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alpheli
Feb 12, 2005, 3:42 AM
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I used to love The North Face gear (I have a >5 old Himalyan Suit and I love it) . However a couple of years has passed since then. Now they seem to be insisting on burning their brand for cash as fast as possible.
The kichatna jacket was the standard for jackets (at least in Sweden) and their tents were top-of-the-line. But now there seems to be no development except maybe the new line of eyewear...jeez..
I would understand if it made business sense, but destroying the client base of climbers that give the brand the "x-factor", and which is the reason that mom & pop are willing to pay premium dollars for a 3-ply jacket they don't need and use for simple jogging/walking (or just wear to pick up the kids from school).
Many/Most climber have moved on to other brands such as Arcteryx, and it won't take that many years before "x-factor"-hunting-wannabes realise this and move on also. Then TNF will be left with a lame brand, mediocre gear, only being able to charge mediocre prices and stuck with the bills from the expeditions they sponsored while desperately trying make people believe they still have the "x-factor".
I'm getting long winded so I won't get into what TNF did with A5, but the images pretty much says it all.
Pre-TNF:
http://www.bigwalls.net/climb/A5f/image26.jpghttp://www.bigwalls.net/climb/A5f/image18.jpg
Post-TNF:
http://www.bigwalls.net/...b/A5f/A5-in-2003.jpg
The images are from http://www.bigwalls.net/climb/A5trans.html.
/Alpheli
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sharpie
Feb 12, 2005, 5:08 AM
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TNF is no longer the company it used to be. Between the late 60's to mid 90's they developed a strong brand with an equally strong reputation for quality and innovation, and then were gobbled up by a conglomerate...
This should answer your question...http://www.vfc.com
They (TNF/VFC) damn near sank La Sportiva too in the late 90's, luckily they were able to fit their way out of the machine.
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jimdavis
Feb 12, 2005, 5:25 AM
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Yeah, their gear pretty much sucks now. Their upper line stuff is still good, but most of it isn't worth it these days.
I've already seen someone on our campus that schedules intermural sports and pool schedules wearing a Cloudviel hardshell. I know the guy presonally, I don't think he even owns a backpack; definitly not a harness. He used to be our marketing/ financial co-ordinator for the climbing program I work for (and no we didn't have pro on Cloudviel).
Now that Marmot is making it's way into EMS's more, you can expect to see more people wearing PreCips and Sharp Points. Hopefully Marmot won't go the way of TNF.
Cheers,
Jim
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nedsurf
Feb 12, 2005, 5:41 AM
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:lol: I love seeing the mall walkers paying way too much for that crap, thinking they are Xtreme. The company that bought TNF is pretty smart though. They are definitly making more money on hyping the brand and selling volume to many more people. Plus they save a dime by having inferior product made overseas.
It is disgusting corprate, but hey, let us, the climbing community, consciously develop these brands then sell the rights to some corprate conglomerate. If we set the start up right as an employee owned entity we all can make beer and gear money. Plus we can undermine the brand within the climbing community, after it is sold by submitting anynomous letters to the editor of rock and ice, explaining that product quality is about to take a major downturn.
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monkeyarm
Feb 12, 2005, 5:50 AM
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TNF is smart right now they are making a bundle selling their line to a alrger market because it is a hot item, why would you create a better product only to lost your customer bas who don't care who it performs as long as it looks good in the mall.
If the company ever loses its popularity if it starts producing quality products it will attract the outdoor market again who are always looking for teh best and cheapest.
nerserf wrote:
In reply to: :lol: I love seeing the mall walkers paying way too much for that crap, thinking they are Xtreme.
See i look at it the other way, i laugh when i see someone camping in it
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nicklikesfire
Feb 12, 2005, 5:51 AM
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The TNF fleeces (denali, I think) Are uber trendy around here, the Northeast. I don't know why.
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euroford
Feb 12, 2005, 6:15 AM
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though i tend to buy other brands, and definitly shy away fro most TNF stuff, i just bought a new pack from them, and i think its bitchin.
hit or miss i guess, mostly miss, but sometimes the stuff is cool. ya just gotta be an informed consumer.
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euroford
Feb 12, 2005, 6:16 AM
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though i tend to buy other brands, and definitly shy away fro most TNF stuff, i just bought a new pack from them, and i think its bitchin.
hit or miss i guess, mostly miss, but sometimes the stuff is cool. ya just gotta be an informed consumer.
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cgailey
Feb 12, 2005, 6:41 AM
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In reply to: In reply to: What happened to TNF? they figured out that they could make more money selling overpriced jackets to about 300 million 9-5ers, soccer moms, and kids, then they could selling modestly priced garments to just a few thousand climbers.
Funny...REI is the same way.... :roll:
Guess you gotta make money somehow....unfortunately any resemblance of fidelity to their origins is quickly fading away... :?
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ryan112ryan
Feb 12, 2005, 6:49 AM
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Some stuff from TNF is pretty good, I spend allot of time on choosing my gear, so if TNF ends up being the best suited, all things considered, then so be it. I can't stand when technical/serious outdoor gear/clothes become main stream, popularized, trendy, or are own and used by people who don't go outdoors with their outdoor gear. for example:
1) A kid on my ultimate team has a auto locking carb to attach his water bottle to his backpack (you know since you need something that is rated at 25 Kn to hold a water bottle weighing 4 pounds full)
2) How TNF jacket I have and use on backpacking and climbing trips every weekend is now something every rich yuppie asks their parents for to walk to class.....a whole 3 minute walk on my campus
3) Sorority sisters carrying nalgene bottles.....nuf said
4) High end breathable jacket that are suited for mountaineering etc. when it’s drizzling outside
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jpdreamer
Feb 12, 2005, 7:10 AM
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In reply to: 3) Sorority sisters carrying nalgene bottles.....nuf said
Actually I never thought this was strange. Why not use a nalgene for everyday use? It doesn't impart any taste to the water and is pretty well indistructable. Now if they were using a water bottle with a built in water purifier or something meant for backpacking I'd agree that's excess, but not on this one.
And reguarding TNF gear, I have a Cat's Meow sleeping bag which has served me well.
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ryan112ryan
Feb 12, 2005, 7:20 AM
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In reply to: In reply to: 3) Sorority sisters carrying nalgene bottles.....nuf said Actually I never thought this was strange. Why not use a nalgene for everyday use? It doesn't impart any taste to the water and is pretty well indistructable. Now if they were using a water bottle with a built in water purifier or something meant for backpacking I'd agree that's excess, but not on this one.
yeah i can see that, but then again i think nalgene and i think of the times ive dropped it from high up or backpacking more outdoors stuff. funny story actaully there were some kids at my school who were big into outdoor stuff too and like me didn't like how all the outdoor gear was used by people who see the outdoors via TV. when ever they saw someone who had a nalgene that was unscratched/new they would take it and hurl in across the ground and get it all scratched up, though mean i couldn't help but smile :D
In reply to: And reguarding TNF gear, I have a Cat's Meow sleeping bag which has served me well.
i have the same one and i love it!
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c-money
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Feb 12, 2005, 8:17 AM
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In reply to: TNF is no longer the company it used to be. Between the late 60's to mid 90's they developed a strong brand with an equally strong reputation for quality and innovation, and then were gobbled up by a conglomerate... This should answer your question... http://www.vfc.com
You got it.
TNF didn't change, or get smart as many have suggested: they sold out.
Whatever. They are now about "value for $" (as said by one of their reps) rather than quality and innovation. The funny thing is, many other big brands are better made AND better priced...
TNF could be the best example of a full on "extreme wanker" brand right now. How the mighty have fallen.
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walrus
Feb 12, 2005, 9:00 AM
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I bought a tnf goretex jacket with liner and pants in a back alley in China a year ago. They looked good but the jacket leaks and the zipper is on the wrong side.
I will not pay full price for tnf. I do love my discounted tnf sleeping bag.
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cgailey
Feb 12, 2005, 10:24 AM
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In reply to: I bought a tnf goretex jacket with liner and pants in a back alley in China a year ago. They looked good but the jacket leaks and the zipper is on the wrong side. I will not pay full price for tnf. I do love my discounted tnf sleeping bag.
Have you considered that just maybe your jacket and pants were knockoffs? :roll:
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buckeyeclimbski
Feb 12, 2005, 1:04 PM
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Ok, I am currently a student at Ohio State University, and tnf denali fleece jacket, is the newest trendy apparel here on campus. There are a few of us that actually own north face denali and mountain hardware tech windstopper fleece's that have come to notice the sheer abundance of people with way too much money on their hands for college students. I had a girl in one of my classes that had five denali jackets. FIVE!!!, on of every color WTF!! When I asked her why she had five jackets , her reply was that she had to have one to match each pair of uggs that she had. For all of you who don't know what uggs are check out this website.
http://www.uggaustralia.com/Products.asp?dept_id=3&g=women&c=Classic&sc=33&col=2
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fire_eyes
Feb 12, 2005, 1:23 PM
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In reply to: Some stuff from TNF is pretty good, I spend allot of time on choosing my gear, so if TNF ends up being the best suited, all things considered, then so be it. I can't stand when technical/serious outdoor gear/clothes become main stream, popularized, trendy, or are own and used by people who don't go outdoors with their outdoor gear. for example: 1) A kid on my ultimate team has a auto locking carb to attach his water bottle to his backpack (you know since you need something that is rated at 25 Kn to hold a water bottle weighing 4 pounds full) 2) How TNF jacket I have and use on backpacking and climbing trips every weekend is now something every rich yuppie asks their parents for to walk to class.....a whole 3 minute walk on my campus 3) Sorority sisters carrying nalgene bottles.....nuf said 4) High end breathable jacket that are suited for mountaineering etc. when it’s drizzling outside
I am so glad I can rate posts today :D
Good stuff Ryan...
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climbingnurse
Feb 12, 2005, 2:12 PM
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When the new A5 was rolled out they came to a store near where I live and set up a display. I walked up and looked the stuff over... And became really confused. I asked the rep "Where's all the aid gear?" I got a blank stare. It took him a few seconds to say "What's aid gear?"
Further questioning revealed that this guy had never tied into a rope and that A5 was no longer making gear for climbing A-anything.
I do have one of their shirts though. It's pretty nice. I just cut the tags off it.
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harrisha
Feb 12, 2005, 2:21 PM
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Yeah, I used to have a old TNF bag > 5 yrs. It was awsome but the insulation lost its lofting power and I retired it. Now I feel they gone the way of mass marketed crap. I'd never pay $300+ for a TNF shell. Hell I wouldn't keep one if someone gave it to me. I'd turn around and sell it too some soccer momby telling her she needed three-ply XCR to go get the newspaper at the end of the drive way. I think my ultimate new gripe is the MET-5 (that jacket that has a battery and heats up).
On a side note, this girl I go to school with has a boyfriend who dad is one of VF Corp. vice presidents. I told her she should try to talk to him about TNF quality and prices, being that it is overpriced crap. She just kind of looked at me like what, despite the fact that its 70 degrees I'm stylin' my denalie jacket. You know the pink looks great with these boots and jeans. My point here is, as long as this is the customer base don't expect any drastic changes at TNF.
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climbingnurse
Feb 12, 2005, 2:22 PM
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On another note:
One of my clinical rotations is in an innercity trauma center. TNF is VERY popular with my clientelle there. I can tell you from personal experience that it is NOT bulletproof.
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harrisha
Feb 12, 2005, 2:22 PM
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Yeah, I used to have a old TNF bag > 5 yrs. It was awsome but the insulation lost its lofting power and I retired it. Now I feel they gone the way of mass marketed crap. I'd never pay $300+ for a TNF shell. Hell I wouldn't keep one if someone gave it to me. I'd turn around and sell it too some soccer momby telling her she needed three-ply XCR to go get the newspaper at the end of the drive way. I think my ultimate new gripe is the MET-5 (that jacket that has a battery and heats up).
On a side note, this girl I go to school with has a boyfriend who dad is one of VF Corp. vice presidents. I told her she should try to talk to him about TNF quality and prices, being that it is overpriced crap. She just kind of looked at me like what, despite the fact that its 70 degrees I'm stylin' my denalie jacket. You know the pink looks great with these boots and jeans. My point here is, as long as this is the customer base don't expect any drastic changes at TNF.
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harrisha
Feb 12, 2005, 2:27 PM
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Yeah, I used to have a old TNF bag > 5 yrs. It was awsome but the insulation lost its lofting power and I retired it. Now I feel they gone the way of mass marketed crap. I'd never pay $300+ for a TNF shell. Hell I wouldn't keep one if someone gave it to me. I'd turn around and sell it too some soccer momby telling her she needed three-ply XCR to go get the newspaper at the end of the drive way. I think my ultimate new gripe is the MET-5 (that jacket that has a battery and heats up).
On a side note, this girl I go to school with has a boyfriend who dad is one of VF Corp. vice presidents. I told her she should try to talk to him about TNF quality and prices, being that it is overpriced crap. She just kind of looked at me like what, despite the fact that its 70 degrees I'm stylin' my denalie jacket. You know the pink looks great with these boots and jeans. My point here is, as long as this is the customer base don't expect any drastic changes at TNF.
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harrisha
Feb 12, 2005, 2:28 PM
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Yeah, I used to have a old TNF bag > 5 yrs. It was awsome but the insulation lost its lofting power and I retired it. Now I feel they gone the way of mass marketed crap. I'd never pay $300+ for a TNF shell. Hell I wouldn't keep one if someone gave it to me. I'd turn around and sell it too some soccer momby telling her she needed three-ply XCR to go get the newspaper at the end of the drive way. I think my ultimate new gripe is the MET-5 (that jacket that has a battery and heats up).
On a side note, this girl I go to school with has a boyfriend who dad is one of VF Corp. vice presidents. I told her she should try to talk to him about TNF quality and prices, being that it is overpriced crap. She just kind of looked at me like what, despite the fact that its 70 degrees I'm stylin' my denalie jacket. You know the pink looks great with these boots and jeans. My point here is, as long as this is the customer base don't expect any drastic changes at TNF.
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harrisha
Feb 12, 2005, 2:29 PM
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Yeah, I used to have a old TNF bag more than 5 yrs. old. It was awsome but the insulation lost its lofting power and I retired it. Now I feel they gone the way of mass marketed crap. I'd never pay 300 for a TNF shell. Hell I wouldn't keep one if someone gave it to me. I'd turn around and sell it too some soccer momby telling her she needed three-ply XCR to go get the newspaper at the end of the drive way. I think my ultimate new gripe is the MET-5 that jacket that has a battery and heats up.
On a side note, this girl I go to school with has a boyfriend who dad is one of VF Corp. vice presidents. I told her she should try to talk to him about TNF quality and prices, being that it is overpriced crap. She just kind of looked at me like what, despite the fact that its 70 degrees I'm stylin' my denalie jacket. You know the pink looks great with these boots and jeans. My point here is, as long as this is the customer base don't expect any drastic changes at TNF.
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harrisha
Feb 12, 2005, 2:29 PM
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Yeah, I used to have a old TNF bag > 5 yrs. It was awsome but the insulation lost its lofting power and I retired it. Now I feel they gone the way of mass marketed crap. I'd never pay $300+ for a TNF shell. Hell I wouldn't keep one if someone gave it to me. I'd turn around and sell it too some soccer momby telling her she needed three-ply XCR to go get the newspaper at the end of the drive way. I think my ultimate new gripe is the MET-5 (that jacket that has a battery and heats up).
On a side note, this girl I go to school with has a boyfriend who dad is one of VF Corp. vice presidents. I told her she should try to talk to him about TNF quality and prices, being that it is overpriced s#$%. She just kind of looked at me like what, despite the fact that its 70 degrees I'm stylin' my denalie jacket. You know the pink looks great with these boots and jeans. My point here is, as long as this is the customer base don't expect any drastic changes at TNF.
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harrisha
Feb 12, 2005, 2:49 PM
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Yeah, I used to have a old TNF bag > 5 yrs. It was awsome but the insulation lost its lofting power and I retired it. Now I feel they gone the way of mass marketed crap. I'd never pay $300+ for a TNF shell. Hell I wouldn't keep one if someone gave it to me. I'd turn around and sell it too some soccer momby telling her she needed three-ply XCR to go get the newspaper at the end of the drive way. I think my ultimate new gripe is the MET-5 (that jacket that has a battery and heats up).
On a side note, this girl I go to school with has a boyfriend who dad is one of VF Corp. vice presidents. I told her she should try to talk to him about TNF quality and prices, being that it is overpriced crap. She just kind of looked at me like what, despite the fact that its 70 degrees I'm stylin' my denalie jacket. You know the pink looks great with these boots and jeans. My point here is, as long as this is the customer base don't expect any drastic changes at TNF.
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cliffhanger9
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Feb 12, 2005, 2:50 PM
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these were all split from Re: What happened to TNF? in gear heads...
somehow this guy managed to make 7 duplicate posts. taking up most of the page
yikes.
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cliffhanger9
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Feb 12, 2005, 2:50 PM
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cliffhanger9 has locked this thread.
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harrisha
Feb 12, 2005, 2:53 PM
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In reply to: On another note: One of my clinical rotations is in an innercity trauma center. TNF is VERY popular with my clientelle there. I can tell you from personal experience that it is NOT bulletproof.
Really, with their prices I would have expected the stuff to be made from kevlar. That stuff's like $1.50-$1.75 per sq. inch.
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fallingup
Feb 12, 2005, 3:51 PM
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Yeah, all of you are right in one way or another. I have a TNF shell, two fleeses, a cat's meow, a daypack and an Alpha Aurora backpace plus some a shirt and pants. (Damn that's quite a bit of TNF stuff) All of it I purchased at some type of sale or recieved at a discount due to coupons or staff discount. While I probably won't buy any more TNF stuff what I have functions great for what I need.
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mack_north
Feb 12, 2005, 4:18 PM
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In reply to: I've already seen someone on our campus that schedules intermural sports and pool schedules wearing a Cloudviel hardshell. I know the guy presonally, I don't think he even owns a backpack; definitly not a harness. Cheers, Jim
What? He wears a technical shell and he does nothing more technical than schedule pool schedules? We should get together a big crew of smug wannabe elitists and go kick his ass! Anyone who wears a Cloudveil shell needs to toprope at least 6 days a year according to my calculation!
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mack_north
Feb 12, 2005, 4:20 PM
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In reply to: I've already seen someone on our campus that schedules intermural sports and pool schedules wearing a Cloudviel hardshell. I know the guy presonally, I don't think he even owns a backpack; definitly not a harness. Cheers, Jim
What? He wears a technical shell and he does nothing more technical than schedule pool schedules? The gall of it! We should get together a big crew of smug wannabe elitists and go stomp him like grapes! Anyone who wears a Cloudveil shell needs to toprope at least 6 days a year according to my calculation!
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naw
Feb 12, 2005, 4:26 PM
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When I first got into climbing about 1.5 years ago I bought a Denali fleece on the suggestion of a lot of different internet reviews talking about what great jackets they were. I didn't know anything about technical windproof fleece at the time so I just went with the Denali. I met a girl who was really into climbing at the gym I climbed at a few months later, and she took me outdoor climbing for the first time. I had a bit of a thing for her, and the second night we were there we ended up staying up late talking long into the night. I was trying to brag about the new gear I'd gotten and I mentioned that I had purchased the denali fleece. She started at me, completely aghast, and said "that's a fratboy jacket." I sold it, bought a lowe alpine windproof fleece, and fell in love with her shortly afterwards. On a side note, for christmas this year, my 18 year old younger sister asked my parents for the same jacket...she told me they call it "the frat face."
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mcfoley
Feb 12, 2005, 4:42 PM
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Don't tell me you are just now realizing this....???
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ropefriend
Feb 12, 2005, 5:13 PM
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It is amazing that the vast majority of this thread is about TNF apparel. They are fashionable now, but that trend will end (hopefully soon).
Their roots are in equipment innovation, like the Oval Intention Geodesic dome tent and serious expedition sleeping bags (their packs never really made top billing). They really were on the cutting edge in the 70's and 80's, even into early 90's. Vanity Fair Corp, who owns them now, has at least kept the TNF Climbing Team somewhat intact, which is more than most outdoor companies are doing for the sport. The A5 move to a 'lifestyle clothing' brand is sad indeed.
I did see that they got some kind of Backpacker Editor's Choice for packs now..... so maybe not all is lost. I believe that a company who abandons it's roots is destined to drift into oblivion.
Ropefriend
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kman
Feb 12, 2005, 5:23 PM
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In reply to: I bought a tnf goretex jacket with liner and pants in a back alley in China a year ago. They looked good but the jacket leaks and the zipper is on the wrong side. I will not pay full price for tnf. I do love my discounted tnf sleeping bag.
LMAO!! You got ripped off dude!!!! Never heard of North Fake???
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kman
Feb 12, 2005, 5:31 PM
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Alot of you seem to think that it is wrong for people to wear TNF stuff because in your opinion people who wear them think they are hardcore wanabees?? Why does it bother you? Do you think that because you are climbers only you have the right to wear this stuff?? Laaaaaame. It's amazing what people whine about.
Alot of their stuff is crap...but alot of their stuff is good also. I have a few TNF items and they are all of excellent quality. Almost all companies have crappy product mixed in with good stuff.
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gunksgoer
Feb 12, 2005, 5:48 PM
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i will admit that i bought a denali a few years ago, probably on sale. ill sum up my opinion of it just by sayin i have no clue where it is at this point, and i dont care.
i agree with just about everything said here, its a shame A5 is now just a name. 95% of the people who wear the stuff have no clue what A5 even stands for, and id LOVE to see one of them all of the sudden find themselves 1/2 way up one :twisted:
but, despite all the things i hate about TNF, i will admitt i like their lightweight fleece pullover things. theyre comfy, and not the big deal the denalis are. the main thing i like about them is that i can actually roll the sleeves up above my elbows. with other brands, like ems rei cloudveil etc, i find my forearms are to big to push the sleeves up over them, in the sizes that fit my torso, the sleves are to tight :shock:
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clausti
Feb 12, 2005, 7:04 PM
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hehe... cutting the tags and labels off...
I did that to an AF beanie i really liked that I bought when I first chopped all my hair off and it was *COLD.*
We normally just say that TNF abercrombieizing.
abercrombie used to have such cool, preppy clothes.
and DAMN but they are slutsRus now.
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dawgcatching
Feb 12, 2005, 7:34 PM
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I wonder what will happen to Marmot now that they have been purchased by K2 sports? I am sure all of the manufacturing has been moved to China (same thing happened with Dana Designs when K2 purchased them). We sell K2 skis, and the quality and product isn't the same as when it was made here in the USA. Unfortunately, the prices are still the same.....
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rhu
Feb 12, 2005, 7:58 PM
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I saw a guy that I suspect was homeless a few months back in Kansas City. I couldn't believe it when I saw that he had a Cat's Meow sleeping bag! This really confused me. I guess that everyone thinks the stuff is bomber.
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walrus
Feb 12, 2005, 10:31 PM
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In reply to: In reply to: I bought a tnf goretex jacket with liner and pants in a back alley in China a year ago. They looked good but the jacket leaks and the zipper is on the wrong side. I will not pay full price for tnf. I do love my discounted tnf sleeping bag. LMAO!! You got ripped off dude!!!! Never heard of North Fake???
It looked good. I suppose I had a 50/50 chance. It is still functional for some things.
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verticalcrag
Feb 12, 2005, 11:05 PM
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Ive had the same TNF jacket and shell for a few years now and love it..........................although i wont buy ne more of there gear for a good long time........................it makes me mad to see all the damn fratmatresses and all those idiots wearin the shit, when they have never touched a rock or a backpack in there entire life...........................................idiots
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jtnottree
Feb 12, 2005, 11:14 PM
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Just for the record...
About 1980 I bought a North Face GoreTex jacket, which I both wore and washed a lot. A couple of months ago, I sent it to North Face to be repaired, and told them they needn't contact me unless the repair was over $80.
Instead of repairing the darn thing--and without even notifying me--about a week later I received a brand new "Mountain Light Parka" in the mail.
Lists at $299.
I have no complaints... ;-)
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cgailey
Feb 12, 2005, 11:30 PM
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In reply to: In reply to: In reply to: I bought a tnf goretex jacket with liner and pants in a back alley in China a year ago. They looked good but the jacket leaks and the zipper is on the wrong side. I will not pay full price for tnf. I do love my discounted tnf sleeping bag. LMAO!! You got ripped off dude!!!! Never heard of North Fake??? It looked good. I suppose I had a 50/50 chance. It is still functional for some things.
I got these wicked Oakleys on the beach in Mexico for like 5 bucks man...what a deal!!!!! :lol:
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kman
Feb 12, 2005, 11:34 PM
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In reply to: Ive had the same TNF jacket and shell for a few years now and love it..........................although i wont buy ne more of there gear for a good long time........................it makes me mad to see all the damn fratmatresses and all those idiots wearin the s---, when they have never touched a rock or a backpack in there entire life...........................................idiots
Why would you call some one an idiot because of what they wear?? Sounds like your the idiot. Just because you climb does not give you the exlusive rights to wear certain products. You all need to stop whining about what other people wear and focus more on self improvement.
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walrus
Feb 12, 2005, 11:56 PM
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I thought about sending my Chinese jacket in.
I suppose a lot of people resent others for having things they will not take full advantage of or never use for its intended purpose. Posers. I just laugh when I think of the money they wasted to be cool. But, that is what pays the bills for these companies. They make a name for being premium suppliers and then the trendiness catches on and they see a pot of gold at the end of the rainbow.
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neurostar
Feb 13, 2005, 12:54 AM
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Haha
Where can I get me one of those?
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climbsomething
Feb 13, 2005, 1:09 AM
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:boring: DURRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR!!!!
With the exception of kman and a couple others, this thread is chock-fulla tools. Who gives a shit if some "sorority girl" or jock uses a Nalgene or wears a North Face fleece? Does it cheapen your experience? Cause access issues? Make you feel like less of a man? I'm willing to bet my smelly, pilly purple TNF fleece (!) that everybody who's bitching is some noob with fire in their earnest little hearts and glitter in their eyes about the Real Hardkore Dirtbag Klimber (tm) that they hope they'll be after conquering that red 5.8+ in the gym. If you think a Theta who uses a locking carabiner to attach her pink lexan Nalgene to her backpack is a poser, what does that make you? Conrad-fuckin-Anker?
Get over it.
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walrus
Feb 13, 2005, 1:34 AM
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In reply to: If you think a Theta who uses a locking carabiner to attach her pink lexan Nalgene to her backpack is a poser, what does that make you? Conrad-f----Anker? Get over it.
I attach no negative sentiments to that label but they are just not what their 'accesories' would indicate.
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dirtineye
Feb 13, 2005, 1:37 AM
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In reply to: :boring: DURRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR!!!! With the exception of kman and a couple others, this thread is chock-fulla tools. Who gives a s--- if some "sorority girl" or jock uses a Nalgene or wears a North Face fleece? Does it cheapen your experience? Cause access issues? Make you feel like less of a man? I'm willing to bet my smelly, pilly purple TNF fleece (!) that everybody who's b---- is some noob with fire in their earnest little hearts and glitter in their eyes about the Real Hardkore Dirtbag Klimber (tm) that they hope they'll be after conquering that red 5.8+ in the gym. If you think a Theta who uses a locking carabiner to attach her pink lexan Nalgene to her backpack is a poser, what does that make you? Conrad-f----Anker? Get over it.
Whoa there sport pumpkin!
You trying to compete with Clausti or something?
My criteria for outdoor wear purchases are, a) is it on sale?, and b) what do my friends who know what's good say?
And THAT makes me dirtFineye, hahahahahahahahaha! AND I could climb those stupid mountains too, if I could stand colder weather than 40 F. Heh.
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coldclimb
Feb 13, 2005, 2:25 AM
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I am a true climbing bum dirtbag. I would never shell out so much money for some yuppie fleece jacket that all the popular rich people wear. That stuff is WAY too expensive. Sheesh, you people who buy it are crazy!
That said, I wear both of my North Face Denali jackets quite often, since they're great gear. I also love my Helly Hansen waterproof shell. What you guys need to do is find the right hookups. :lol:
Pay for Jackets? Pffff!!! :lol:
Besides, girls look cute in my jackets! :lol: :wink: :wink:
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tattooed_climber
Feb 13, 2005, 2:27 AM
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In reply to: Haha Where can I get me one of those?
to be honest my partner couldn't remember...but the only time i asked him we both pretty toxified with toxins.
..hummmm intoxication.....
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ryan112ryan
Feb 13, 2005, 8:02 AM
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In reply to: I had a girl in one of my classes that had five denali jackets. FIVE!!!, on of every color WTF!! When I asked her why she had five jackets , her reply was that she had to have one to match each pair of uggs that she had. For all of you who don't know what uggs are check out this website. http://www.uggaustralia.com/Products.asp?dept_id=3&g=women&c=Classic&sc=33&col=2
5 of those jackets.....thats close to $800-$900 in jackets!
as for the uggs, when i first saw then my first thought was "i really hope this isn't going to turn into a fad, but it did :evil:
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ryan112ryan
Feb 13, 2005, 8:13 AM
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In reply to: abercrombie used to have such cool, preppy clothes. and DAMN but they are slutsRus now.
tell me about it, i was in the store a while back with my sister, i was over in the guys section when she came over from the girls section and was like "come look at this" so i go over there and she shows me these jeans, they are taged as "BJ" jeans. the best part the knees were all worn thin and scuffed. as for the rest of the clothes there, its really slutty all the little HS wore the sluty slothes and we have offically have dubbed them "prostitotts" :D
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cgailey
Feb 13, 2005, 11:19 AM
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In reply to: :boring: DURRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR!!!! With the exception of kman and a couple others, this thread is chock-fulla tools. Who gives a s--- if some "sorority girl" or jock uses a Nalgene or wears a North Face fleece? Does it cheapen your experience? Cause access issues? Make you feel like less of a man? I'm willing to bet my smelly, pilly purple TNF fleece (!) that everybody who's b---- is some noob with fire in their earnest little hearts and glitter in their eyes about the Real Hardkore Dirtbag Klimber (tm) that they hope they'll be after conquering that red 5.8+ in the gym. If you think a Theta who uses a locking carabiner to attach her pink lexan Nalgene to her backpack is a poser, what does that make you? Conrad-f----Anker? Get over it.
So feisty! :wink:
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alan_ellis
Feb 13, 2005, 2:55 PM
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In reply to: I bought a tnf goretex jacket with liner and pants in a back alley in China a year ago. They looked good but the jacket leaks and the zipper is on the wrong side.
Those are counterfeit TNF items. A friend of mine who flys weekly to China with UPS bought one and let me examine it. I can assure you it is not Goretex. U.S. Customs has had a problem for years trying to keep that stuff out of the U.S.
I have several older TNF items which I bought long before they sold out. I have one of the old Mountain Light jackets that has served me well on many trips. However, It's kind of embarrasing to wear TNF stuff now because (as has been said in this thread) all the soccer moms and mall rats are wearing it too. Maybe I'll gradually replace it with Arcteryx or some other brand.
I knew it was over for TNF when I saw a pink Denali jacket at the mall a few months ago.
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yamama
Feb 13, 2005, 4:38 PM
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Yeah, TNF has kinda gone down hill. My dad has an old TNF jacket and it kicks ass.
The thing about the soccer moms is that the TNF stuff they have is all clean and nice, not to mention HOT PINK. All my TNF stuff that i wear to hike and climb is dirty. I can tell whos just getting the stuff to look cool and who uses it. Just think, it's better haveing some kid wear a new TNF jacket than some $300 Abercrombie one that doesnt' do shit to keep out the cold or rain.
Don't get me wrong, i'm not saying TNF is the best or anything but its not the worst. They still make good stuff its just gone down over the years.
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naw
Feb 13, 2005, 4:59 PM
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In reply to: :boring: DURRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR!!!! With the exception of kman and a couple others, this thread is chock-fulla tools. Who gives a s--- if some "sorority girl" or jock uses a Nalgene or wears a North Face fleece? Does it cheapen your experience? Cause access issues? Make you feel like less of a man? I'm willing to bet my smelly, pilly purple TNF fleece (!) that everybody who's b---- is some noob with fire in their earnest little hearts and glitter in their eyes about the Real Hardkore Dirtbag Klimber (tm) that they hope they'll be after conquering that red 5.8+ in the gym. If you think a Theta who uses a locking carabiner to attach her pink lexan Nalgene to her backpack is a poser, what does that make you? Conrad-f----Anker? Get over it.
i red-pointed that 5.8+ at the gym on a hardcore toprope
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harrisha
Feb 13, 2005, 8:04 PM
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Actually my beef isn't with the yuppies who wear TNF to look cool. Its more with the company itself. Due to the popularity of TNF goods especially jackets the price has been greatly inflated. Its not that TNF goods are bad things for weekend warriors, they're just heavy and lack features like you'd expect to find on high end jackets that cost the same amount. Research and development of new products is expensive, but TNF has used their popularity and "the cool factor" to boost their profits while not coming up with inovations that make their product marketable to the crowed that does the activities the company used to produce products for. Basically they betrayed their heritage to make money now. It's not that I hate TNF because their popular. I hate them because they have stuck with the same product design for so long. Their gear is overpriced for what it is-heavy and behind the inovation curve.
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c-money
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Feb 13, 2005, 8:47 PM
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In reply to: I have several older TNF items which I bought long before they sold out. I have one of the old Mountain Light jackets that has served me well on many trips. Maybe I'll gradually replace it with Arcteryx or some other brand.
Now that Arcteryx has been bought out/sold out to Adidas, I wonder how long until their quality starts creeping downhill too (if it hasn't allready)...
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alpheli
Feb 13, 2005, 9:12 PM
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Are there any TNF employees here at RC.com?
/Alpheli
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bosterson
Feb 13, 2005, 9:18 PM
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The problem with TNF isn't that yuppies wear it cause it's expensive (Patagucci, anyone?), but like harrisha said, they used to be a good company and now their designs are very outdated. Their stuff is heavy and bulky and way overpriced for what it is. I remember a few years ago after Arc'teryx came out, and everyone was hopping on the waterproof zipper bandwagon, and TNF put it on a jacket and the zipper coating was all ragged so that you couldn't zip the zipper. It was pathetic. Now all their jackets still have huge storm flaps, and all kinds of unnecessary sleeve pockets and stuff. I was in Berkeley and randomly spotted a TNF outlet, but all they had inside were fake technical clothes, lined with fur and all in varying shades of pink and stuff. I have a couple of TNF jackets and a down bag, all of which I got on sale at discout houses, but I don't plan to buy any more of their stuff. If you're going to shop with them, I think the gear (bags, tents) is probably better than the clothing...
And I thought Arc'teryx had been bought by Salomon?
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e_wire
Feb 13, 2005, 9:49 PM
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In reply to: And I thought Arc'teryx had been bought by Salomon?
It was bought by Salomon many years ago - and Salomon belongs to....? Adidas! Ever since Arc Teryx got bought by Salomon/Adidas, their product didn't evolve much either. They still have an edge - but others are catching up quickly.
Mountain Hardwear also has very good products - now they belong to Columbia... What's going to happen next?
And the list goes on. When small companies get bought by huge corporation - they tend to loose their edge.
The solution? Don't favor brands - but rather the best products from each one.
e_wire
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kman
Feb 13, 2005, 10:44 PM
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Some of you mentioned that they have no inovative new ideas. I disagree and ask if your just saying this because yuppies wear the stuff. What about that new pivitol suspension system they have on some of their packs? I think the Met 5 is pretty inovative...wouldn't buy one myself...but it's still a neat idea.
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harrisha
Feb 13, 2005, 11:16 PM
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In reply to: Some of you mentioned that they have no inovative new ideas. I disagree and ask if your just saying this because yuppies wear the stuff. What about that new pivitol suspension system they have on some of their packs? I think the Met 5 is pretty inovative...wouldn't buy one myself...but it's still a neat idea.
The Met 5 is gimicky. Lets say money wasn't an option, but still would you want to count on something that needs batteries to keep you warm when it could mean the difference between life or death. Not me; i'll stick with the tried and true layering system and try to find the best nonelectric products I can get on my budget.
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climbingnurse
Feb 14, 2005, 12:01 AM
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In reply to: In reply to: And I thought Arc'teryx had been bought by Salomon? It was bought by Salomon many years ago - and Salomon belongs to....? Adidas! Ever since Arc Teryx got bought by Salomon/Adidas, their product didn't evolve much either. They still have an edge - but others are catching up quickly. Mountain Hardwear also has very good products - now they belong to Columbia... What's going to happen next? And the list goes on. When small companies get bought by huge corporation - they tend to loose their edge. The solution? Don't favor brands - but rather the best products from each one. e_wire
Moves so slowly
Grows so smoothly
Takes so neatly
It's as if they belong and they've been here all along
Grows so smoothly
Moves so slowly
Takes completely
It's as if they belong and they've been here all along
This one's ours let's take another
Check the math here check in ten years
Clusterfuck theory buy them up and shut them down
Then repeat in every town
Every town will be the same
This one's ours let's take another
Five corporations there is a pattern
-Five Corporations, by Fugazi
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climbingnurse
Feb 14, 2005, 12:02 AM
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In reply to: Are there any TNF employees here at RC.com? /Alpheli
I'd put down money that rc.com is one of the many sites banned by the Chinese government. :shock: :lol:
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alpheli
Feb 14, 2005, 12:05 AM
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:lol: :lol: :lol:
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bosterson
Feb 14, 2005, 12:39 AM
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[quote="kman"]Some of you mentioned that they have no inovative new ideas. I disagree and ask if your just saying this because yuppies wear the stuff. What about that new pivitol suspension system they have on some of their packs? I think the Met 5 is pretty inovative...wouldn't buy one myself...but it's still a neat idea.
TNF used to be cutting edge (I mean, they invented the Goretex jacket!), but now their worksmanship just seems shoddy (like I said before about their "waterproof" zippers, which, may I add, they stopped trying to do soon after, although I think they may be trying to do it again...). The bar for outerwear these days is pretty high in terms of craftsmanship, which fabrics to use, etc.; a "good" piece of outerwear is very light and technically advanced. TNF just seems unconcerned with making things at that level, and instead makes mediocre stuff that average people who don't care so much about quality would buy. Maybe the pivotal suspension is a cool idea (I have no personal experience with it), and Met 5 is at least a new idea, if not a gimmicky and expensive one, but in general their stuff is about 5 years out of date. So, if anything, I think to answer your question, it's not that they're not innovative because yuppies wear their stuff, but rather yuppies wear their stuff because they're not innovative.
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bandidopeco
Feb 14, 2005, 12:47 AM
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hmm, so how does this forum relate to the "why can't CCH make more Aliens" forums?
I guess nothing's perfect
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buzzard
Feb 14, 2005, 12:55 AM
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Working in a retail store that sells TNF,Pat,Ark, and Mt. Hardwear. I can tell you that the majority of people that are buying TNF, are the rich little brats. The only reason they are having mommy and daddy buying Tnf, is becasue they have a friend that has one or had one, and better yet the color of the jacket. I heard this girl over talking one day in our store, saying that she cant stand to go camping or do anything outdoors. But she bought a TNF jacket just because it was pink. And those were her exact words. TNF wont change their products. Why would they? By christmas they were sold out of Denali's and most of their jackets that come with a liner. Some of you may not like the way TNF is going, but take it from me TNF and oh yeah almost forgot, Columbia, are not as good as some of the tother products that are out there.
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buzzard
Feb 14, 2005, 12:56 AM
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Working in a retail store that sells TNF,Pat,Ark, and Mt. Hardwear. I can tell you that the majority of people that are buying TNF, are the rich little brats. The only reason they are having mommy and daddy buying Tnf, is becasue they have a friend that has one or had one, and better yet the color of the jacket. I heard this girl over talking one day in our store, saying that she cant stand to go camping or do anything outdoors. But she bought a TNF jacket just because it was pink. And those were her exact words. TNF wont change their products. Why would they? By christmas they were sold out of Denali's and most of their jackets that come with a liner. Some of you may not like the way TNF is going, but take it from me TNF and oh yeah almost forgot, Columbia, are not as good as some of the tother products that are out there.
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jimdavis
Feb 14, 2005, 1:06 AM
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Yeah, it really seems like a lot of people are angry at people for wearing/ using certain gear. It doesn't chip away at what we are, or do.
What is interesting to me, and potentially frightning; is that it seems that climbing clothing almost always becomes fashionable. Once it becomes fashionable, then the brands go to shit. Or a large portion of their product base does.
I will give props to TNF for keeping their climbing team in order.
They're smart for turning a buck though.
I think this "turning into a fashion thing" just means that we'll have to brand hop every 5 years to get high quality gear, and stand out from the pack. It is really funny to see people walking around in Denali Jackets with their 1 strap backpacks and cell phones on campus though. The MH windstopper jacket is turning into one of those items too.
Money almost always takes priority over values to corperations. Props to the independantly owned, climber inspired brands though for staying true.
Jim
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furrymurry
Feb 14, 2005, 3:34 AM
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I agree with everyone about TNF's quality going downhill, no longer being innovative, etc. But people seem to be under the impression that such a turn towards lower quality/greater distribution has been profitable for them. This is not the case, if it was then they would have declared bankruptcy 2-3 times in the last decade.
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knoxville
Feb 14, 2005, 3:59 AM
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Yes, styles change and unexpected items get popular. That's the way the world is. Sorry if other people are buying cloudveil, north face, et al, or even carabiners so that everybody else doesn't recognize how cool and important you are for being a climber. I mean why even have climbing gear if not to look like a bad ass?
As for me, I'm just happy that outdoorsy looking stuff is accepted at bars and clubs. Otherwise I'd have nothing to wear.
I often think about the American explorers of previous centuries--Dana, Whitney, Muir, etc--and how they made it safely up so many amazing mountains without benefit of goretex, polypro, or whatever else shows up next. I bet they were pissed when everybody starting sewing wool sweaters to keep warm.
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alan_ellis
Feb 14, 2005, 2:41 PM
Post #80 of 116
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In reply to: Now that Arcteryx has been bought out/sold out to Adidas, I wonder how long until their quality starts creeping downhill too (if it hasn't allready)...
Damn! Are there any good companies left?
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plund
Feb 14, 2005, 3:50 PM
Post #81 of 116
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I own a TNF HyVent Shell, fleece & HyVent rain pants, and have no complaints. I also didn't pay full retail for any of them, and wouldn't for ANY technical-type gear. With all the online stores now, SOMETHING is always on sale or clearance. That said, TNF gear does seem to be the shizzle now for the "in" crowd, but who cares. If the gear performs, use it - if not, try something else. I don't have years of TNF experience for comparison, but I like my HyVent & don't care what Biff Gnarly is wearing...
The constant consumption of small & innovative by large & corporate does suck, though....good luck changing that!
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roambb1
Feb 14, 2005, 4:46 PM
Post #82 of 116
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I live in a very Urban area of Washington DC, and I must say that TNF jackets are the Hype among teenagers in my neighborhood. I'd have to guess that the knockoff market is pretty strong here, but people are buying original and knockoffs in bulk, and TNF is now a fashion statement that rivals Nike Air Jordans in the 90's. Kids are being held up for their jackets, as they used to be for thier shoes. Mtn Hardware and Arc Teryx also seem to be gaining popularity. I saw a kid in a full Mtn Hrd Gore-Tex suit on the bus the other day. I promise you, he was not doing any mountaineering or backpacking. He also trashed the thing in the dryer. Amazing that these items have become so trendy. I mean, my neighborhood is pretty low income, and if you aren't using the functionality of Gore tex, you could get a lot more jacket for the buck.
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nuts_r_us
Dec 22, 2005, 8:04 PM
Post #83 of 116
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In reply to: I often think about the American explorers of previous centuries--Dana, Whitney, Muir, etc--and how they made it safely up so many amazing mountains without benefit of goretex, polypro, or whatever else shows up next. I bet they were pissed when everybody starting sewing wool sweaters to keep warm.
Now that's funny.
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kings_peak1
Dec 22, 2005, 8:58 PM
Post #84 of 116
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TNF has always been ok gear. It has also always been over priced.
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dynoclimber
Dec 22, 2005, 9:27 PM
Post #85 of 116
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I bought a TNF softshell (on sale) 2 years ago for skiing and climbing. 2 months later 2 zippers (front and right pocket) and the drawstring at the waist were busted. I didnt even ski with it. Bummer. If you are putting your life on the line (as many mountaineers are) I wouldn't suggest this stuff. In fact, I would advise against it. Even when doing everyday activities, you would probably be more comfortable in a cheap columbia jacket thatn a TNF one for 300 bones. As for all the "yuppies" wearing it, who cares? If they want to spend their not-so hard earned money on a jacket that sucks, let them. They'll never know the difference. We all know it sucks, thats why we dont buy it, so it shouldn't really affect us anymore.
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cedk
Dec 22, 2005, 9:31 PM
Post #86 of 116
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And what happened to Pizza Hut?!!? I remember back in the 80's it was so tasty that we called it Rad'. Then Pepsi bought them and suddenly they became nothing but a greasy doughey mess. They used to care about providing me with delicious pizza, now all they care about is creating next month's gimmick pizza! Man they sold out!
Oh yeah, and Van Halen was better with David Lee Roth!
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joebuzz
Dec 22, 2005, 9:41 PM
Post #87 of 116
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I used to work for The North Face long before "TNF" came into being. I still have friends with the company, some at the very high corp. level. And yes, they do Suck! now. I was one of the people who suggested a real climber's company like LaSportiva was a good model to follow when TNF wanted to get into the shoe biz. I truly apologize to all of you for that.
For a while, even while becoming the urban fashion ware that they are now, they still made their core products as well. That of course is gone as well. They still have some gear that works really well, but there are a bunch of companies that have picked up where the real North Face left off. Lots of my old gear is still in great shape after years of being truly hammered on.
Peace & Happy Holidays... Joe
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clippedclimbing
Dec 22, 2005, 9:43 PM
Post #88 of 116
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In reply to: I agree with everyone about TNF's quality going downhill, no longer being innovative, etc. But people seem to be under the impression that such a turn towards lower quality/greater distribution has been profitable for them. This is not the case, if it was then they would have declared bankruptcy 2-3 times in the last decade.
Actually, you have your info wrong. Since VF purchased TNF, they have become extremely profitable. They are on track to break 1 billion in global sales for 2005. Yes, there quality has gone to shit and their ditribution model has changed but they are definitely making money.
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sweetchuck
Dec 22, 2005, 9:48 PM
Post #89 of 116
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I just bought my girlfirend a NF momentum fleece shirt and it is the bomb. Very warm, seems well made, good fit, she looks hot in it, and it did her good on our backpacking trip last weekend in the freezing and rain. I have a NF synthetic down jacket that weighs next to nothing, I wore it every night on the AT for a couple months, and it is the bomb. It was dirt cheap too beause I hit a sale. 6 years later it is still going strong. Some of their stuff has gone down hill, but some of it is still quite good. If you can get a good sale, you can get good gear cheap. As for how popular and expensive the stuff is, hey, if you are going to spend a couple hundred bucks on a jacket it might as well be waterproof and warm. That helps going to the store or the mountains. It seems like everyone in NYC wears NF, and hey, it can be cold as a witch's tit up there, and most people walk or take the subway all the time so it is nice to have something on that will keep you dry and warm for that 20 block walk in the rain. Sure it's trendy, and I feel like some kinda frat boy in my jacket but damn if it's not warm, light, and comfortable.
Here's a big thank you for the barefoot, 10 year old Korean kids who put it together. Great job, it's woth both dimes they gave you to make it.
sc
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madrock
Dec 22, 2005, 9:56 PM
Post #90 of 116
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Several companies have been bought and sold recently. Actyrex, Mountain Hardware, Marmot and several others are now owned by "Big Company Incorporated". They all say nothing will change but only get better. Lets wait and see.
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crackers
Dec 23, 2005, 1:54 PM
Post #91 of 116
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Hey Joe, did you work for TNF the first time VF owned them or this time?
I know the CEO of VF, and he is pretty balls to the walls about making quality gear for the high end users while maximizing the value of the brand in the consumer quality line. I think that since they re-acquired TNF in 2000 (?), they've substantially improved the quality of their technical offerings.
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akclimber
Dec 23, 2005, 2:43 PM
Post #92 of 116
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In reply to: Here's a big thank you for the barefoot, 10 year old Korean kids who put it together. Great job, it's woth both dimes they gave you to make it. sc
Someone please give this man a trophy! :lol: :lol: :lol:
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euroford
Dec 23, 2005, 2:47 PM
Post #93 of 116
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In reply to: Hey Joe, did you work for TNF the first time VF owned them or this time? I know the CEO of VF, and he is pretty balls to the walls about making quality gear for the high end users while maximizing the value of the brand in the consumer quality line. I think that since they re-acquired TNF in 2000 (?), they've substantially improved the quality of their technical offerings.
well why don't you do the world a public service and call yer punter friend up; let him know that 90% of their 'core' market thinks that 90% of what they turn out is consumerist crappola.
they need to do some serious work both marketing and technical to bring themselves back around. that is, if they even care to do so.
which i suggest they do: even the regular punters are starting to figure it out, they are starting to buy MH shit now, becouse its so way friggin cooler. like, hey man this is the shit real climerz wear!!
yeah, well anyways. my wife LOVES her Triple C jacket on those cold days shopping on Michigan Ave.... or evenings going clubbing with her girliefriends over on Rush Street....
while i on the other hand, I totally dig my 1 year old Spire 30 pack. thats IF i can get another full season out of it. i've already torn it in two places.
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climbinkeg
Dec 23, 2005, 3:05 PM
Post #94 of 116
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Registered: Mar 25, 2005
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TNF is really going downhill. One of my friends at school is a big skier so he figured that he would wear his TNF jacket. Within two months of skiing his jacket fell apart. He didnt have any big wipeouts but now his jacket is destroyed from nothing but downhill skiing. On the other hand I have the Tadpole 23 tent and love it. It is holding up extremly well with no leaks.
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fishbelly
Dec 23, 2005, 3:49 PM
Post #95 of 116
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Once they started to market Extreme Gear in the ski shops. Its been down hill. Comes in handy when the lift stalls.
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samxbam8
Dec 23, 2005, 4:50 PM
Post #96 of 116
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[quote="cedk"]And what happened to Pizza Hut?!!? I remember back in the 80's it was so tasty that we called it Rad'. Then Pepsi bought them and suddenly they became nothing but a greasy doughey mess. They used to care about providing me with delicious pizza, now all they care about is creating next month's gimmick pizza! Man they sold out!
I like my pizza hut pizza
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samxbam8
Dec 23, 2005, 4:51 PM
Post #97 of 116
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i like my pizza hut pizza
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samxbam8
Dec 23, 2005, 4:53 PM
Post #98 of 116
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In reply to: And what happened to Pizza Hut?!!? I remember back in the 80's it was so tasty that we called it Rad'. Then Pepsi bought them and suddenly they became nothing but a greasy doughey mess. They used to care about providing me with delicious pizza, now all they care about is creating next month's gimmick pizza! Man they sold out!
I like my pizza hut pizza
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elshells
Dec 23, 2005, 5:06 PM
Post #99 of 116
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Registered: Mar 2, 2005
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Here is some interesting info Liz Claiborne bought Prana.
Where do you think that line will go. I am predicting your local department store. Right next to the Clinique counter.
Kinda like TNF. Although I agree that Vanity Fair was a good thing for them. At first I was skeptical, but now they are super profitable. They appeal to mainstream America, but still make a great product.
Pizza Hut tastes terrible now.
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sirdrinksalot
Dec 23, 2005, 7:29 PM
Post #100 of 116
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I tell you what... I don't give a damn about the "quality" of the new TNF cuz they make a huge profit and support the "ANCHOR REPLACEMENT INITIATIVE" BigTime! Kudos to you TNF. Real Men of Genius! Keep it coming, I love those shiny new anchors! And my old assed yet still bomber sleeping bag.
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jakewolf
Dec 23, 2005, 8:18 PM
Post #101 of 116
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I know this will not be popular, but the climbing community should be greatful for sorority girls wearing Patagonia and north face, as well as all those people with auto locker key chains. If these people buy the gear it means more money into the outdoor industry and more research and development for people that do use the product. TNF is a bad example, but nalgenes and carabiners are not. If greater sales allow for larger more efficent production- which equals lower price and same quality I am all for it. As for everyone complaining about kids wearing 3 ply jackets to walk to class, most of you don't need them to go cragging for the weekend- get over it.
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rocamosca
Dec 23, 2005, 9:42 PM
Post #102 of 116
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oops
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sidepull
Dec 23, 2005, 9:46 PM
Post #103 of 116
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In reply to: I know this will not be popular, but the climbing community should be greatful for sorority girls wearing Patagonia and north face, as well as all those people with auto locker key chains. If these people buy the gear it means more money into the outdoor industry and more research and development for people that do use the product. TNF is a bad example, but nalgenes and carabiners are not. If greater sales allow for larger more efficent production- which equals lower price and same quality I am all for it. As for everyone complaining about kids wearing 3 ply jackets to walk to class, most of you don't need them to go cragging for the weekend- get over it.
trophy worthy logic!
it's funny how some feel they own the brand.
by the way, i just saved a bunch of money on my car insurance by switching to BD.
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kydd76
Dec 26, 2005, 8:35 PM
Post #104 of 116
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I have no brand Preference I just buy on the skinny. But I have to say that I have only owned one north face piece of clothing. One of there first two layer gore-tex pack able jackets. It was a fine jacket, small light and water proof. But I have never really heard any good things since. I have also seen A5 is now a clothing brand, very sad.
I started climbing back in the mid-nineties. I picked up a marmot alpinist light weight jacket for two hundred dollars. I researched and found that most gore-tex is laminated on the same machine no matter which clothing company uses it. Gore makes a killing that way.
I was only able to buy sportive climbing shoes in one store in Cincinnati. So as I walked in one of the sales guy’s got on my case about the marmot jacket since they only sold TNF at his shop. He told me how they made a better product and had a better warranty. I was really put off by his condescending manner and told him that there was really in my opinion no difference. He got mad and told me that I would be sorry, and at fifteen thousand feet my jacket would fall apart. If trying to add injury to insult, and you will not even have a warranty to fix it, then where would I be then? I told him that it sounded like I would be at fifteen thousand with a hole in my jacket and that I would have to sew it up with my repair kit and when I got home I would send it in to be repaired. But I was talking sense, so he told me that I would get my just dessert for not getting his TNF product. He also explained that I was bound to fail in the mountains with out the TNF jacket. Since it was so important to have the best, and that TNF had been the reason that so many parts of the world had been explored and climbed. I soon found out as we talked that he was not a climber and only skied in at perfect north slopes in Indiana. So what did he really know? A true sales man, make the sale at the expense of your customer.
With that said I have never had a problem with my jacket, as if that matters. But every time I hear something about TNF I think about that ars.
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climb_ian
Dec 26, 2005, 8:49 PM
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That fourm is GREAT.. what the hell happened to The North Face..look in a add from a 1996 issue of Rock and Ice than log onto www.northface.com and compare the two together....what are you going to wear on an 8000 meter peak the gortex 3 ply shell or the denim jacket with fur around the hood with a sell out north face patch sewn on it ..
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fishbelly
Dec 26, 2005, 9:22 PM
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Saw a guy wearing a Mtnhardware jacket & a BMW ball cap at wal mart to day. In the NASCAR section..We have became a really diverse society
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climb_ian
Dec 26, 2005, 10:38 PM
Post #107 of 116
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whats worse than that is there is a nascar section at walmart>?
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fallingup
Feb 10, 2006, 2:20 AM
Post #108 of 116
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In reply to: I was only able to buy sportive climbing shoes in one store in Cincinnati
kydd76,
Was that at Outdoor Adventures (later Benchmark) in Clifton on Vine and McMillian or Short Vine?
Latter,
fallingup
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clayman
Feb 10, 2006, 3:55 AM
Post #109 of 116
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In reply to: Saw a guy wearing a Mtnhardware jacket & a BMW ball cap at wal mart to day. In the NASCAR section..We have became a really diverse society
uh I guess...you were there
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suprdude22
Feb 10, 2006, 7:10 PM
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Maybe its me, but I have come to the realization that it OUR (people that actually do stuff with their lives) fault. If we didnt look so DAMN cool in our stuff when we walk around the mall or campus or wherever, it wouldnt have caught on. Along those same lines, If you see US in our gear, you would never really be able to tell us apart from those kids that have never spent a night in a tent or an hour outside. One thing I noticed at a recent weekend at HP, were the girls just sitting around watching the guys climb. This isn't a bash on girl climbers. These are the girls that used to go to the skate park and stand around there. They were ALL wearing their TNF fleeces. When I started camping/climbing, it wasn't mainstream, however, it has become something more people are doing once and saying they "do" it. I don't know what to do with it, but WE are becoming the people that the rest of society will live vicariously through.
mp
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iceaxe23
Feb 11, 2006, 8:42 AM
Post #111 of 116
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I still have my North face catalogs from the 80's and 90's they were way cool with expedition photos and way cool gear. I got my first down north face bag in the 80's and it was awesome lasted me over 10 years (I then sold it for the newest dryloft faze) had a employee deal from them in the late 90's and got some really good gear. the Climber DL sleeping bag (I love this bag!!!) the heavy duty dryloft down belay parka (this thing has saved my life a few times) and many other soft goods that perform well. Oh and I can't forget my cerro torre pants and jacket (at one time I had the one piece suit too) As of recent I got some A5 retro approach shoes that I love(well for $20 how could you not) and the rappel pants (again for $20) but that is about it....the new jackets look like something Michel Jackson would wear...not a mountaineer
as of now most of my gear is from Moonstone...not trendy, great quality, and works well for me...
me on rainier with my trusty TNF climber bag that is just over a pound, tie in point, dry loft shell, and did I say just over a pound...one of the last good things they made
(This post was edited by iceaxe23 on Jan 31, 2009, 8:00 PM)
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gearjunkie
Aug 1, 2007, 7:14 PM
Post #112 of 116
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I think where the North Face went wrong is when it started to change it's customer base... This can be most accreditted to the combination of its acquisition by VFC, the worlds largest clothing company, and the explosion of "wilderness chic" that has arised recently...
now, instead of manafacturing their products for the die-hard climbers and explorers out there, they've started to change their designs in order to appeal to the more recreational user. though obviously more profitable, they have lost a good deal of faith from the climbing community, as their products now focus more on style than functionality or quality.
similarly, when TNF bought A5, a once renowned company that made reliable aiding gear, they basically discontinued the gear line and focused solely on the apparel.
TNF, please come back to your roots and do what you used to do... innovate and put out great, functional gear for the true explorers
(This post was edited by gearjunkie on Aug 1, 2007, 7:18 PM)
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leapinlizard
Aug 1, 2007, 8:02 PM
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My only beef with TNF is the A5 F-up. I was at the A5 clearout sale back in, what was it 96, when Middendorf was cleaning out the storage unit that A5 was based out of here in Flagstaff. He said that he had sold the company to North Face, and although I was bummed to here it was sold out, I never in a million years would have thought that they would have done what they did. I mean A5 was like the name in bigwall gear, and now it means that it is probably pink or has faux fur on it. What a travesty. Of course that doesn't mean I won't buy from them if the price is right. I did just pick up a Nupste Down jacket, a Mountain Parka and a gore tex beanie all for $310.
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stymingersfink
Aug 2, 2007, 12:26 AM
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Holy Thread Revival, Batman!
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gearjunkie
Aug 2, 2007, 4:06 AM
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hahaha wowww, didnt even notice that. do i get some sort of prize for reviving it after a year and a half?
nah but its a good thread that i came across in a search
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paulraphael
Aug 6, 2007, 5:47 AM
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This thread will probably get revived every time TNF gets worse.
People are pretty aware of the decline since they became a mass market brand in the 90s, but I think they suffered their first decline in the 80s.
I worked in a climbing store when I was in school in the late 80s and saw tons of the stuff first hand. I had hang loops pull out of VE-25 tents from gentle tugs when showing off tents to customers! Old timers at the store said that the quality was way down from when the company was a small shop a decade earlier.
Of course back then, the customer base was still climbers. So the crappy gear was at least climbing gear, and not just crappy streetwear with climbing pretentions.
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Re: What happened to TNF?
[
