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tenn_dawg
Apr 5, 2003, 8:49 PM
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http://www.rockclimbing.com/...p.cgi?Detailed=12392
When I was shooting this, I thought really hard about my depth of field, as the shutter speed was not a priority here. I eneded up settling on bringing the arete just out of focus, but allowing the viewer to still see some detail.
I got Jeff as sharp as I could, then closed up the apperture until I thought the arete was fuzzy enough, then switched to whatever shutter speed got my exposure right.
I guess artistically I was going for highlighting Jeff and his focus on sending the problem, while showing the problem in the background as a looming, uncertain figure.
Did that come across at all in the picture? Or do I need to get out of this whole artistic photography thing? The only person I've gotten criticism from is Jeff and he just says the picture makes him look "tough".
What do yall think? Any criticism is appriciated.
Travis
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camhead
Apr 5, 2003, 8:56 PM
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composition and theme is good, and you can even get away with the slight blur; I just think it's overexposed, though. too much light. it might work as a inspirational/religiously themed work, though. Imagine it with a caption like "Faith: With god All things are Possible" or something.
heh.
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dsafanda
Apr 5, 2003, 9:05 PM
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I like the idea of using a shallow depth of field for this subject and scene. However, I think I would have framed it tighter and perhaps even shot as a horizontal. There not much of interest in the upper half of the photo.
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petsfed
Apr 5, 2003, 9:40 PM
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The color, though, is not so great. This would be better as black and white. Since you are trying to capture a mood, I would go for the instant abstraction that black and white gives you. On top of that, the over-exposure would work out.
If you've got photoshop, fire it up and you can make this a cooler picture. Color works almost exclusively when there is vibrance or considerable contrast between colors but not values (eg bright blue v bright orange). You have a great deal of value contrast in the image and so I would say accentuate that.
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duskerhu
Apr 5, 2003, 10:08 PM
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Not to be a smart ass or anything but, he looks like he's looking for a lost chalk bag or something... If he was really contemplating the "problem," I'd want him actually looking at the rock. And in that instance, either show his whole body, or cut him off at the waist or even higher; armpits maybe... Then you could bring him a little bit closer to the lens and cut down your shutter speed to lessen the overexposure.
You're also at the same blah "standing level" as he is... If you were to have gotten down on the ground as low as possible and shot upward, to him actually looking at the rock, you could keep the legs without the feet and it'd be a much more "captive" composition to look at... I know that can be problematic in these type of settings but hey, you asked for constructive criticism.
Good luck and keep the creative juices flowing...
duskerhu
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xanx
Apr 5, 2003, 10:25 PM
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i agree with what has already been said (although i have never really looked at photos this critically before) and i also think the crashpad seems to deduct from the "purity" of the picture - it is just an unneccesary object in the way.
everyone else has given really good (and seemingly more knowledgable) suggestions. i would listen to them before me.
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melekzek
Apr 5, 2003, 11:01 PM
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on the other hand, without the crashpad there is nothing in the picture saying that he is going to climb. (except the fact that it is posted on a climbing site heh heh)
I guess my biggest problem is the pose of the guy. As I said, only the crashpad indicates that he is/want to climb. If he were looking at the first move, or looking up, or a gesture that he is visualizing the moves etc etc.... Currently we see his back, his face is almost invisible (here is a tip, check the greatest climbing pictures, you almost always can get a glimpse of the climbers face, showing his determination, or frusturation, or giving all, or or or)
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aimeerose
Apr 6, 2003, 12:07 AM
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looks like he's thinking about taking a piss. :lol:
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tenn_dawg
Apr 6, 2003, 12:23 AM
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Heh Heh,
He was looking for a lost chalk bag. Knowing that subtracts from the picture a little bit. I hate having people pose for pictures though. For me, I will always know the shot was posed, and not real, and that subtracts from how much my shots mean to me. (This is why I REALLY enjoy nature photography)!
As far as the over-exposure goes, There was no way around it. I metered for Jeff, and if you look close, everything in his lower body is Under-exposed. I just did what I could to keep him sharp, and well exposed, and hit the shutter. I do wish that the rock was not so washed out though. Desfanda was right, the upper part of this shot is uninteresting.
Thus is photography though. I'm going to B&W this shot right now and see how it looks. It might bring out the contrast a little better, and help reduce the appearance of over exposure in the upper half.
Thanks guys, the criticism is appriciated.
Travis
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megadyno7
Apr 6, 2003, 4:40 AM
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I give it a perfect 10!
Keep em comin!
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duskerhu
Apr 6, 2003, 5:22 AM
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Well tenn I wasn't meaning you need to pose him... He already looks posed, like, a poser, heh.. jk...
Especially in climbing photography, you need to get yourself in position and wait for the right moment, or you have to be at the right spot at the right time... You know what I mean... In other words, run around him looking through the viewfinder for the right shot as he contemplates the rock. So what if you have to ask him, "Hey, contemplate some more til I get this will ya?" :lol:
And you shouldn't really meter for him if he's just part of the total composition like the shot above... I know you have to draw a balance somewhere to get the lighting needed (which can be really tough outdoors in the woods, beams of sun cutting in where you don't need them...) If you have a big piece of white board you can always bounce some light back at the lower part of the scene... but yeah, I know, you don't wanna have to drag a bounce card out there with you...
Good luck.
duskerhu
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dirko
Apr 6, 2003, 7:06 PM
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I think that your choice of DOF on Hemlock Arete was in general pretty good. I don't like the composition as much, so much of the space is neutral/negative and it's not strikingly graphic. It does however indicate a trend in thinking about your pictures a certain way which will eventually get you to where you want to be.
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tenn_dawg
Apr 6, 2003, 7:23 PM
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Alright Dirko!
I was wondering if someone would recognise the problem.
Did you recognise it, or did you go look at the picture as it is captioned on this site?
Travis
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surforclimb
Apr 6, 2003, 8:00 PM
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You might want to try taking pictures in B&W instead of color. b&w brings out more shadowing and you can get the desired effect you wanted about the whole problem and jeff. but good pic none the less.
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climberwa
Apr 7, 2003, 3:43 PM
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with the under exposure, you could have used a small flash unit, I usually carry a SB-28, it has a huge range, and is not that heavy.
A little fill flash and you problem with exposure would be minimized.
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shank
Apr 7, 2003, 4:11 PM
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just playing with it. I don't think it looks as good in b&w.
I like it the way it is though, but what do I know.
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krillen
Apr 7, 2003, 7:58 PM
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Have you considered cropping it square or nearly square?
The only way to really tell how the shot would be better or worse is to bracket you exposures and a few different compositions....but practically this isn't going to happen because you don't want the climber to pose.
As far as the climber's position etc. I think it's doing what an artisitic photo should do. Develop conversation on what he's doing/thinking. This just shows how people's perceptions of the same object vary. Good art makes people think. Personally I like it, I thouhgt he was pumping himself up to send.
Maybe try playing with the levels/curves/contrast in Photoshop and see what you like?....afterall, it's your photo.
Cheers - my $0.02
p.s. - I like the tree, it's a nice leading line for the eye.
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tenn_dawg
Apr 8, 2003, 6:33 PM
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Thanks Krillen, Good advice!
I played around with this picture in B&W too, and didin't like the results. There is a great article on Photo.net on how to maintain control over the levels in the B&W conversion. There just isin't enough contrast in the upper part of the photo for it to work well.
I did get some interesting results while messing with the levels, but I really dont know enough about Photoshop to effectively do this.
I had 3 pictures of him walking around in front of the problem, and this one turned out the best.
I'm going to go crop this a little, and see how it looks without the upper part of the boulder.
Travis
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krillen
Apr 8, 2003, 7:00 PM
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You could try doding and burning portions of it to even out the exposure.
I played with it a bit, but didn't like the results anymore than the original....so...
I did get sidetracked with playing with it though...too many options....:P
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bontrager
Apr 8, 2003, 8:27 PM
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I think you could use some work on your composition. Try using the rule of thirds to break up the frame into things of interest. You picture fails this rule in my opinion as I lose interest in the background. This has nothing to do with your actual depth of field.
I would also suggest that when you decide to use shallow depth of field, to think of painting with light and color in broad strokes that will amplify your subject matter.
When composing your shot think about telling a story and in doing that you want the viewer to get the message, not analyze your technical capabilities.
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otter
Apr 8, 2003, 9:38 PM
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the idea behind it is great. I think if the climber was looking up at the rock it would be more obviouse as to his concentration onthe rock. And in doing so... maybe spread the focus a notch...so the rock is just a tad but not much more in focus. This would also make the framing more relevant. Contrast is a touch high.
Keep up the artistic approach! It is refreshing!
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bontrager
Apr 8, 2003, 10:41 PM
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Looking at this picture again I would suggest the following for you to reshoot the same scene. Especially if you can have your friend pose again in the same spot.
First I would look to compose this shot during the early afternoon or morning to take advantage of the golden hour of light. This will allow you to get a more diffused light and capture more color in your picture, especially from the rock. Just make sure that the light will still hit his back. This should also give you shadow detail that is currently missing from your shot. It will make it more dramatice looking.
Second, give the guy some tools for the story. Have him have his chalk bag hanging and his hands chalked white. I would also really chalk up the holds on the rock, maybe only half way so the stand out. It could look very dramatic with the shallow depth of field, where the dark rock has these blurry white marks. Take away the crash pad it is distracting.
Third, shoot from a different angle than shoulder height. Get on your knee and close behind him to shoot up . Giving the perspective on the problem.
Fourth, shoot faster film to give you a broader range of f-stops to use without hand shake concerns.
Fifth get all of the body or waist, getting him from the calves up seems poor.
These are just some suggestions if you want to push the art side of the picture taking thing.
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arak42
Apr 8, 2003, 10:50 PM
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Okay, is it just me, or does jeff have a really nice behind?
okay... I'll be serious... critique the photo, well, I agree with bontrager's suggestions about light and having the chalk bag in his hands. also, I think that cropping this picture even more than what people have already suggested would work nicely. You have to play with the top so that the tree doesn't look funky, but I think cropping it right above that second row of branches would work. I also think that left side of the photo is extra space, crop off a bit so that the crash pad is touching the frame of the photo on the bottom and the side, I think it would focus in more on the subject.
Also, is it just my monitor, or is there some white fuzzy stuff in the bottom left corner? very distracting!
please don't listen to me if you think me advice is crap... I am fighting with my own photogrpahy at the moment too
:wink: K :wink:
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tenn_dawg
Apr 8, 2003, 11:44 PM
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The fuzz at the bottom left is dust from the scanner. I'm probably going to go back to campus and redo it. While I'm down there, I'll try cropping it.
Initially I liked my framing of the arete as it is a tribute to how good my viewfinder is. The topout of the arete just looks crummy though. Photoshop here I come.
Travis
Kara- I'll crop out a shot of his ass for you if you want it. :wink: He's going to laugh when he sees this. :lol:
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redpiton
Apr 9, 2003, 12:45 AM
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bad ass, could be a day where the sun gives the colors of the rock a touch up...but then it wokuld be just like everyone elses pictures....
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