman
Aug 16, 2002, 8:54 PM
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Get a new partner.
Drew
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addictedtocrack
Aug 16, 2002, 9:05 PM
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My 8 y/o son has ADHD and something I have found out with him and his attention span is he has to select his activity to really want to pay close attention. Otherwise, he isn't into it.
Allowing someone the option to chosing their activities enables them control.
There are alot of really good suggestions written before me and in my opinion, I would suggest them to your partner and let your partner chose...Also, have your partner ask him/herslf whether or not he/she enjoys belaying.
Best option with any relationship is communication which would mean including your partner in the decision making process. Both you and your partner will benefit from it whatever the outcome.
DeAyn
[ This Message was edited by: addictedtocrack on 2002-08-16 14:06 ]
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blindslap
Aug 16, 2002, 9:54 PM
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the rubber band things impossible. i fiddled with it until my fingers hurt, but could still read the rest of the post.'
nice idea!
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climbingpride
Aug 16, 2002, 11:14 PM
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LOL
The gri-gri is the best idea or just get someone else. People with ADD and ADHD are just hilarious. They might not be the best to have to belay you but man they can be pretty funny and the butt of some good jokes.
Pride
Sorry not trying to make fun of people with disables.
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chrisshaeffer
Aug 17, 2002, 4:33 AM
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Incidently, I've found that the kids I work with that have AD(H)D are always the most observant and aware- if they aren't on mind-dulling meds. They notice EVERYTHING.
I'm a big fan of ADHD. I don't think ADD and ADHD are really problems- I just think mundane life is too d@mn boring for people who really have their senses blown open. I think that's something most climbers can identify with.
Folks with ADHD and ADD still need to live in the "one-thing-at-a-time" world, though, so if your buddy doesn't do well focusing on the belay when your LIFE is in danger, I'd talk with him/her about it and explain how you feel. I'd play down the fact that you think their ADD is a problem and play up the fact that when they drift off you feel like you are going to DIE.
If that doesn't take, let them know that you'll have to find a new partner.
Oh- the rubberband thing isn't exactly impossible, but if the rubber band is tight it can be. I'm glad a few people tried it. I never thought it would work until I had a kid with horrible ADHD and gave it a shot. It really does work like magic.
Good luck,
Chris
(Edit- had a wierd sentance that made it seem like I thought AD(H)D was a problem...tried to fix it. Late on Friday...)
[ This Message was edited by: chrisshaeffer on 2002-08-16 22:33 ]
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amberlw
Aug 17, 2002, 1:12 PM
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Is your partner being safe?? If you fall will he/she brake? Ask theese questions before you get a new partner...
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aeile
Aug 17, 2002, 4:11 PM
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Try finding something close to the object (you) for them to focus on while they are belaying, such as a odd piece of scenery (ie part of the wall that has a detail or a unusual formation on the wall etc) so that they are looking in the general vacinity in case any, er, action ensues. It's not that they zone out, it's that their minds multitask... if you can entertain their minds with something Right There (or rather a few somethings, 5 is a good number) then it's more likely that they will be alert to what's going on.
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boulder-boy
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Aug 17, 2002, 5:11 PM
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In order to concentrate on my climbing, I need and have full trust in my belayer. If I would have to worry about him/her also, I would not to be able to climb what I climb, and I would not have any fun in doing so. I personally would find a belayer, with whom you feel 100% comfortable with. If the belayer is not doing his job, or can't pay attention, it may very well be your life on the line. Simple enough.
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rockjock04
Aug 17, 2002, 5:28 PM
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I MAY know a few people with add/adhd, I'm not sure. But what I did know is that I didn't want them to belay me.
But once we got to the gym and everyone was doing there own thing with who ever, I saw these people belaying, even though without getting gym-belay-approval, (although they were doing it correctly). But what struck me was their concentration. They knew what they were doing was going to make the difference in whether someone lived or died. And so they made sure they did it right.
My normal partner seems to be somewhat laid-back when he belays. Perhaps it is his over-self-confidence?
As said before, just rub into these guys' heads that what they are doing is life threatening.
If they can't accept that, or they continue to be inattentive, I would find a new partner.
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redzit
Aug 18, 2002, 1:04 AM
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I have ADHD. I also Have a Father who is in the business of Failure Analysis. And i find that my dad's tendincy to tell me what i did wrong, and why what happened is my fault (As it usualy is) is accualy very useful. So, what does that mean? Talk the belayer to death. Hammer it in to their heads how you feel then you look down and they are off in a dream land just looking around. instead of focusing on you. Then, when they seem to get it, and look like they can handle the job, Hammer it in some more. And jump on every opportunity to tell them.
Another thing is to go on lead. on lead, the belayer can't llok down cause every 2 seconds he has to do something, Pay out rope, take it in, catch you, etc... it might be more risky to second.
if they are on meds, tell them to take a little more of it. most of us have a range in the amount we can take and very few are at the high extreme of this range. but be careful, too much and the person become dazed and can't focus on anything.
Now the upside of havign an ADHD Belayer. WE ARE VERY AWARE OF THINGS AND EVERYTHING CATCHES OUR ATTENTION. That is wy we make good pilots. we can spot the other plane, or mountain or whatever, much earlyer then others can. this means that when you fall, even though your partiner is looking away, he or she is aware of the fact that you need to be caught.
This is also, agian, useful on lead. they can spot when your in trouble, if you back clipped, if your foot is caught around the rope etc...
Final thing. If the person has a very extreme case of AD(H)D. They may not be fit for such a sport. IF may be just plain and simple fact that sadly, they cannot haddle it. although this is very unusual. normaly, as far as i know, once they have a little expierisence beind them, they will be a great belayer and will not get destracted.
Thats it for my ramble. May be i need to take MY Meds. i talk to too much.
P.S. NO STONE THROWING. NOT FUNNY
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danyelle
Aug 18, 2002, 1:41 AM
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As an adult climber with ADD I can empathize with your situation. Gri-gri is definately a good start. Also possibly holding a conversation about the beta you are getting while climbing will help your partner focus. It isn't so much that they don't want to focus but there minds will wander if not kept on task.
I personally find if I am following a route that I have never climbed before it helps me to pay attention to my belaying skills just by focusing on the moves of my partner. I am naturally interested in their movements as I will be needing to possibly repeat them when it is my turn. This natural attention getter has always been the most successful for me in many walks of life not just climbing. The less concentration you try to devote to avoiding your ADD and the more natural the occurances to try and break the ADD tendencies, the more successful the outcome.
Hope these comments help. Good Luck.
~Danyelle
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maskokalover
Aug 19, 2002, 1:38 AM
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eeyy, i have ADD, and i never really had a problem belaying my partner..
like, sure every now and then my mind drifts off, but...
ive never had a ny problem with it...
------
Cheers
~mark
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