|
Peasley1
Jul 16, 2009, 3:27 PM
Post #1 of 48
(17921 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Jun 22, 2009
Posts: 51
|
Ok, so I got a new rope yesterday (Mammut supersafe) which brings me up to 2 ropes now giving me the option to do longer sport routes/link ups. Only thing stopping me thus far was the thought that I might have to bail for w/e reason and be too far up to rap down on one rope. So my question is what is the best way to haul this second rope up with me. I'm thinking one of these 3 ways 1.) Treat like double ropes (don't like this option because of the increased forces on mah body/anchor, they are both 10.2) 2.) Butterfly coil and turn into a backpack 3.) Treat like a haul line What is the best option for this, or I am just completely off? Thanks
|
|
|
|
|
krosbakken
Jul 16, 2009, 3:44 PM
Post #2 of 48
(17887 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Nov 1, 2006
Posts: 581
|
Your on the right track but... Do not do #1 that is not safe. Plus it would be heavy and not worth it. #2 would work just fine but if there is any chimney moves or anything it might get in your way. If you do it this way have your second carry it. (I guess it is no different than climbing with a pack on.) #3 would also work well. but the leader should trail it because if it got stuck the second can get it out if needed. It all comes done to personal preference. Both #2 and #3 work. Just remember, don't ever use single ropes as doubles.
(This post was edited by krosbakken on Jul 16, 2009, 3:48 PM)
|
|
|
|
|
sungam
Jul 16, 2009, 3:52 PM
Post #3 of 48
(17877 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Jun 24, 2004
Posts: 26804
|
krosbakken wrote: Just remember, don't ever use single ropes as doubles. I think you're thinking of twins (twins get clipped through the same beaner). Double ropes aren't actually that bad as doubles, though they are heavier and in the vary odd chance that you managed to whip in such a way that they both get loaded, which would be pretty much impossible on a sport route. In fact, I think it would make it a bit safer - you could blow clips and whip on the extra slack.
|
|
|
|
|
lena_chita
Moderator
Jul 16, 2009, 4:06 PM
Post #4 of 48
(17864 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Jun 27, 2006
Posts: 6087
|
Wait, are you planning on REGULARLY bailing on long sport routes? So regularly that you would carry the extra rope with you every time you would do a longer route?
|
|
|
|
|
bigo
Jul 16, 2009, 4:15 PM
Post #5 of 48
(17850 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Mar 11, 2002
Posts: 237
|
If it comes down to it, you should be able to get off most any sport route with a single rope. It just may require leaving more than a single bail biner. Or, have your second trail a second rope and if you need to bail, use the lead line to haul up your second rope. This is tough on a traversing pitch since you have to pull the lead line through all of the draws and drop it back to your second. Either way, you shouldn't need to lead with a second single rope ...
(This post was edited by bigo on Jul 16, 2009, 4:17 PM)
|
|
|
|
|
Peasley1
Jul 16, 2009, 4:16 PM
Post #6 of 48
(17849 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Jun 22, 2009
Posts: 51
|
lena_chita wrote: Wait, are you planning on REGULARLY bailing on long sport routes? So regularly that you would carry the extra rope with you every time you would do a longer route? Well I don't every plan to bail, just shit happens sometimes that you can't plan for. Like I don't plan to fall either but I still have a rope.
|
|
|
|
|
Peasley1
Jul 16, 2009, 4:17 PM
Post #7 of 48
(17844 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Jun 22, 2009
Posts: 51
|
bigo wrote: If it comes down to it, you should be able to get off most any sport route with a single rope. It just may require leaving more than a single bail biner. Or, have your second trail the rope and if you need to bail, use the lead line to haul up your second rope. This is tough on a traversing pitch since you have to pull the lead line through all of the draws and drop it back to your second. Either way, you shouldn't need to lead with a second single rope ... Yea this sounds like the best method, thanks for all the responses.
|
|
|
|
|
krosbakken
Jul 16, 2009, 4:18 PM
Post #8 of 48
(17841 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Nov 1, 2006
Posts: 581
|
sungam wrote: krosbakken wrote: Just remember, don't ever use single ropes as doubles. Double ropes aren't actually that bad as doubles, Fair enough. but I think you meant single ropes aren't as bad as doubles.
|
|
|
|
|
sungam
Jul 16, 2009, 7:49 PM
Post #9 of 48
(17763 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Jun 24, 2004
Posts: 26804
|
krosbakken wrote: sungam wrote: krosbakken wrote: Just remember, don't ever use single ropes as doubles. Double ropes aren't actually that bad as doubles, Fair enough. but I think you meant single ropes aren't as bad as doubles. Yes, that is korekt. I, er... had to give you something.
|
|
|
|
|
caughtinside
Jul 16, 2009, 8:06 PM
Post #10 of 48
(17743 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Jan 8, 2003
Posts: 30603
|
Best methods if you need two ropes: 1) have the second trail it up (be sure it is flaked out so it doesn't get hung up) 2) pull the lead rope up through all the draws, lower it down, and have the belayer tie the second rope to the lead rope, tow it up. 3) trail it like a haul line. Having the leader trail is a last resort IMO on a sport route, because it adds a lot of extra weight and you're already headed up pretty high if the route is over 100 feet.
|
|
|
|
|
marc801
Jul 16, 2009, 8:35 PM
Post #11 of 48
(17708 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Aug 1, 2005
Posts: 2806
|
bigo wrote: Or, have your second trail a second rope and if you need to bail, use the lead line to haul up your second rope. This is tough on a traversing pitch since you have to pull the lead line through all of the draws and drop it back to your second. And if on a multipitch route that overhangs or one where the line puts the leader over a spot the second cannot reach (eg: the route starts from the left end of a ledge and traverses left at some point), difficult to impossible to get the rope back to the now stranded second. The leader is possibly stranded as well.
|
|
|
|
|
bigo
Jul 16, 2009, 10:14 PM
Post #12 of 48
(17664 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Mar 11, 2002
Posts: 237
|
marc801 wrote: bigo wrote: Or, have your second trail a second rope and if you need to bail, use the lead line to haul up your second rope. This is tough on a traversing pitch since you have to pull the lead line through all of the draws and drop it back to your second. And if on a multipitch route that overhangs or one where the line puts the leader over a spot the second cannot reach (eg: the route starts from the left end of a ledge and traverses left at some point), difficult to impossible to get the rope back to the now stranded second. The leader is possibly stranded as well. So true, but with a little creativity, there are always ways to make it work. Belay your second to the bolt below your bail point where they can get the second rope to the leader. Or, tape the trailing rope end to end and pull it through the draws. Or, fix the lead line and descend a single rope back to the belay re-clipping draws then re-jug the fixed line trailing the second back to the bail anchor. I'm sure there are other ways.
|
|
|
|
|
marc801
Jul 16, 2009, 10:34 PM
Post #13 of 48
(17653 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Aug 1, 2005
Posts: 2806
|
bigo wrote: marc801 wrote: bigo wrote: Or, have your second trail a second rope and if you need to bail, use the lead line to haul up your second rope. This is tough on a traversing pitch since you have to pull the lead line through all of the draws and drop it back to your second. And if on a multipitch route that overhangs or one where the line puts the leader over a spot the second cannot reach (eg: the route starts from the left end of a ledge and traverses left at some point), difficult to impossible to get the rope back to the now stranded second. The leader is possibly stranded as well. So true, but with a little creativity, there are always ways to make it work. Belay your second to the bolt below your bail point where they can get the second rope to the leader. Or, tape the trailing rope end to end and pull it through the draws. Or, fix the lead line and descend a single rope back to the belay re-clipping draws then re-jug the fixed line trailing the second back to the bail anchor. I'm sure there are other ways. Agreed...provided that the party takes the time to think things through. Having had experience rescuing a stranded second in just this situation, I thought it worth the mention!
|
|
|
|
|
shimanilami
Jul 16, 2009, 10:35 PM
Post #14 of 48
(17653 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Jul 24, 2006
Posts: 2043
|
Sport route? It's a messed up sport route if you have to use a second rope to get down. Rapping to intermediate anchors I can understand. But a sport route that requires two ropes? It seems like an oxymoron. But maybe I'm just climbing in the wrong places.
|
|
|
|
|
potreroed
Jul 16, 2009, 11:37 PM
Post #15 of 48
(17615 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Sep 30, 2001
Posts: 1454
|
shimanilami wrote: Sport route? It's a messed up sport route if you have to use a second rope to get down. Rapping to intermediate anchors I can understand. But a sport route that requires two ropes? It seems like an oxymoron. But maybe I'm just climbing in the wrong places. In El Potrero Chico, world capital of big wall sport climbs, many trail an extra rope so they can rap two pitches at a time and be down sooner (especially if they simul-rap) for a cold cerveza and a shot of tequila. OP, caughtinside probably has the best answer to your query.
|
|
|
|
|
marc801
Jul 16, 2009, 11:45 PM
Post #16 of 48
(17611 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Aug 1, 2005
Posts: 2806
|
potreroed wrote: shimanilami wrote: Sport route? It's a messed up sport route if you have to use a second rope to get down. Rapping to intermediate anchors I can understand. But a sport route that requires two ropes? It seems like an oxymoron. But maybe I'm just climbing in the wrong places. In El Potrero Chico, world capital of big wall sport climbs, many trail an extra rope so they can rap two pitches at a time and be down sooner (especially if they simul-rap) for a cold cerveza and a shot of tequila. Many routes in Red Rocks require two ropes for the normal descent. There are also a number of bolted routes at City of Rocks that have anchors at 160'.
|
|
|
|
|
Peasley1
Jul 17, 2009, 1:10 AM
Post #17 of 48
(17566 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Jun 22, 2009
Posts: 51
|
Yea I predominatly climb in NC and not a lot where u need two ropes to rap down, this is mainly for future reference if I find myself in that situation.
|
|
|
|
|
DexterRutecki
Jul 17, 2009, 6:41 AM
Post #18 of 48
(17516 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Dec 19, 2008
Posts: 92
|
There's something I'm not getting on this whole thread. It sounds like you're talking about bailing on a sport route, when you're more than half a rope length up. The OP also mentioned he had two ropes. Seems simple to me: Tie the end of the lead rope to the second rope with a triple fishermans knot. Lower the climber until the knot reaches the belay device. Pass the knot - I can think of a few ways. Now, continue to lower them, and pull the rope. I don't know where this talk of "seconds" came in, I saw no mention of multi pitch.
|
|
|
|
|
bigo
Jul 17, 2009, 2:40 PM
Post #19 of 48
(17455 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Mar 11, 2002
Posts: 237
|
DexterRutecki wrote: There's something I'm not getting on this whole thread. It sounds like you're talking about bailing on a sport route, when you're more than half a rope length up. The OP also mentioned he had two ropes. Seems simple to me: Tie the end of the lead rope to the second rope with a triple fishermans knot. Lower the climber until the knot reaches the belay device. Pass the knot - I can think of a few ways. Now, continue to lower them, and pull the rope. I don't know where this talk of "seconds" came in, I saw no mention of multi pitch. Unless the leader is bailing at the first bolt, that won't work as the knot would have to pass through all of the quick draws clipped on the lead.
|
|
|
|
|
DexterRutecki
Jul 17, 2009, 5:06 PM
Post #20 of 48
(17400 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Dec 19, 2008
Posts: 92
|
bigo wrote: DexterRutecki wrote: There's something I'm not getting on this whole thread. Unless the leader is bailing at the first bolt, that won't work as the knot would have to pass through all of the quick draws clipped on the lead. D'oh. That would be it. Thanks.
|
|
|
|
|
marc801
Jul 17, 2009, 5:50 PM
Post #21 of 48
(17378 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Aug 1, 2005
Posts: 2806
|
DexterRutecki wrote: I don't know where this talk of "seconds" came in, I saw no mention of multi pitch. No explicit mention of multi-pitch, just "long sport routes", and certainly a multi-pitch sport route would qualify as long.
|
|
|
|
|
DexterRutecki
Jul 17, 2009, 6:02 PM
Post #22 of 48
(17367 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Dec 19, 2008
Posts: 92
|
marc801 wrote: DexterRutecki wrote: I don't know where this talk of "seconds" came in, I saw no mention of multi pitch. No explicit mention of multi-pitch, just "long sport routes", and certainly a multi-pitch sport route would qualify as long. I think there's a pretty big difference, as multi-pitch implies a belay station that is not on the ground. When I hear "long sport route" I think of some 17 clip rope lengthed monster.
|
|
|
|
|
shimanilami
Jul 17, 2009, 6:57 PM
Post #23 of 48
(17338 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Jul 24, 2006
Posts: 2043
|
DexterRutecki wrote: I think there's a pretty big difference, as multi-pitch implies a belay station that is not on the ground. When I hear "long sport route" I think of some 17 clip rope lengthed monster. I've climbed quite a few routes that are intended to be climbed as a single pitch, but have a rappel station midway so that a single rope can be used to get down. I'm pretty sure that noone ever belays from the midway stations. I love these types of routes. And I love that the guys who put the bolts in were thoughtful enough to add one more bolt so that the rest of us don't need to carry a second rope.
|
|
|
|
|
marc801
Jul 17, 2009, 6:58 PM
Post #24 of 48
(17338 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Aug 1, 2005
Posts: 2806
|
DexterRutecki wrote: marc801 wrote: DexterRutecki wrote: I don't know where this talk of "seconds" came in, I saw no mention of multi pitch. No explicit mention of multi-pitch, just "long sport routes", and certainly a multi-pitch sport route would qualify as long. I think there's a pretty big difference, as multi-pitch implies a belay station that is not on the ground. When I hear "long sport route" I think of some 17 clip rope lengthed monster. Off the top of my head I can think of a few dozen multi-pitch sport routes in various areas just in the US. There are at least a dozen in Utah alone.
|
|
|
|
|
bigo
Jul 17, 2009, 7:08 PM
Post #25 of 48
(17331 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Mar 11, 2002
Posts: 237
|
shimanilami wrote: DexterRutecki wrote: I think there's a pretty big difference, as multi-pitch implies a belay station that is not on the ground. When I hear "long sport route" I think of some 17 clip rope lengthed monster. I've climbed quite a few routes that are intended to be climbed as a single pitch, but have a rappel station midway so that a single rope can be used to get down. I'm pretty sure that noone ever belays from the midway stations. I love these types of routes. And I love that the guys who put the bolts in were thoughtful enough to add one more bolt so that the rest of us don't need to carry a second rope. +1 And the converse, I hate it when anchors are at 40m + with no mid station - what a PITA.
|
|
|
|
|
jeepnphreak
Jul 17, 2009, 7:11 PM
Post #26 of 48
(11138 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Jul 29, 2008
Posts: 1259
|
shimanilami wrote: Sport route? It's a messed up sport route if you have to use a second rope to get down. Rapping to intermediate anchors I can understand. But a sport route that requires two ropes? It seems like an oxymoron. But maybe I'm just climbing in the wrong places. Not really. in montana we have a few, (not many) single pitch sport routes that are 140-160 feet long that requires a doubel rope rap to get down. Iam sure were not the only place that has long pitch routes.
|
|
|
|
|
shimanilami
Jul 17, 2009, 8:23 PM
Post #27 of 48
(11129 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Jul 24, 2006
Posts: 2043
|
It's all good, but IMO "sport" implies maximum convenience and minimal effort ... for me, that is. You lazy bastards should put midway rap anchors in and then, perhaps, I'll come and climb there.
|
|
|
|
|
marc801
Jul 17, 2009, 8:55 PM
Post #28 of 48
(11122 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Aug 1, 2005
Posts: 2806
|
shimanilami wrote: It's all good, but IMO "sport" implies maximum convenience and minimal effort ... for me, that is. You lazy bastards should put midway rap anchors in and then, perhaps, I'll come and climb there. As an example, there's a particular 3 pitch sport route at City of Rocks, with the belay stations 160' apart (when a 50m rope was the standard). I'd rather trail my 8mm static line and do 3 raps to the ground instead of taking only one rope and doing 6 raps. Maximum convenience and minimal effort can sometimes be mutually exclusive.
|
|
|
|
|
marc801
Jul 17, 2009, 9:32 PM
Post #30 of 48
(11113 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Aug 1, 2005
Posts: 2806
|
oldsalt wrote: I also like to carry 200' of 5mm cord in a mesh bag. I hang the primary through both anchor rings with a big locker stopper. The tag line is also on the big locker, but not through the rings. It feeds out of the bag while I rap, and then I use it to haul down the primary. Standard technique in canyoneering, too. It's called a biner block. The only downside with that skinny a retrieval line is that if your primary (lead) line gets stuck on the pull-down, you may have no way of safely climbing up to free it.
|
|
|
|
|
bill413
Jul 17, 2009, 10:29 PM
Post #31 of 48
(11093 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Oct 19, 2004
Posts: 5674
|
shimanilami wrote: It's all good, but IMO "sport" implies maximum convenience and minimal effort ... for me, that is. You lazy bastards should put midway rap anchors in and then, perhaps, I'll come and climb there. Minimal effort - they should put f'ing ladders on the rock.
|
|
|
|
|
shimanilami
Jul 18, 2009, 12:22 AM
Post #32 of 48
(11074 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Jul 24, 2006
Posts: 2043
|
bill413 wrote: shimanilami wrote: It's all good, but IMO "sport" implies maximum convenience and minimal effort ... for me, that is. You lazy bastards should put midway rap anchors in and then, perhaps, I'll come and climb there. Minimal effort - they should put f'ing ladders on the rock. What are you saying, that aid climbing is easy? Them's fightin' words, Bill.
|
|
|
|
|
marc801
Jul 18, 2009, 1:05 AM
Post #33 of 48
(11070 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Aug 1, 2005
Posts: 2806
|
shimanilami wrote: What are you saying, that aid climbing is easy? It sure can be.....but it's the walls to which it's often attached......
|
|
|
|
|
bill413
Jul 18, 2009, 2:16 AM
Post #34 of 48
(11060 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Oct 19, 2004
Posts: 5674
|
shimanilami wrote: bill413 wrote: shimanilami wrote: It's all good, but IMO "sport" implies maximum convenience and minimal effort ... for me, that is. You lazy bastards should put midway rap anchors in and then, perhaps, I'll come and climb there. Minimal effort - they should put f'ing ladders on the rock. What are you saying, that aid climbing is easy? Them's fightin' words, Bill. Nope - i know aid is work (perhaps too much so). Surprisingly hard work. It's the "maximum convenience" phrase. Hmmm...can we have shuttles to the cliffs instead of those stupid approaches?
|
|
|
|
|
Goo
Jul 18, 2009, 12:42 PM
Post #36 of 48
(11042 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Oct 6, 2008
Posts: 68
|
there are a couple routes like that here in georgia that i can think of. isn't too uncommon.
|
|
|
|
|
jeepnphreak
Jul 20, 2009, 11:30 PM
Post #37 of 48
(10983 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Jul 29, 2008
Posts: 1259
|
shimanilami wrote: It's all good, but IMO "sport" implies maximum convenience and minimal effort ... for me, that is. You lazy bastards should put midway rap anchors in and then, perhaps, I'll come and climb there. Sport implies max convenience... not here. Spots simply mean a face climb that your cant protect anyother way, so we drill in a couple of bolts. Plus why should we put in halfway rap stations in if it keeps you/other climber off the routes if you are unwilling to pack up an extra rope. that means less people to waite for. ha ha.
|
|
|
|
|
wallwombat
Aug 6, 2009, 7:55 AM
Post #38 of 48
(10905 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Jun 17, 2003
Posts: 727
|
potreroed wrote: In El Potrero Chico, world capital of big wall sport climbs.... I would have thought that the Verdon Gorge would qualify as "the world capital of big wall sport climbs" but since it's not in North America, you probably haven't heard of it.
|
|
|
|
|
potreroed
Aug 6, 2009, 7:09 PM
Post #39 of 48
(10868 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Sep 30, 2001
Posts: 1454
|
Although I've not been there (have you?) I am aware of the fabulous Verdon Gorge. We get many French and other European climbers at El Potrero Chico who tell me EPC is as good as Verdon. In fact, a couple who own a Bed & Breakfast at Verdon come to El Potrero Chico every winter for their vacation.
|
|
|
|
|
clmbr
Aug 25, 2009, 2:41 AM
Post #40 of 48
(10775 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Jul 31, 2008
Posts: 29
|
Setting up the second rope to rap from the anchors is fine... if you get to the anchors, but usually if you gotta bail it'll be at the most awkward part of a climb and hanging off your quickdraw on a single bolt. So you're not going to be bringing the second up with the extra rope and all of you hanging off the bolt. To do all the tasks involved in setting up the second rope yourself is going to be mission there too. Don't forget your maillion or byebye to quickdraw
|
|
|
|
|
docburner
Aug 25, 2009, 5:31 PM
Post #41 of 48
(10749 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Jul 11, 2005
Posts: 192
|
At a local crag in ca, people just stop clipping bolts once they hit the ~110 foot mark, and then take the whip. But I guess it is all fixed draws so you don't have to get any gear back.
|
|
|
|
|
ShibbyShane
Aug 25, 2009, 9:34 PM
Post #42 of 48
(10733 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Dec 16, 2008
Posts: 166
|
docburner wrote: At a local crag in ca, people just stop clipping bolts once they hit the ~110 foot mark, and then take the whip. But I guess it is all fixed draws so you don't have to get any gear back. Huh? How far will they climb above the last bolt if they're doing this? I mean, if the climb is 140 or so, they're taking a 60+ foot whipper... I wouldn't think it'd be too good for your rope to do this all the time. Where in CA is this?
|
|
|
|
|
freerangequark
Oct 31, 2009, 7:21 PM
Post #43 of 48
(10380 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Jul 23, 2006
Posts: 107
|
Peasley1 wrote: 1.) Treat like double ropes (don't like this option because of the increased forces on mah body/anchor, they are both 10.2) On trad routes I've almost always used twins... but in regard to #1 (above) I was wondering... Would it be possible for the leader to climb with two standard ropes, clip the two ropes. but have the belayer only belaying one of the ropes. Essentially the second rope is along for the ride and while the first rope is doing what a single rope would normally do. There are a few possible drawbacks I see to this such as increased rope weight on the leader. I've never climbed like this and am not recommending. I am simply asking if there is anything problematic or dangerous with what I am describing? Thanks, Glenn
(This post was edited by freerangequark on Oct 31, 2009, 7:55 PM)
|
|
|
|
|
slablizard
Oct 31, 2009, 7:37 PM
Post #44 of 48
(10375 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Oct 13, 2003
Posts: 5558
|
One of the best climbing in the world...amazing multi-pitch climbs, they all start with a hanging belay...and you better be SOLID on anything under 11a, it's runout man...and WAY exposed..the fiurst whippers take your breath off..then you get addicted to it.
wallwombat wrote: potreroed wrote: In El Potrero Chico, world capital of big wall sport climbs.... I would have thought that the Verdon Gorge would qualify as "the world capital of big wall sport climbs" but since it's not in North America, you probably haven't heard of it.
|
|
|
|
|
qtm
Nov 1, 2009, 1:42 AM
Post #45 of 48
(10362 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Apr 8, 2004
Posts: 548
|
freerangequark wrote: Peasley1 wrote: 1.) Treat like double ropes (don't like this option because of the increased forces on mah body/anchor, they are both 10.2) On trad routes I've almost always used twins... but in regard to #1 (above) I was wondering... Would it be possible for the leader to climb with two standard ropes, clip the two ropes. but have the belayer only belaying one of the ropes. Essentially the second rope is along for the ride and while the first rope is doing what a single rope would normally do. There are a few possible drawbacks I see to this such as increased rope weight on the leader. I've never climbed like this and am not recommending. I am simply asking if there is anything problematic or dangerous with what I am describing? Thanks, Glenn Having other sport climbers laughing at you? I'm primarily a trad climber and climb with doubles. I've lead trad and sport with two singles as doubles when I felt it would be easier for me to lead than have the 2nd trail the rope for whatever reason. Yes, I'd rather have the 2nd trail it, but taking into consideration the route and the abilities of my 2nd, sometimes it's better if I lead with it. I'd rather lead as doubles than clipping as twins and leaving one unbelayed. Otherwise I'll just trail it and not bother making the effort to clip it.
|
|
|
|
|
bennydh
Nov 1, 2009, 3:52 AM
Post #46 of 48
(10348 views)
Shortcut
Registered: May 2, 2005
Posts: 368
|
It brings up issues of redundancy, safety, and usually instigates a lot of butt hurt people on forums with retorts like: "you're gonna kill the noob", but it is still an option and done right it is relatively safe, IMO. Have someone knowledgeable teach you a Texas Rope Trick. Also acknowledge that fucking up, or a simple lapse in judgment has serious consequences... Like death.
|
|
|
|
|
freerangequark
Nov 1, 2009, 1:24 PM
Post #47 of 48
(10324 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Jul 23, 2006
Posts: 107
|
qtm wrote: freerangequark wrote: Peasley1 wrote: 1.) Treat like double ropes (don't like this option because of the increased forces on mah body/anchor, they are both 10.2) On trad routes I've almost always used twins... but in regard to #1 (above) I was wondering... Would it be possible for the leader to climb with two standard ropes, clip the two ropes. but have the belayer only belaying one of the ropes. Essentially the second rope is along for the ride and while the first rope is doing what a single rope would normally do. There are a few possible drawbacks I see to this such as increased rope weight on the leader. I've never climbed like this and am not recommending. I am simply asking if there is anything problematic or dangerous with what I am describing? Thanks, Glenn Having other sport climbers laughing at you? I'm primarily a trad climber and climb with doubles. I've lead trad and sport with two singles as doubles when I felt it would be easier for me to lead than have the 2nd trail the rope for whatever reason. Yes, I'd rather have the 2nd trail it, but taking into consideration the route and the abilities of my 2nd, sometimes it's better if I lead with it. I'd rather lead as doubles than clipping as twins and leaving one unbelayed. Otherwise I'll just trail it and not bother making the effort to clip it. LOL...my bad for not clarifying. I was talking about a trad route where the other rope coming up as a tagline from the second might get caught in a crack or where the route might wander a bit.... not on a sport route. -Glenn
|
|
|
|
|
newriverE
Nov 1, 2009, 4:28 PM
Post #48 of 48
(10304 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Sep 6, 2009
Posts: 36
|
Having two ropes is great. Alternate their use and extend both of their lives. I guess it depends on the routes you'll be climbing as to whether or not I'd carry two ropes. For my taste, I'd rather carry along two extra $7.50 quicksilver screwgates and leave them on the route if I had to bail early than deal with the extra weight, bulk, or logistics of bringing along the second rope. I'm thinking of long vertical sport climbs here. I know that people take two ropes up climbs all the time. OR, if I knew that my favorite place to climb had super long pitches and I needed more cord to get to the ground I'd just order my favorite rope from Sterling in an 80m version. It's like 80 dollars more and over the life of the rope that extra cost would be worth the freedom of a single line, in my opinion. And, if you want to check out some sweet multipitch sport this side of the Verdon go to the beaver dam wall area outside of St George UT where there are some 7 pitch climbs up to the 14a range...
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|