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kmc
Apr 27, 2007, 4:02 PM
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I fell on my first screamer the other day. I had clipped it to a rusty old pin protecting a crux roof, which probably would have held with just a sling, but I wanted to stay on the safe side. The fall was not very long, so the screamer only opened up a little bit. About 1/4 inch of stiching pulled, and the rest of it is intact (it is a standard screamer, not an ice or zipper screamer). Do you guys think I should continue to use it, or just for fun and to satisfy my curiousity, should I take a big fall in the gym on it?
I know that if it is partially torn, it will slightly reduce the amount of force it will absorb, and it will probably activate at a lower force now. Would that be enough to make you retire it, or still use it on pieces that could probably hold a fall but your just not 100% sure?
Thanks.
~Kevin
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greenketch
Apr 27, 2007, 4:16 PM
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Your fine, However this is the start of a long flame involving physics and other random thoughts Spmetimes I love this board just for the humor.
A screamer is when fully deployed a full strength sling. It will hold you no matter what. Now as to the force. The stitching rips at a set force. This disappates energy that hasbeen accumulated in the fall. The more stitching you have to rip the more dissappation that occurs. It all happens at the same force. Just over more time. So on this screamer it willnothelp as much as a completly intact one. I keep like ones around for those placements that are probably ok but I just feel like helping. Don't use it if you really will need the help of a screamer.
Let the spray Begin
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kmc
Apr 27, 2007, 4:31 PM
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Thanks for the reply.
I understand the physics behind how a screamer works and how it absorbs force. I just wasnt sure if it would still be able to absorb enough force to make it even worth carrying with me now that it was partially opened.
And yes, I do realize this will probably start a battle. And I know that someone will eventually give the answer, "if you dont trust it, dont use it". Just looking for other opinions, thats all.
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caughtinside
Apr 27, 2007, 5:13 PM
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strengthwise, your screamer is still rated to something like 22kn, so it is still safe.
And, as the other poster pointed out, its ability to absorb force is obviously lessened. But it sounds like there is still some gas in the tank?
If it were me, I'd probably retire it, just because. But if you want to keep using it, go ahead, just be concious of it's new limitations. You might want to kind of repack the deployed part and snap a rubber band around it or something to get it back to it's original length? I think a longer screamer, all floppy with blown stiches everywhere, would be kind of annoying on the rack.
And it will probably freak your partners a bit! hahaha
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coastal_climber
Apr 27, 2007, 5:26 PM
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It's fine, it hasn't reached the end where the brunt of the weight will be held. They are rated for ripping force and end to end force. It might rip easier, but still hold you once you get to the end.
>Cam
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stymingersfink
Apr 27, 2007, 9:19 PM
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coastal_climber wrote: It's fine, it hasn't reached the end where the brunt of the weight will be held. They are rated for ripping force and end to end force. It might rip easier, but still hold you once you get to the end. >Cam
i've heard stories of guys on hard-aid pre-cutting some of the shock-absorbing stitching in order to get them to activate at lower loads. this would probably entail working just one side of the stitching, since if one were to work the stitching out completely across the width of the stitching what would that accomplish?
Probably fine, and if it were mine I would still use it, all things being equal.
I'd bet the sound of the thing ripping gave you a bit of a start though, eh?
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kmc
Apr 28, 2007, 12:48 AM
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To be honest with you, I didnt hear a thing. Probably because not much of it actually ripped, and I was cursing and grunting as I was falling. Couldnt hear much of anything over that.
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tradmanclimbs
Apr 29, 2007, 10:17 AM
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You may use your screamer for extended periods of time untill you are both satisfyed. failing to satisfy your screamer may result in your screamer finding a new partner and denying you further access to the screamer. Useing propper protection when your screamer deploys is highly recomended. Failing to use proper protection when your screamer deploys may result in dammaged equiptment or the creation of a small smelly annoying little expensive screamer.
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rocknice2
Apr 29, 2007, 12:02 PM
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Don't you just hate it when you get your nuts stuck in the crack.
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mushroomsamba
May 3, 2007, 6:04 PM
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I fell on one at a rope course where I work. It was scary as hell. I thought my self belay stuff had broken because I fell the extra distance before it finnaly caught me.
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lil_monkey
May 4, 2007, 2:55 PM
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if you don't trust it, don't use it
peace
(This post was edited by lil_monkey on May 4, 2007, 2:56 PM)
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cchildre
May 4, 2007, 3:26 PM
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rocknice2 wrote: Don't you just hate it when you get your nuts stuck in the crack.
So long as I can get a good fist jam in....it is all money...
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hiyapokey
May 4, 2007, 5:34 PM
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I'm working on the "weiner jam" for off finger cracks.
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catbird_seat
May 4, 2007, 11:13 PM
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stymingersfink wrote: i've heard stories of guys on hard-aid pre-cutting some of the shock-absorbing stitching in order to get them to activate at lower loads. this would probably entail working just one side of the stitching, since if one were to work the stitching out completely across the width of the stitching what would that accomplish?
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stymingersfink
May 6, 2007, 1:11 AM
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catbird_seat wrote: stymingersfink wrote: i've heard stories of guys on hard-aid pre-cutting some of the shock-absorbing stitching in order to get them to activate at lower loads. this would probably entail working just one side of the stitching, since if one were to work the stitching out completely across the width of the stitching what would that accomplish? That is why Yates makes the ScreamAid. This sling has a lower activation energy. It also has less ability to absorb energy,
catbird_seat wrote: ...but then an aid fall is generally short.
one take-aways from that TR of hers: don't girth-hitch wires. EVER! i'm just glad she lived to tell about it.
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8flood8
May 6, 2007, 2:20 AM
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could you please restate your last sentence? i didn't understand what you were saying....
if you don't mind
and how do you mean girth hitching a wire? you mean girth hitching a sling on a wire? or girth hitching a wire on itself?
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stymingersfink
May 6, 2007, 2:34 AM
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take-away: lesson to be learned
girth-hitch a wire: girth-hitch a piece of software to a piece of hardware. i don't imagine girth-hitching two stoppers together to be all that dangerous, but software:hardware is a sure point of failure.
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8flood8
May 6, 2007, 2:48 AM
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excellent, that all makes sense, thank you!
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stymingersfink
May 6, 2007, 3:06 AM
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just keep in mind that girth-hitching generally reduces strength by ~50% (IIRC), so to girth-hitch two wires rated to 10kN would give a resulting strength of ~5kN (again, IIRC).
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8flood8
May 6, 2007, 7:10 AM
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hijack -
so does that mean that my metolius pas (which is girth hitched to my harness) is only good for half of the rating?
(not that i'm going to be taking dynamic falls on a piece of static gear...)
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shanz
May 6, 2007, 12:50 PM
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tradmanclimbs wrote: You may use your screamer for extended periods of time untill you are both satisfyed. failing to satisfy your screamer may result in your screamer finding a new partner and denying you further access to the screamer. Useing propper protection when your screamer deploys is highly recomended. Failing to use proper protection when your screamer deploys may result in dammaged equiptment or the creation of a small smelly annoying little expensive screamer.
Hah i was thinking along these lines before i even read to post - if your screamer only partially pops then you havent done your job
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napoleon_in_rags
May 10, 2007, 4:21 PM
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kmc wrote: I fell on my first screamer the other day. I had clipped it to a rusty old pin protecting a crux roof, which probably would have held with just a sling, but I wanted to stay on the safe side. The fall was not very long, so the screamer only opened up a little bit. About 1/4 inch of stiching pulled, and the rest of it is intact (it is a standard screamer, not an ice or zipper screamer). Do you guys think I should continue to use it, or just for fun and to satisfy my curiousity, should I take a big fall in the gym on it? I know that if it is partially torn, it will slightly reduce the amount of force it will absorb, and it will probably activate at a lower force now. Would that be enough to make you retire it, or still use it on pieces that could probably hold a fall but your just not 100% sure? Thanks. ~Kevin
Just get a sewing machine and resew the ripped area. I mean, what does Yates do that is so special?
-Pete
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greenketch
May 10, 2007, 6:03 PM
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napoleon_in_rags wrote: Just get a sewing machine and resew the ripped area. I mean, what does Yates do that is so special? -Pete
I would sincerly hope this is a troll. Unless you have some background to calculate stitching type and thread. Then the quantity of same to achieve the desired rupture force. I would not go there. The difference between a Bomber quickdraw and a screamer is only the type of stitching. 
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healyje
May 15, 2007, 5:41 AM
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catbird_seat wrote: stymingersfink wrote: i've heard stories of guys on hard-aid pre-cutting some of the shock-absorbing stitching in order to get them to activate at lower loads. this would probably entail working just one side of the stitching, since if one were to work the stitching out completely across the width of the stitching what would that accomplish? That is why Yates makes the ScreamAid. This sling has a lower activation energy. It also has less ability to absorb energy, but then an aid fall is generally short. They are also lighter than the other Screamers.
I've been pre-slicing since 'Air Voyager' days - but all my applications have been for free climbing, not aid. And I have pre-sliced ScreamAids as well; their loading curve is still just too steep for some applications I use them for, like smaller Crack N'Ups and nests of RP's that need to equalize properly before loading, or slotted hooks. Sometimes I want loading to start at < 10 pounds and ramp up in a relatively flat, curve. The cuts I use can be visualized as a very steep angle across the screamer, but is more digital in terms of how far each seam is cut.
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flamer
May 15, 2007, 11:30 PM
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8flood8 wrote: metolius pas
Do yourself a favor, use a nylon daisy instead.
josh
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