|
iamn8seemewreck
May 3, 2004, 7:06 PM
Post #76 of 164
(6548 views)
Shortcut
Registered: May 3, 2004
Posts: 4
|
There are endless illustrations that can be drawn from a climbing experience. I am training now at Applachian Bible College in their camp programming minor and we are always using adventure programs for spiritual benefits. Perhaps beside the usual faith/trust annalogy you could use one of a believer needing to be properly prepared in order to succeed in the christian faith. Ephesians 6 talks about "putting on the whole armour of God". the same is true about doing a climb. If you are to succeed you will need the proper training and equiptment. Anyways, thats jsut a start. Good luck! and look me up if your ever in the WV area!
-nate
http://www.wetpaintfilms.com
|
|
|
|
|
uponpetra
May 3, 2004, 7:35 PM
Post #77 of 164
(6548 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Apr 27, 2004
Posts: 1
|
The first time I climbed was on a church retreat called "The Ultimate." It consisted of waterskiing, mt. biking, rock climbing, white-water tahiting, camping in the San Juan Islands and a music festival at the end. 1 week of crazy adventures. This was in high school. In college I picked up gym climbing and had a few chances to get on rock. Now that I'm out I go climbing on rock after work and love it!
"The Ultimate" was probably one of the greatest adventures that a young kid could experience. It was a week of trying new, sometimes scary things and the best part was getting to know everyone else on the trip and finding Christian fellowship in that. Every morning was spent chowing down breakfast and getting in a solid study from God's Word. Then we'd hit the trail, rock, water, etc. all day. The evening was again a time to reflect on the day's time well spent, praise the Lord for his creation of earth and humanity as well as keeping us safe from any major harm! (although I still have a scar on my knee from going over my handle bars at Bachelor!) What a blessing.
Now I am planning on taking the highschoolers from church over to Smith Rock this summer to introduce them to the first route I ever climbed, 5 gallon buckets. God is so good to give us these opportunities of being in His creation and growing more in the knowledge of Him.
So in relating Christianity and rock climbing... go for the thrill and adventure of it. When down time comes, just teach the word that God has put on your heart. Ultimately, God IS our rock, firm foundation. Sometimes it takes a hidden strength to power through a move in climbing. The Lord is our hidden strength to power us through the movement of life!!
peace in Christ
|
|
|
|
|
delarig
May 3, 2004, 7:44 PM
Post #78 of 164
(6548 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Jan 10, 2004
Posts: 167
|
This is the thread that never ends............
|
|
|
|
|
gravitytheory
May 3, 2004, 7:55 PM
Post #79 of 164
(6548 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Sep 12, 2003
Posts: 261
|
Yes it goes on and on my friends...
God Trad Climbs. Jesus sport climbs. Muhammad Boulders. Buddha doesn't give a damn, and likes it that way. Lao Tsu just sits and smiles and laughs at all the silly people running around.
|
|
|
|
|
tempestwind
May 3, 2004, 7:55 PM
Post #80 of 164
(6548 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Mar 23, 2004
Posts: 133
|
In reply to: In reply to: Poor YOU, how empty your experiences must be. You are not better than other people, just because you are a Jesus freak. And this is one of several statements in this thread where you imply as much. So I tell you this: TAKE YOUR SELF RIGHTOUSNESS AND SHOVE IT!! If people want to bring their god and religion into THEIR climbing great. But that doesn't make them any better than anyone else. The key is to climb for YOUR reason's and forget what anyone else thinks. josh
"Better than other People">HA! Not even close. "Jesus Freak">Hardly >"Self Rightousness"? Never did I point the finger and say you are wrong. Whats the matter Josh? Are you feeling guilty or unfulfilled about something there bud? :?
|
|
|
|
|
delarig
May 3, 2004, 8:04 PM
Post #81 of 164
(6548 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Jan 10, 2004
Posts: 167
|
sshhhhhh.....
|
|
|
|
|
ladybigguns
May 3, 2004, 8:12 PM
Post #82 of 164
(6548 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Feb 18, 2004
Posts: 25
|
pesonally i dont believe in true god or one true religion... i grew up in a christian family, and have chosen not to take my life in that path...
regardless, i find it ironic that those christians who are angered when one posts something "anti-god" harass those who do not believe in the same things they do.. this is immature, ignorant, and from what i have been taught, completely against everything the Christian faith advocates...
"Or a very weak troll more than likely..."
is this really necessary? i think not.
|
|
|
|
|
ironhawk
May 3, 2004, 8:43 PM
Post #83 of 164
(6548 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Apr 30, 2004
Posts: 98
|
In reply to: In reply to: I agree with tgreene , but Iwill answer anyway. I don't believe in god or any reigion and honestly I can't really place God or any spiritual thing in climbing. (but I can't place it ANYWHERE) Now, what I can place in climbing is what (most) religions try to tell people, i.e., the way people should behave. You can tell your church grroup things like climbing gives you TRUST on people (your life is on the hands of the belayer). Or that it shows you that you shouldn't quit when things get too hard. And so on. Anyway, relate it the same way you would relate any group activity. but again religion and politics should not be discussed here. Poor YOU, how empty your experiences must be.
actually tempest you were pointing fingers here and it does come off as very self righteous.
|
|
|
|
|
rescueman
May 3, 2004, 8:54 PM
Post #84 of 164
(6548 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Mar 1, 2004
Posts: 439
|
In reply to: Rescueman: The best examples of true believers today are Osama bin Laden and George W. Bush. They are both equally certain that they are good and the other evil, and each is willing to destroy anyone in their way and everything they claim to hold dear in order to achieve their goals. In reply to: dynamic: i think there are better examples of "true believers" out there, especially when your definition is so sloppy. are you asserting that their application of morality is objectively equal and that one has not committed more henious crimes within the scope of international jurisprudence than the other?
This is getting a bit off-subject, but since you asked:
First, it is not "my definition", but comes from a widely respected book on the subject which I named and quoted from above.
Second, you're absolutely right that there is no objective comparison, in terms of international jurisprudence, between the crimes of bin Laden and George Bush.
Bin Laden committed grave criminal acts against almost 3,000 American citizens and against significant US property.
George W. Bush, like his father before him, utterly destroyed the cradle of civilization, killing tens of thousands of innocent civilians and, through years of economic sanctions, a million more (mostly women and children according to UNICEF). The two Iraq wars violated the US Constitution, The UN Charter, the Geneva Conventions, the Nuremburg Principles, and every accepted standard of international relations.
Former US Attorney General Ramsey Clark convened an (unofficial) international war crimes tribunal after the 1991 Gulf War and daddy Bush and his entire cabinet were convicted of 19 counts of crimes against humanity and war crimes. Sonny Bush has committed similar international crimes for which he will never be held accountable because the US is the only nation (outside of a few rogue states) that refuses to subject itself to the International War Crimes Court.
- Robert
|
|
|
|
|
ben87
May 3, 2004, 9:08 PM
Post #85 of 164
(6548 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Mar 26, 2004
Posts: 229
|
In reply to: build your anchors upon a rock, for if you build them in sand you will be washed away. :roll:
:lol:
|
|
|
|
|
nagatana
May 3, 2004, 9:24 PM
Post #86 of 164
(6548 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Sep 28, 2003
Posts: 425
|
In reply to: build your anchors upon a rock, for if you build them in sand you will be washed away. :roll:
The physical world we know of is the rock, and God & Co. are sand, right? :P
In reply to: God Trad Climbs. Jesus sport climbs. Muhammad Boulders. Buddha doesn't give a damn, and likes it that way. Lao Tsu just sits and smiles and laughs at all the silly people running around.
Haha, a bit inaccurate, but refreshing nonetheless. :D
|
|
|
|
|
katydid
May 3, 2004, 9:26 PM
Post #87 of 164
(6548 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Aug 13, 2002
Posts: 3212
|
Guys, if you want to argue about religion, take it to Community. If you have suggestions for this person's church outing, post in this thread.
Clear enough?
Thanks,
k.
|
|
|
|
|
nagatana
May 3, 2004, 9:27 PM
Post #88 of 164
(6548 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Sep 28, 2003
Posts: 425
|
"They" started it.
|
|
|
|
|
tempestwind
May 3, 2004, 9:34 PM
Post #89 of 164
(6548 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Mar 23, 2004
Posts: 133
|
In reply to: In reply to: In reply to: I agree with tgreene , but Iwill answer anyway. I don't believe in god or any reigion and honestly I can't really place God or any spiritual thing in climbing. (but I can't place it ANYWHERE) Now, what I can place in climbing is what (most) religions try to tell people, i.e., the way people should behave. You can tell your church grroup things like climbing gives you TRUST on people (your life is on the hands of the belayer). Or that it shows you that you shouldn't quit when things get too hard. And so on. Anyway, relate it the same way you would relate any group activity. but again religion and politics should not be discussed here. Poor YOU, how empty your experiences must be. actually tempest you were pointing fingers here and it does come off as very self righteous.
In no way shape or form am I acting self rightous. I am merely expressing how I feel. Oh I see how it works in your book.People can thrash and discredit all they want.But when someone says anything to counter that..OH NO I am a finger pointer. PULEASE :boring:
|
|
|
|
|
spiritascents
May 3, 2004, 9:42 PM
Post #90 of 164
(6548 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Apr 3, 2004
Posts: 19
|
In reply to: I agree with tgreene , but Iwill answer anyway. I don't believe in god or any reigion and honestly I can't really place God or any spiritual thing in climbing. (but I can't place it ANYWHERE) Now, what I can place in climbing is what (most) religions try to tell people, i.e., the way people should behave. You can tell your church grroup things like climbing gives you TRUST on people (your life is on the hands of the belayer). Or that it shows you that you shouldn't quit when things get too hard. And so on. Anyway, relate it the same way you would relate any group activity. but again religion and politics should not be discussed here.
THis is a forum ANYTHING can be discussed. Unless you are on a censorship panel.
My friend I don't know if you realize it or not but climbing is Pure Spirituality. Maybe you have not identified it or not.
TEMPESTWIND don't get huffed up with these people who say you are finger pointing.I agree with you.It sounds as if they have alot of guilty hang-ups they have not yet dealt with. :wink:
Peace Through Climbing :D
|
|
|
|
|
ironhawk
May 3, 2004, 9:46 PM
Post #91 of 164
(6548 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Apr 30, 2004
Posts: 98
|
In reply to: In reply to: In reply to: In reply to: I agree with tgreene , but Iwill answer anyway. I don't believe in god or any reigion and honestly I can't really place God or any spiritual thing in climbing. (but I can't place it ANYWHERE) Now, what I can place in climbing is what (most) religions try to tell people, i.e., the way people should behave. You can tell your church grroup things like climbing gives you TRUST on people (your life is on the hands of the belayer). Or that it shows you that you shouldn't quit when things get too hard. And so on. Anyway, relate it the same way you would relate any group activity. but again religion and politics should not be discussed here. Poor YOU, how empty your experiences must be. actually tempest you were pointing fingers here and it does come off as very self righteous. In no way shape or form am I acting self rightous. I am merely expressing how I feel. Oh I see how it works in your book.People can thrash and discredit all they want.But when someone says anything to counter that..OH NO I am a finger pointer. PULEASE :boring:
if telling someone they're life is empty because they do not share your religious beliefs is not being self rightous then your correct otherwise your wrong.
|
|
|
|
|
godskid5
May 3, 2004, 9:48 PM
Post #92 of 164
(6548 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Apr 28, 2004
Posts: 197
|
:D good call!
|
|
|
|
|
dynamic
May 3, 2004, 9:54 PM
Post #93 of 164
(6548 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Sep 9, 2001
Posts: 439
|
rescueman wrote:
In reply to: George W. Bush, like his father before him, utterly destroyed the cradle of civilization, killing tens of thousands of innocent civilians and, through years of economic sanctions, a million more (mostly women and children according to UNICEF). The two Iraq wars violated the US Constitution, The UN Charter, the Geneva Conventions, the Nuremburg Principles, and every accepted standard of international relations.
Please reply to my other questions.
As for climbing and religion, they can be related to each other for both being great things for people, much like any other sport and general philosophical reflection. The questions that you ask while climbing generally don't work toward establishing theological doctrine, but like someone else said, an existential appreciation can be developed.
I radically disagree with the person who said that existentialism is strictly an "eastern" thing (if that is what they said, I can't exactly remember). Anyway, the experience of climbing is not a source of truth. it only facilitates a greater appreciation of truth.
|
|
|
|
|
katydid
May 3, 2004, 9:58 PM
Post #94 of 164
(6548 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Aug 13, 2002
Posts: 3212
|
With apologies to 10ftdrp, this thread is going to Community because it's waaaaay off topic.
k.
|
|
|
|
|
katydid
May 3, 2004, 9:58 PM
Post #95 of 164
(6548 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Aug 13, 2002
Posts: 3212
|
katydid moved this thread from General to Community.
|
|
|
|
|
djmeat
May 4, 2004, 12:16 AM
Post #96 of 164
(6548 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Sep 25, 2002
Posts: 4497
|
about time.
|
|
|
|
|
scuclimber
May 4, 2004, 12:47 AM
Post #97 of 164
(6548 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Jun 30, 2003
Posts: 1007
|
Man, this thread got way lame. :roll:
|
|
|
|
|
rescueman
May 4, 2004, 12:55 AM
Post #98 of 164
(6548 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Mar 1, 2004
Posts: 439
|
In reply to: by dynamic: Isn't it also true that Saddam has killed on average per year (i'm not sure what range of years) 29,000 of his own people?
So what are you suggesting? That because Saddam is a monster that justifies the US breaking every international law and going to war against him (on the basis of lies about WMDs, immanent threat, and ties to Al Qaeda), slaughtering civilians, utterly destroying the infrastructure of the country we claim to be liberating, giving control of that country's oil resources to US corporations, creating civil strife and an opening for the foreign terrorists who never had access to Iraq before, fostering a widespread rebellion against our occupation, and then begging the UN to come bail us out after thumbing our nose at them when they told us it was a bad idea to begin with?
And let's not forget that the Baath party came to power in Iraq assisted by a CIA coup, that the US supported Saddam Hussein with money and weapons of mass destruction when he was fighting the Islamic Theocracy of Iran, that even when he was committing the worst atrocities against his people we increased US aid to his regime, that when the Iraqi people tried to rise up against Saddam following the 1991 Gulf War we abandoned them and allowed them to be slaughtered, that we enticed Saddam into invading Kuwait by giving that anti-democratic country slant drilling technology to steal Iraqi oil and winked at him when he asked our State Department if we cared.
What's your point? That since we've already committed a thousand wrongs against the Iraqi nation and people we may as well commit a few hundred more to make sure that they never again claim their oil resources for themselves?
|
|
|
|
|
dynamic
May 4, 2004, 1:10 AM
Post #99 of 164
(6548 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Sep 9, 2001
Posts: 439
|
rescue: i don't think that your response fits my question. first of all, my question was this: "are you asserting that their application of morality is objectively equal?"
judging by how you are attacking bush for his policy, apparently you really DO believe that objective moral standards should be applied, contradicting the ill-slanted definition of "true believers" that you initially put out there (in which you seem to suggest that an objectively stated ethic is merely evidence of the inferior "true belief").
see the contradiction? now, please respond to my other questions.
|
|
|
|
|
rescueman
May 4, 2004, 1:32 AM
Post #100 of 164
(6548 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Mar 1, 2004
Posts: 439
|
In reply to: see the contradiction? now, please respond to my other questions.
Sorry, dynamic, but there's no point in carrying on a conversation with someone who either doesn't read what I post or deliberately distorts it.
- Robert
|
|
|
|
|
|
