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petsfed


Feb 11, 2011, 8:13 PM
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LED headlamps comparable to Halogen headlamps?
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I've been using a Petzl MYO 5 for quite a few years now, and last time I hiked out in the dark, my partner observed that I should get a new lamp, since my features a halogen bulb. Now, back when I bought it, pure-led lamps simply could not throw as far as the halogen bulb could, and I've used the halogen lamp often enough that I believe one person in every party should have one (even if everybody else has just tikkas). The thing is, it chews through batteries like candy.

Is there a headlamp out there that can match the focused throwing power of a halogen bulb that isn't the Petzl Ultra (which is awesome, but most of a pound, and more than $400)?


Tjin


Feb 12, 2011, 8:17 AM
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Re: [petsfed] LED headlamps comparable to Halogen headlamps? [In reply to]
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Just look at high powered LED headlights. LED are availible in the standard 3 or 5mm LED like on most (cheap) things and the more high powered 1, 3 or 5 watt models. If you need to have halogeen power, look for the high powered 'LED"s. A proper 3watt CREE led will easily outshine your halogeen.

Have a look at:
http://www.candlepowerforums.com/ for all the info from the flashlight people's.


blondgecko
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Feb 12, 2011, 8:59 AM
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Re: [petsfed] LED headlamps comparable to Halogen headlamps? [In reply to]
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There are plenty of LED headlamps on the market these days with similar power to a halogen. What you need to look for is one with a parabolic reflector like a halogen - these use side-emitting 1 or 3-watt LEDs, and focus the beam just as well as any halogen. A lot of models allow you to switch between this and the older-style dome LEDs, which are much lower light output and unfocusable, but great for close-up work (and allow your battery to last pretty much forever).

To give you an idea of where LEDs are at these days, I've been gradually replacing the downlights in my house with LEDs. Previously we had 11W CFL fittings (supposed to be direct replacements for 50W halogen); the new 3x1W LED bulbs replace them very comfortably.


reaeper


Feb 12, 2011, 1:45 PM
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I've found that LED headlamps are actually a good bit brighter and shine farther than halogen headlamps, although the LED's I have require a battery pack on the headstrap, which although it is a tad annoying, is still worth the better lighting. If you want a good brand, check out Petzl or Princeton Tech, I got mine for a good price.


petsfed


Feb 12, 2011, 6:24 PM
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reaeper wrote:
I've found that LED headlamps are actually a good bit brighter and shine farther than halogen headlamps, although the LED's I have require a battery pack on the headstrap, which although it is a tad annoying, is still worth the better lighting. If you want a good brand, check out Petzl or Princeton Tech, I got mine for a good price.

I've never minded the headstrap.

Looks like I might start shopping around then. Thanks guys!


moose_droppings


Feb 12, 2011, 8:59 PM
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Re: [petsfed] LED headlamps comparable to Halogen headlamps? [In reply to]
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Definitely check out the BD Icon. Mine will throw a beam like a freight train. Seriously though, it will throw a usable beam a 100 yards easily and has multiple options for lighting distances and battery savings. You can find them brand new in the box on Ebay for $50 shipped to your door if you don't have a local outlet near you.

I use mine all the time and have since retired my other headlamps.


Edit: Here's my review of it;
If you need long distance lighting, then this is your toy. This lamp is as bright as the sun and you can arc weld with it too (just kidding). The four lower wattage LED's on the side are about everything you'll need, thanks to the 3 different settings. But when you need to get on route after dark, switch to the 3 watt lamp and blaze on. I've seen other lights this bright, but they're twice the money. This light is truck.



(This post was edited by moose_droppings on Feb 12, 2011, 9:05 PM)


qwert


Feb 13, 2011, 12:33 PM
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Re: [moose_droppings] LED headlamps comparable to Halogen headlamps? [In reply to]
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I cant really compare it to the halogen lamp in question, but compared to some other "traditional" lamps, my Petzl myo XP is much brighter, and lasts much much longer.

Just make sure you get a lamp with a focused, high power LED and multiple settings, and you should fine.

The myo XP has three brightness settings + a short time boost mode and a flip on difusor. So i can either have something low power, that will go on forever, or something similar to a car headlight, that will eat a bit more battery (but not nearly as much as a halogen) and quite a few things in between.

qwert


wlderdude


Feb 18, 2011, 11:11 PM
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Re: [petsfed] LED headlamps comparable to Halogen headlamps? [In reply to]
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Incandescent (for example Halogen) headlamps still have a few advantages over LEDs.

The color of incandescents is less intense on the eyes, so they have a much lower blinding effect. High power LED lights have so much glare they can make all the Tikkas and other small LED light users far less effective. Any light reflected back at you, for example when there is a mist or fog, will not start shrinking your pupils, either. The color spectrum of the incandescents sometimes keeps a 3D perspective in some environments where the choppy spectrum of an LED can appear flat.

LED lights these days are focused tighter and can throw farther than incandescents, but these are not necessarily assets in a headlamp where keeping a big picture view is important. Unless you are competing with other light sources (such as on the side of a busy highway), having superbright lights right in your face can be self defeating.

If people in your groups are using unnecessarily bright headlamps, you may be stuck needing one so that the glare from theirs doesn't leave you unable to see. The appeal of LED light on the showroom floor has left incandescent lights looking entirely obsolete.

You can actually get better light and more of it if you use rechargeable NiMh batteries or disposable lithiums. The sticker shock turns most people off, but they work out to be more economical in most lights. Alkalines only have good light for the first 20% or so of their total life and have a really short life when it gets cold. You might want to give them a try and see how you like them. Costoco sells a big pack of Sanyo Eneloops (best rechargables on the market) for a pretty good price.


trenchdigger


Feb 19, 2011, 12:11 AM
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Re: [petsfed] LED headlamps comparable to Halogen headlamps? [In reply to]
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Halogen bulbs have all but gone the way of the dodo, and for good reason. You can now get LEDs that cast an equally bright (if not brighter), higher quality beam with much greater efficiency.

I think the #1 choice right now for a powerful, bright, small, light, durable headlamp are the options from Zebralight.



I've got the 200Lm version and am very happy with it. It's exceptionally bright when you need it, with a good balance of spot and spill beam. It also has a superb "moonlight" mode for when you need some light, but don't want to kill your night vision or wake up everyone else. On top of that, it runs off of a single AA battery making carrying extras a cinch.

There's also a "Neutral White" 172Lm version that I probably would have picked if it had been available when I purchased mine.

At $64, they're a bargain for the the quality and caliber of headlamp you get. They're really as bright as I think I'd want to go with a headlamp. If I need more throw for searching, I prefer a hand-held light.


mattm


Feb 19, 2011, 3:28 PM
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Re: [petsfed] LED headlamps comparable to Halogen headlamps? [In reply to]
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Candlepower Forum is the place to go. Those guys are downright scary with what they know about LEDs. Great Resource.

You can get headlamps over 200 lumens these days. Not by the climbing companies per-se so they might lack the "refinement" of a BD, Petzl etc but they're cutting edge with light output. Fenix, 4 Sevens are both solid companies that make a good product (I have them for many of my EDC flashlights)

If you read the forums over there they comment on the mainstream players (BD, Princeton Tec etc) being behind the times. There's a critical thread on the new BD Storm running off 4xAAA.


majid_sabet


Feb 19, 2011, 4:32 PM
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Re: [petsfed] LED headlamps comparable to Halogen headlamps? [In reply to]
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There is this company in Australia selling a pretty badass LED headlamp light for $70 with adjustable focus. I'll see if I could find the name.


dan2see


Feb 19, 2011, 6:48 PM
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petsfed wrote:
I've been using a Petzl MYO 5 for quite a few years now, and last time I hiked out in the dark, my partner observed that I should get a new lamp, since my features a halogen bulb. Now, back when I bought it, pure-led lamps simply could not throw as far as the halogen bulb could, and I've used the halogen lamp often enough that I believe one person in every party should have one (even if everybody else has just tikkas). The thing is, it chews through batteries like candy.

Is there a headlamp out there that can match the focused throwing power of a halogen bulb that isn't the Petzl Ultra (which is awesome, but most of a pound, and more than $400)?

Pardon my dimness, but I don't see why you need so much light. I assume you're looking at getting home after dark, returning from an outing in the hills? Climbing or hiking? With a group?

In contrast to what you say, I like my Tikka on its lowest setting, so I can see where I'm walking.

When I'm coming down from a mountain after sunset, I'm usually on a trail. On a forest trail, I need to see the difference between dirty leaves and leaf-covered dirt. Gravel even. I need to see a few yards ahead, so I don't trip.

Bushwhacking at night is more of a problem, but if I can see down-hill at all, I can certainly see and avoid dead-fall trees, or rocky drop-offs. However if I can't navigate through this, that means I should not try, and I'd have to get comfortable somehow for a night in the trees.

Night-hikes above tree-line can be very serious, and this is another case where you must be prepared to spend the night on the rocks, under the stars. If you have trouble finding your route, no amount of light-power could possibly be adequate.

So maybe I'm mis-reading your OP? Maybe you are out on the wide-open prairies, and you are trying to locate the next farm? But farms usually have some kind of light outside?

Anyway maybe you could explain your need for super-power beacons?


marc801


Feb 19, 2011, 6:59 PM
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blondgecko wrote:
To give you an idea of where LEDs are at these days, I've been gradually replacing the downlights in my house with LEDs. Previously we had 11W CFL fittings (supposed to be direct replacements for 50W halogen); the new 3x1W LED bulbs replace them very comfortably.
They're being increasingly used for stage lighting as well. Admittedly you need an array in each fixture, but still, this wasn't possible as little as 6 years ago:

Rush Time Machine Tour. The circular array on the right side (there's one on the left too, but the angle in this photo prevents seeing it fully) consists entirely of LED fixtures:



csproul


Feb 19, 2011, 11:11 PM
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Re: [dan2see] LED headlamps comparable to Halogen headlamps? [In reply to]
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dan2see wrote:
petsfed wrote:
I've been using a Petzl MYO 5 for quite a few years now, and last time I hiked out in the dark, my partner observed that I should get a new lamp, since my features a halogen bulb. Now, back when I bought it, pure-led lamps simply could not throw as far as the halogen bulb could, and I've used the halogen lamp often enough that I believe one person in every party should have one (even if everybody else has just tikkas). The thing is, it chews through batteries like candy.

Is there a headlamp out there that can match the focused throwing power of a halogen bulb that isn't the Petzl Ultra (which is awesome, but most of a pound, and more than $400)?

Pardon my dimness, but I don't see why you need so much light. I assume you're looking at getting home after dark, returning from an outing in the hills? Climbing or hiking? With a group?

In contrast to what you say, I like my Tikka on its lowest setting, so I can see where I'm walking.

When I'm coming down from a mountain after sunset, I'm usually on a trail. On a forest trail, I need to see the difference between dirty leaves and leaf-covered dirt. Gravel even. I need to see a few yards ahead, so I don't trip.

Bushwhacking at night is more of a problem, but if I can see down-hill at all, I can certainly see and avoid dead-fall trees, or rocky drop-offs. However if I can't navigate through this, that means I should not try, and I'd have to get comfortable somehow for a night in the trees.

Night-hikes above tree-line can be very serious, and this is another case where you must be prepared to spend the night on the rocks, under the stars. If you have trouble finding your route, no amount of light-power could possibly be adequate.

So maybe I'm mis-reading your OP? Maybe you are out on the wide-open prairies, and you are trying to locate the next farm? But farms usually have some kind of light outside?

Anyway maybe you could explain your need for super-power beacons?
You know, some people do more than just walk on a trail by headlamp. Some people even CLIMB in the dark...on purpose! Or even if not climbing UP, I have found a bright light invaluable for tricky 4th class descents. If I know that I'm going to be on technical ground, a small Tika-like headlamp is just not enough.


dan2see


Feb 19, 2011, 11:41 PM
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csproul wrote:
...
You know, some people do more than just walk on a trail by headlamp. Some people even CLIMB in the dark...on purpose! Or even if not climbing UP, I have found a bright light invaluable for tricky 4th class descents. If I know that I'm going to be on technical ground, a small Tika-like headlamp is just not enough.

But, but , but ...

When I'm climbing up, the rock is a few feet ahead of me, at most. Beyond a body-length or two, I can't see the features anyway, not even in daytime.

Pretty much the same story going down, too.

Rappelling by moonlight, I love to turn off my light. But even by starlight, the route is generally along the fall line. Plus, when I'm second guy down, I can see the first guy's beam (but not the guy).

You've got me on 4th-class, though. Although there's been some 4th-class down-scrambles I've done on rappel.

So I gotta ask again: what's all the light power for? What are you guys looking for, that you need the power?


moose_droppings


Feb 20, 2011, 1:24 AM
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dan2see wrote:
csproul wrote:
...
You know, some people do more than just walk on a trail by headlamp. Some people even CLIMB in the dark...on purpose! Or even if not climbing UP, I have found a bright light invaluable for tricky 4th class descents. If I know that I'm going to be on technical ground, a small Tika-like headlamp is just not enough.

But, but , but ...

When I'm climbing up, the rock is a few feet ahead of me, at most. Beyond a body-length or two, I can't see the features anyway, not even in daytime.

Pretty much the same story going down, too.

Rappelling by moonlight, I love to turn off my light. But even by starlight, the route is generally along the fall line. Plus, when I'm second guy down, I can see the first guy's beam (but not the guy).

You've got me on 4th-class, though. Although there's been some 4th-class down-scrambles I've done on rappel.

So I gotta ask again: what's all the light power for? What are you guys looking for, that you need the power?


Dan, sometimes route finding involves spotting features a good distance off, hiking or climbing.


petsfed


Feb 20, 2011, 1:32 AM
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dan2see wrote:
csproul wrote:
...
You know, some people do more than just walk on a trail by headlamp. Some people even CLIMB in the dark...on purpose! Or even if not climbing UP, I have found a bright light invaluable for tricky 4th class descents. If I know that I'm going to be on technical ground, a small Tika-like headlamp is just not enough.

But, but , but ...

When I'm climbing up, the rock is a few feet ahead of me, at most. Beyond a body-length or two, I can't see the features anyway, not even in daytime.

Pretty much the same story going down, too.

Rappelling by moonlight, I love to turn off my light. But even by starlight, the route is generally along the fall line. Plus, when I'm second guy down, I can see the first guy's beam (but not the guy).

You've got me on 4th-class, though. Although there's been some 4th-class down-scrambles I've done on rappel.

So I gotta ask again: what's all the light power for? What are you guys looking for, that you need the power?

I actually found that kind of throwing power very useful during 3am approaches above treeline, or after dark, above treeline, when you were looking for the next cairn 50 yards out, rather than the trail because the trail didn't exist as such.

Its useful when you're trying to determine if the couloir you need to climb (which you need to climb at night to avoid rock fall kicked loose by the sun) is the one you're looking at, or the one next door. Or maybe you've covered your cache in reflective tape, and you want to make sure you're on the right track before you've gone past it.

The other issue is that most LED lamps use multiple bulbs in a row, so using the shadows to gauge depth of features is all but impossible. That's more easily addressed, but basically, if I'm doing anything but walking a well defined trail or reading, I don't care for the small LED lamps I've encountered.


(This post was edited by petsfed on Feb 20, 2011, 1:34 AM)


blondgecko
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Feb 20, 2011, 1:42 AM
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petsfed wrote:
dan2see wrote:
csproul wrote:
...
You know, some people do more than just walk on a trail by headlamp. Some people even CLIMB in the dark...on purpose! Or even if not climbing UP, I have found a bright light invaluable for tricky 4th class descents. If I know that I'm going to be on technical ground, a small Tika-like headlamp is just not enough.

But, but , but ...

When I'm climbing up, the rock is a few feet ahead of me, at most. Beyond a body-length or two, I can't see the features anyway, not even in daytime.

Pretty much the same story going down, too.

Rappelling by moonlight, I love to turn off my light. But even by starlight, the route is generally along the fall line. Plus, when I'm second guy down, I can see the first guy's beam (but not the guy).

You've got me on 4th-class, though. Although there's been some 4th-class down-scrambles I've done on rappel.

So I gotta ask again: what's all the light power for? What are you guys looking for, that you need the power?

I actually found that kind of throwing power very useful during 3am approaches above treeline, or after dark, above treeline, when you were looking for the next cairn 50 yards out, rather than the trail because the trail didn't exist as such.

Its useful when you're trying to determine if the couloir you need to climb (which you need to climb at night to avoid rock fall kicked loose by the sun) is the one you're looking at, or the one next door. Or maybe you've covered your cache in reflective tape, and you want to make sure you're on the right track before you've gone past it.

The other issue is that most LED lamps use multiple bulbs in a row, so using the shadows to gauge depth of features is all but impossible. That's more easily addressed, but basically, if I'm doing anything but walking a well defined trail or reading, I don't care for the small LED lamps I've encountered.

Then you're looking at the wrong lamps. The "multiple bulb" lamps are for close-up work only. The ones with throwing power are all single-element. You may be getting confused because most headlamps include both types, allowing you to switch at need.


dan2see


Feb 20, 2011, 2:23 AM
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petsfed wrote:
...
I actually found that kind of throwing power very useful during 3am approaches above treeline, or after dark, above treeline, when you were looking for the next cairn 50 yards out, rather than the trail because the trail didn't exist as such.

Its useful when you're trying to determine if the couloir you need to climb (which you need to climb at night to avoid rock fall kicked loose by the sun) is the one you're looking at, or the one next door. Or maybe you've covered your cache in reflective tape, and you want to make sure you're on the right track before you've gone past it.

...

Well now, that makes sense!

And it explains my lack of understanding. This 3 am thing is something I've never done.

Well I once started a route at 5:00 am. But pretty soon I found an inviting poplar grove and snoozed 'till sunrise.
Hmm ... and then shortly after lunch, I got turned back by an avalanche slope, just below the summit, that was already collapsing ...

But that's not a lack of head-light power, that's morning laziness.

On the other hand, I solved the problem later that summer. One Saturday I hiked up the other side on that same mountain. There's a nice camp spot about 200 meters below the summit, so I stayed overnight, and enjoyed a nice leisurely stroll, the next morning.

Both those trips needed a headlight, but not the way you guys mean.


jamaicabradens


Feb 22, 2011, 3:26 PM
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Re: [petsfed] LED headlamps comparable to Halogen headlamps? [In reply to]
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yes, led light bulbs last longer than even the cfl lights. although led light bulbs are quite expensive, but the span are good.

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(This post was edited by jamaicabradens on Feb 22, 2011, 3:31 PM)


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