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woodpecker
Jun 13, 2007, 2:01 PM
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I've turned into quite a gear whore and on multi pitch route I cant fit anymore pro on my gear loops, but dont want to use a sling.
Any ideas?
How do you rack gear when your gear loops are full?
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joeforte
Jun 13, 2007, 2:18 PM
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1. Try girth hitching small 8" slings to the back two loops, which will give you two vertical loops as well for racking extra lockers, biners, ect...
2. Rack your smallest cams in gangs of 2, 3, or 4 on one biner.
3. Learn to do more with less. Makes sure all of your gear is versitile, and multifunctional. For example, a trad draw is much more versitile than a sport draw.
4. You can also carry fewer slings on your harness, and more over your shoulder, with biners already on them ready to go.
5. When you arrive at the belay, see what you have leftover, that you didn't use in the pitch. If you keep seeing the same gear never used, you can start paring it down. You'll become more fast and efficient with your placements once you find your staple rack.
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csproul
Jun 13, 2007, 2:19 PM
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Carry less gear. Really, that is usually my first thought when my loops are getting full. I have a partner who racks gear onto other carabiners that are clipped to his gear loops and this saves some room. Picture a runner clipped to the gear loop and then several other runners clipped to that runner's top biner. Or a large pear biner on the loop with several pieces of gear attached to the pear instead of the gear loop. I also went to clipping multiple cams to a single biner instead of each cam on its own to save some weight and space.
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angry
Jun 13, 2007, 2:19 PM
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No room on your gear loops and you don't want to use a sling?
Hmmm, how about a soft fuzzy shirt and velcro on all your gear? That way you could just stick it to yourself. It's brilliant!!!
Or you could just clip two like sized pieces together, effectively doubling what you can carry. It's slow and cumbersome, I'd rather stick a red hot poker up my ass than use this technique. A gear sling is great, give it a try, you might like it.
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wings
Jun 13, 2007, 2:28 PM
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Get a harness with more gear loops.
Or carry less gear. Being a gear whore doesn't mean you have to carry all of it up every climb.
- Seyil
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el_layclimber
Jun 13, 2007, 2:33 PM
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wings wrote: Or carry less gear. Being a gear whore doesn't mean you have to carry all of it up every climb. - Seyil
I agree wholeheartedly. Carry less on the climb. True gear whoredom is not about what you carry on the climb, it's about what you have sitting unused in a closet.
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justthemaid
Jun 13, 2007, 2:53 PM
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angry wrote: No room on your gear loops and you don't want to use a sling? Hmmm, how about a soft fuzzy shirt and velcro on all your gear? That way you could just stick it to yourself. It's brilliant!!!
LOL That IS brilliant! Where do I get one?
Well, I'm in the OP's camp. I don't like gear slings.
I've started carrying most of my slings and biners around my shoulder. I've been told this may be problematic when leading harder routes but the crap I lead is so easy it hasn't been an issue. It frees up a gear loop. I only double 4 smallest cams and try to leave the least-used gear on the ground.
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markc
Jun 13, 2007, 3:13 PM
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I rack pro on the harness, and carry all of my slings (15 + a screamer) on a gear sling. My Misty Mountain harness has six gear loops, which is a big advantage for organization. Two of the rear loops are stacked over the lower loops, so gear on the bottom loop isn't easily accessed mid-pitch. That's where I keep belay devices, spare lockers, and my 'oh shit' biner.
What are you carrying on each pitch? Have you been keeping both slings and protection on the harness? That's bound to get crowded. I find it a pain to pull 2' slings over my head for each clip. Having them clipped on a sling keeps them accessible, and it's not nearly as bothersome as the weight of a rack.
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elwood54
Jun 13, 2007, 3:29 PM
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I carry a ton of shit too, and I've seen that Misty harness...I have to try it out, my gear sling keeps getting in the way.
I'm doubled up on BD cams from .4-1, carry 4 c3s, a green alien (I climb at the gunks), BD cams 2, 3 & sometimes a 4, a set and half of nuts, 4 tri-cams, and 15 trad QDs, a screamer, and 2 double-length runners with one biner each...I also like to link two pitches into one. Oh yeah, also every cam has its own biner except for 3 c3s, which are on one. Cant forget the extra lockers, the cordelette, and nut tool, ATC Guide...bla bla bla.
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wings
Jun 13, 2007, 3:46 PM
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That is, indeed, a
elwood54 wrote: ton of shit
But, I guess, to each their own. My rack weighs 7.5 pounds (11 nuts, 9 cams, 10 draws). I can rack everything on a Cadillac without any problems.
- Seyil
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psprings
Jun 13, 2007, 3:48 PM
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Hey,
Ditto on the "taking less".
I went from racking all pro on a sling to racking all pro on my harness.
I've come to a bit more of a happy medium as of late:
1. I rack all of my draws/biners on the back gear
loops of my harness (so I know what I'm grabbing without looking)
2. I rack my large cams on my front gear loops, along with my nuts and tricams (though I've been playing around with racking the nuts on my gear sling lately)
3. I rack my TCUs and my micronuts on my gear sling.
I find it works well... no mega swing-age of large cams on the gear sling pulling the whole thing forward, which was my major complaint for racking all the pro on my gear sling. Plus, I just use a 9mm cord for racking... no need to have something comfy or divided with 4 gear loops or whatever, if you don't have ALL that weight hanging on your shoulder, or that much crap to sort through.
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granite_grrl
Jun 13, 2007, 3:52 PM
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What the hell are you carrying that you don't have room on your gear loops anymore?
Sugestions on reducing gear/gear space: double up on the passive pro, for general routes carry a single set of cams up, but double nuts, tri-cams, even hexes for the larger sizes. If splitters tailor your rack for the specific climb, only bring up what you need.
If you need to double up on different sizes for different pitches make your second carry up the extra gear for the next pitch.
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sactownclimber
Jun 13, 2007, 4:59 PM
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I would suggest two things that worked for me:
1) Buy a Misty Mountain Cadillac. Bought one last season . . . and it's the bomb.
2) Methodically thin out your rack . . . I used to carry WAY more gear than I would ever place on a climb . . . and so I forced myself to be honest about what I actually needed to bring. It was a painful process but worth it since I've slowly started to figure out exactly what I need to bring with me.
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shimanilami
Jun 13, 2007, 5:27 PM
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Another option not yet suggested: only carry the stuff you think you'll need on each pitch, and leave the rest with your partner. For me, on multipitch climbs, this usually means I'm leaving the big cams and perhaps half of my runners at the belay.
If you really need the stuff, you can bring it up on your tag line.
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blueeyedclimber
Jun 13, 2007, 6:12 PM
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What I carry and how I rack is totally climb and pitch dependent. How much and what I carry depends on how hard the climb is, what type of climbing (crack, face), how familiar with it I am, and how many pitches. A long route that I don't know much about, and I may carry my whole rack with me. When i did the Dangler at the Gunks last year, I took 4 cams and gave the rack to my partner. It is all situation dependent. I feel, though, if i put too much on my gear loops, it is harder to get off, so I generally wear a sling for my cams.
Josh
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caughtinside
Jun 13, 2007, 6:20 PM
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Learn to love the gear sling. It's your time saving best friend.
1) fast transitions at belays when swinging leads.
2) fast when at the base. You throw it on and are ready to climb. No reracking on your harness.
3) comfort. Less weight on your hips. Take it off at belays and hang it on the anchor. This includes when you're at the base. I sure don't want to walk around with 10 cams on my harness between climbs.
4) fuctionality. Just wait until you get in a corner where you're scumming for your life... and the gear you want is pinned between you and the rock.
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quiteatingmysteak
Jun 13, 2007, 6:20 PM
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4 Slider nuts and i take a few odd nuts that i tend to place more often (BD odd numbers 7, 9, 11). total of 7 nuts there instead of the 15 or so people often take.
1each BD c3#1 - c4 #3, and a few lightweight metolius to double up in the .5-1.5" range. Light weight beans on cams.
dyneema slings around shoulder, usually 10. Less quickdraws (if im running rope stretchers, about 4-6).
Can never have enough spare biners. 6 lockers. Rope hook (<3), cordalette, and thats enough to get you up anything.
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shimanilami
Jun 13, 2007, 6:21 PM
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Drifting ...
I've always been impressed with my partner, who can eye a pitch and bring exactly what he needs, and nothing more. So we're sitting at the base of Butterballs and he's got about 8 cams on his harness and a couple of draws. He's just about ready to climb. Peter Croft walks up. No partner. No gear. No rope. No harness. He asks us if we mind if he takes a lap. "Of course, not" we reply. And he solos the thing. 5.11 rattly fingers.
My partner and I look at our pile of gear and realize that we suck.
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wings
Jun 13, 2007, 6:38 PM
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I agree except ...
caughtinside wrote: Less weight on your hips.
I find that the weight on my harness affects my centre of gravity far less than on a gear sling.
- Seyil
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caughtinside
Jun 13, 2007, 6:47 PM
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wings wrote: I agree except ... caughtinside wrote: Less weight on your hips. I find that the weight on my harness affects my centre of gravity far less than on a gear sling. - Seyil
I think you're right about that actually. I personally don't like having weight on my hips for too long, get a little sore by the end of the day. I'd feel the same way about the sling, except that I take it off every belay, lets the shoulder breathe a bit. Don't get that with the harness!
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winglessangel
Jun 13, 2007, 7:26 PM
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angry wrote: No room on your gear loops and you don't want to use a sling? Hmmm, how about a soft fuzzy shirt and velcro on all your gear? That way you could just stick it to yourself. It's brilliant!!!
That is very good!!
I don't use the typical gear sling, since most trad routes around here are Multipitch it is very likely that I'll need a pack. So I bought a backpack that has a gear sling attached. works perfectly!
but if the guy doesn't want a gear sling, he probably doesn't want a pack. blah, multiple pros in on one binner is what he will get from me!!
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baja_java
Jun 13, 2007, 8:52 PM
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i clip the doubles of the same sizes together, and clip only one of their biners onto the harness gear loop:
this way, two cams are on the harness for each clip, and each cam has its own biner. this works better if you have doubles of the same brand, of course. this gives plenty of room to accommodate a standard rack of, say, double green Aliens to double blue Camalots, plus wires, plus room still for two or three big cams, or more small ones. i have a Misty Mountain Cadillac harness, the one with 6 gear loops. but i use only the two front ones for racking cams and wires, the middle ones for slings, and the back ones for belay and anchor stuff (plus approach shoes and water bottle for multi-pitch)
if you're often topping out with barely half the pieces used, then yes, rack less. if that's not the case, then lead with less as your skills progress, not because you're short on racking space. there's plenty of space. just manage it better. use a gear sling if you need, as you've mentioned. that plus the harness gear loops would make for even more space
hope that helps
Sean
(edited to fix the pic)
(This post was edited by baja_java on Jun 13, 2007, 11:02 PM)
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dirtme
Jun 13, 2007, 9:07 PM
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I can't imagine how much gear you have if you're out of space. Can you list your rack?
I can easily carry double cams from .5 - 3, a set of nuts, 12 draws, cordelette, and belay device. How much more then that do you carry?
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woodpecker
Jun 13, 2007, 9:30 PM
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First: Thanks to all for the helpfull replies. I'm not carrying much more than a set of C4's (minus top 2 sizes), top 3 sized C3's, 1-5 friends, 1 set nuts, ATC, biners/lockers, 12 trad draws, some cord, and 2 48' slings.
After reading all the posts I've just doubled up on the smaller cams (instead of independant biners), slug the slings with locker each over shoulder, and used my five-0's to separate gear a little better (so its not so crowded).
Also hung a few draws from the biner on a single draw clipped to loop. This all helped open my harness up a little and still have my gear where I like it (since I usually use the 48's at anchors anyway).
Thanks again for the help and if anyone knows where I can pick up that velcro shirt on sale PM me. Def. in the market for one of those. 
Billy
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doogle
Jun 13, 2007, 10:01 PM
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woodpecker wrote: ...and 2 48' slings.
Well there's your problem. 100 feet of webbing must take up a hell of a lot of room.
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