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danpayne
Dec 13, 2004, 9:07 PM
Post #51 of 116
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ABSOLUTLY NOT, You cannot TOUCH my dog, and I don't owe you jack.
This is because my dog always stays at home.
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killclimbz
Dec 13, 2004, 9:11 PM
Post #52 of 116
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You have my permission to kick my dog if he rumages through your pack. I don't care about the teaching the dog anything part, I would do the same dang thing too. If anything they'll want to stay away from you, therefore your pack.
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cgailey
Dec 13, 2004, 9:12 PM
Post #53 of 116
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In reply to: KEEP THEM ON A LEASH.
nuff said!
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sarcat
Dec 13, 2004, 9:13 PM
Post #54 of 116
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In reply to: As for the carrying, 1) a small j-frame in .357 caliber (which is generally loaded with the less-brutal .38spl or +p, isn't really such a monster,
I carry a Ruger SP-101. +P ammo also. Good choice.
In reply to: Why on earth do you need to pack heat (especially that caliber of heat) at a crag? The only crags I can think of where it makes much sense are remote areas where you're unlikely to meet other parties.
.357 is an "average" caliber among modern day firearms. Compare it to a new .50 S&W or even the old .45 ACP. Anyone properly carrying conceals it and therefore it should be unknown to EVERYONE else.
Back to dogs. dingus has the right idea.
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dingus
Dec 13, 2004, 9:13 PM
Post #55 of 116
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In reply to: In reply to: KEEP THEM ON A LEASH. nuff said!
There ya go, problem solved and surely we'll never see the likes of this thread again.
Ha ha.
DMT
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taualum23
Dec 13, 2004, 9:20 PM
Post #56 of 116
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In reply to: There ya go, problem solved and surely we'll never see the likes of this thread again.
Oh, that's good stuff, Dingus. Oh, in case you were wondering, I solved the whole "bolts are good v. bolts are bad debate" in another thread today. Oh, it turns out sport, aid, alpine, trad and bouldering are all climbing, and we should do what we enjoy. The best shoes are the ones that work for you. The best training for climbing is drinking, and the worst day climbing STILL beats the hell out of the best day working.
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wideguy
Dec 13, 2004, 9:23 PM
Post #57 of 116
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In reply to: In reply to: There ya go, problem solved and surely we'll never see the likes of this thread again. Oh, that's good stuff, Dingus. Oh, in case you were wondering, I solved the whole "bolts are good v. bolts are bad debate" in another thread today. Oh, it turns out sport, aid, alpine, trad and bouldering are all climbing, and we should do what we enjoy. The best shoes are the ones that work for you. The best training for climbing is drinking, and the worst day climbing STILL beats the hell out of the best day working.
DUDE!!! You solved all that today?! Call the Nobel Committee, you are CLEARLY the most influential person ever to walk the face of the earth! 8^)
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hasbeen
Dec 13, 2004, 9:31 PM
Post #58 of 116
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Explain to me how dogs can be legal to own as pets if they are required to be on a leash at all times?
A dog is a physical animal and needs to run. They're faster than you and need even more exercise since their evolution is based on a physical-based lifestyle. If you have a dog it must be allowed to be physical. If you deny it this it will go, at least in part, insane. It will affect its learning abilities and its abilities to function on a day to day level. And unless you have a very small breed you cannot accomplish this unless your dog is allowed to go off leash. To own a dog and keep it leashed is animal cruelty and you should be arrested.
In my town, there are no dog parks. In fact, dogs are not even allowed in parks whilst on the leash. Yet dogs are legal. This is pretzl logic.
If I couldn't have my dog on trails off leash (I can't be break this law), I could not have my dog. My dog didn't grow up here but we re-located for work. Even so, my dog now spends part of his time with friends who own a ranch because, to me, it's a better lifestyle for him.
I personally think leash laws are crazy and perpetuate the exceedingly poor behavoir of dogs. People feel they can just leash and muzzle their animals and no longer need to train them. If there weren't leash laws they would be forced to become better parents. Ever go to Europe? People train their animals and take them all over. I rarely see any problems.
The bottom line here is not to keep your dog on a leash, it's to train it properly. Take some responsibility. If you have a dog, treat it like you do your child because it is.
btw, the people who refused to replace your food should have their dogs taken away for irresponsible parenting. Kids make mistakes and responsible parents stand behind them and rectify the situation.
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danpayne
Dec 13, 2004, 9:36 PM
Post #59 of 116
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In reply to: In reply to: There ya go, problem solved and surely we'll never see the likes of this thread again. Oh, that's good stuff, Dingus. Oh, in case you were wondering, I solved the whole "bolts are good v. bolts are bad debate" in another thread today. Oh, it turns out sport, aid, alpine, trad and bouldering are all climbing, and we should do what we enjoy. The best shoes are the ones that work for you. The best training for climbing is drinking, and the worst day climbing STILL beats the hell out of the best day working.
Quick question about that "Worst day climbing better than the best day working?" Thing... ummm, wouldn't the worst day climbing involve a fatality or accident of some sort? Would you really consider that better than say, i dunno, getting a hummer from your secratary?
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sidepull
Dec 13, 2004, 9:48 PM
Post #60 of 116
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In reply to: Ever go to Europe? People train their animals and take them all over. I rarely see any problems.
I never saw a dog in Paris that wasn't leashed. Plus, I never saw any dogs at all near the boulders at Fountainbleau and surprsingly - there wasn't dog crap all over either.
I love dogs but I usually don't like other dog lovers. It seems a lot of us "outdoorsy" types want dogs for the same reason we want the new northface jacket - it's a branding thing. So if I'm going climbing I have to bring my dog - I don't understand the logic, especially if the dog isn't trained, you haven't brought a bag to clean up the doggie mess, and you aren't sensitive enough to realize the dog is bothering others.
Why are you bringing your dog? Don't bring your dogs if you can't handle the extra responsibility. And don't bring the dog if it's going to go through someone else's stuff. Don't bring the dog for your image (which seems to be the main reason).
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fishbelly
Dec 13, 2004, 9:48 PM
Post #61 of 116
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Registered: Oct 31, 2004
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Try a number 10 or a 11 Hex
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cgailey
Dec 13, 2004, 9:57 PM
Post #64 of 116
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Registered: Apr 6, 2004
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In reply to: Explain to me how dogs can be legal to own as pets if they are required to be on a leash at all times? A dog is a physical animal and needs to run. They're faster than you and need even more exercise since their evolution is based on a physical-based lifestyle. If you have a dog it must be allowed to be physical. If you deny it this it will go, at least in part, insane. It will affect its learning abilities and its abilities to function on a day to day level. And unless you have a very small breed you cannot accomplish this unless your dog is allowed to go off leash. To own a dog and keep it leashed is animal cruelty and you should be arrested. In my town, there are no dog parks. In fact, dogs are not even allowed in parks whilst on the leash. Yet dogs are legal. This is pretzl logic. If I couldn't have my dog on trails off leash (I can't be break this law), I could not have my dog. My dog didn't grow up here but we re-located for work. Even so, my dog now spends part of his time with friends who own a ranch because, to me, it's a better lifestyle for him. I personally think leash laws are crazy and perpetuate the exceedingly poor behavoir of dogs. People feel they can just leash and muzzle their animals and no longer need to train them. If there weren't leash laws they would be forced to become better parents. Ever go to Europe? People train their animals and take them all over. I rarely see any problems. The bottom line here is not to keep your dog on a leash, it's to train it properly. Take some responsibility. If you have a dog, treat it like you do your child because it is. btw, the people who refused to replace your food should have their dogs taken away for irresponsible parenting. Kids make mistakes and responsible parents stand behind them and rectify the situation.
Here's a novel idea...if your dog can't handle being tied up to prevent it from wreaking havoc, don't bring it to the crag.
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bler
Dec 13, 2004, 10:32 PM
Post #65 of 116
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Registered: Apr 22, 2004
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don't get me wrong, I love dogs, but if your dog ate my lunch, I'd kick it.. if it bit me, i'd have it put to sleep..
I'd expect the same from others to my dog, witch is why people should always keep their pets trained and under control, PERIOD maybe at home, but in public, off leash there is NO EXCUSE..
they ARE still animals with small, small brains !
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wingnut
Dec 13, 2004, 10:55 PM
Post #66 of 116
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Registered: Nov 10, 2004
Posts: 754
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Don't kick the dog. tell the idiotic owners to tie their dog to something.
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crimpandgo
Dec 13, 2004, 11:31 PM
Post #67 of 116
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Registered: Apr 15, 2004
Posts: 1005
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In reply to: Explain to me how dogs can be legal to own as pets if they are required to be on a leash at all times? A dog is a physical animal and needs to run. They're faster than you and need even more exercise since their evolution is based on a physical-based lifestyle. If you have a dog it must be allowed to be physical. If you deny it this it will go, at least in part, insane. It will affect its learning abilities and its abilities to function on a day to day level. And unless you have a very small breed you cannot accomplish this unless your dog is allowed to go off leash. To own a dog and keep it leashed is animal cruelty and you should be arrested. In my town, there are no dog parks. In fact, dogs are not even allowed in parks whilst on the leash. Yet dogs are legal. This is pretzl logic. If I couldn't have my dog on trails off leash (I can't be break this law), I could not have my dog. My dog didn't grow up here but we re-located for work. Even so, my dog now spends part of his time with friends who own a ranch because, to me, it's a better lifestyle for him. I personally think leash laws are crazy and perpetuate the exceedingly poor behavoir of dogs. People feel they can just leash and muzzle their animals and no longer need to train them. If there weren't leash laws they would be forced to become better parents. Ever go to Europe? People train their animals and take them all over. I rarely see any problems. The bottom line here is not to keep your dog on a leash, it's to train it properly. Take some responsibility. If you have a dog, treat it like you do your child because it is. btw, the people who refused to replace your food should have their dogs taken away for irresponsible parenting. Kids make mistakes and responsible parents stand behind them and rectify the situation.
Hasbeen, You bring up some very good points. Ones that won't be solved here or maybe anywhere. If you dont like the leash law, you should not get a dog. It is one of the reasons I dont have dogs (although I would love to). But the simple fact is, its not about the dog, its about infringing on other peoples personal space. what gives a dog owner the right to let their dog run all over the place crappin on peoples stuff and rummaging through their packs? If a person did it they could be arrested for indecent exposure or theft.
If you want dogs and you feel the need to give them space to run, then there are plenty of places to live, where you can give them what they need. A crag crowded with people, many of them that don't share your love of the canine species, is not the place.
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shank
Dec 14, 2004, 12:13 AM
Post #68 of 116
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In reply to: I personally think leash laws are crazy and perpetuate the exceedingly poor behavoir of dogs. People feel they can just leash and muzzle their animals and no longer need to train them. If there weren't leash laws they would be forced to become better parents.
This has got to be one of the STOOPIDEST thing I have ever heard.
That is a bit like saying if there were no laws against murder everyone would just be so nice.....Bad news buddy, it don't work that way.
If it is my dog getting in your stuff, I would prefer you yell first and only shoot him as a last resort, but suit yourself, it is just a dog.
I'm with the person that said all unleashed dogs will be assumed wild and dealt with accordingly.
And also what about those people that dogs just don't like, and I have seen a few of them. Should they just not climb? The place I go mostly doesn't have anywhere else to tie a dog up except right on the trail, Would you leave your pack laying in the trail? Would you leave your dog laying in the trail?
Moral of the storie is, There are mean people everywhere, and you never know when you are going to run into one, so if you really love your dog, leave it at home, or sooner or later it is going to meet someone that doesn't like it, and there may, or may not be a damn thing you can do about it.
Side note: I just love the fact that everyone that owns a dog and brings it to the crag automatically assumes they can whoop anyone that doesn't like dogs.
i.e.
In reply to: Ferther more, I love my dog like I would love a son, and if someone tuches him with any more force then petting him, this person and I will have a BIG PROBLEM, no matter what my dog did.
In reply to: if it was my dog and you kicked it without talking to me first, it would definitely be more then food you'd be missing.
In reply to: If you kicked my dog, you would have to deal with getting yourself to the hospital without your lunch. He's a chow/sheppard/pit mix, and his owner carries a .357 S&W J-frame.
In reply to: BUT if you kick my dog i will kick your ass :D |
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btreanor
Dec 14, 2004, 12:34 AM
Post #69 of 116
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Registered: Feb 24, 2004
Posts: 121
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I can't believe that I actually got sucked into reading this thread, but since I did...
You people are funny (both kinds).
It was amazing how quickly this thread turned into a pissing contest ("my daddy can beat up your daddy," "can not," "my daddy used to box," "my daddy carries 12 guns and studies 27 super-secret martial arts and wears a decoder ring," yap, yap, yap).
How about we all take f-ing responsibility for ourselves and our dependents (toddlers and dogs)?
To dog-kickers: Don't abuse animals when you can just as easily go and hold the owner responsible.
To dog fetishists: People who own large aggressive dogs as some sort of compensation mechanism for other insecurities should be held accountable when the dog injures (or kills) someone.
Go climb (leaves to follow his own advice...).
Brian
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omegaclimb
Dec 14, 2004, 1:09 AM
Post #70 of 116
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Posts: 19
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Yes, you may kick my dog!
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grace
Dec 14, 2004, 1:50 AM
Post #71 of 116
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how is kicking someone's ass for kicking your dog any better than them kicking your dog in the first place? if the dog cant learn from violence or if it is cruel to injure the dog, how is it any better to apply these same techniques on a fellow human being?
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ullr
Dec 14, 2004, 2:10 AM
Post #72 of 116
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Slap that dog on the ass right away. Don't kick it, just give it a good whack.
This coming from a dog owner.
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theflyingsquirrel
Dec 14, 2004, 2:35 AM
Post #73 of 116
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i don't really believe in, well, hitting my dog that hard. but what i would do if my dog got into your pack at the crag and you told me about is i would take my dog to your pack, show her what she did wrong, and probably smack her on the snout(and i don't mean f***ing pimp slapping my dog either). furthermore if my dog wasen't trained and was an unkind dog that could possibly bite someone then there is no reason in hell that it should be at the crag roaming around. some people don't understand that though.
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fjclimbsrocks
Dec 14, 2004, 2:39 AM
Post #74 of 116
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gentry - being as 5 pages of debate have already occured, this might be a little late, but when you say "kick" do you mean "wind up and swing your foot to strike with the intent to cause pain" or do you mean "use your shin to firmly push the dog away from your pack". If you mean the first, I would say absolutely not, for all of the reasons above. If you meant the latter, I would have no problem if you did that to my dog(s), as long as the intent was to stop them from eating your lunch. Then come find me, I'll discipline my own dogs, and share my lunch with you or buy you another, your choice.
Also, I just wanted to comment on how much I enjoy seeing the materials and the style in which people tie up their dogs at the crag. Never is there a standard pet leash tied in a granny knot to a tree, heaven forbid, we're climbers, right? :wink: There has to be at least two locking 'biners, two climbing knots, and some type of retired nylon just to keep somebody's little chiwowa from running away, I love it. I once saw a dog tied with webbing to a camalot placed in the crag. I was shocked that there wasn't more redundancy in the anchor :D
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bandycoot
Dec 14, 2004, 2:52 AM
Post #75 of 116
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If my dog did something minor to you or your gear, smack him. You can even smack him hard. Kicking hard can break bones, but smacking can sting a lot and not leave long term damage. That said, if my dog ever attacked someone they could kick his ass on the spot and I wouldn't mind. I was attacked at the crag once. I tried my best to get past the damn dog without it biting, but it got me during the one second that I was looking away on the rocky trail and chomped my calf. It hurt a lot and drew blood, so I creamed the hell out of the dog's head with my helmet. Crazy little bastart still thought about going for round two but I think he was in some severe pain. The owner said "thanks" after I clubbed him. At least the owner understood that I needed to do that. If you're a dog owner, be reasonable. There are times when it is appropriate for others to punish your dog.
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