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buzzard
Feb 14, 2005, 12:56 AM
Post #76 of 116
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Registered: Oct 3, 2003
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Working in a retail store that sells TNF,Pat,Ark, and Mt. Hardwear. I can tell you that the majority of people that are buying TNF, are the rich little brats. The only reason they are having mommy and daddy buying Tnf, is becasue they have a friend that has one or had one, and better yet the color of the jacket. I heard this girl over talking one day in our store, saying that she cant stand to go camping or do anything outdoors. But she bought a TNF jacket just because it was pink. And those were her exact words. TNF wont change their products. Why would they? By christmas they were sold out of Denali's and most of their jackets that come with a liner. Some of you may not like the way TNF is going, but take it from me TNF and oh yeah almost forgot, Columbia, are not as good as some of the tother products that are out there.
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jimdavis
Feb 14, 2005, 1:06 AM
Post #77 of 116
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Registered: May 1, 2003
Posts: 1935
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Yeah, it really seems like a lot of people are angry at people for wearing/ using certain gear. It doesn't chip away at what we are, or do.
What is interesting to me, and potentially frightning; is that it seems that climbing clothing almost always becomes fashionable. Once it becomes fashionable, then the brands go to shit. Or a large portion of their product base does.
I will give props to TNF for keeping their climbing team in order.
They're smart for turning a buck though.
I think this "turning into a fashion thing" just means that we'll have to brand hop every 5 years to get high quality gear, and stand out from the pack. It is really funny to see people walking around in Denali Jackets with their 1 strap backpacks and cell phones on campus though. The MH windstopper jacket is turning into one of those items too.
Money almost always takes priority over values to corperations. Props to the independantly owned, climber inspired brands though for staying true.
Jim
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furrymurry
Feb 14, 2005, 3:34 AM
Post #78 of 116
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Registered: Sep 6, 2004
Posts: 205
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I agree with everyone about TNF's quality going downhill, no longer being innovative, etc. But people seem to be under the impression that such a turn towards lower quality/greater distribution has been profitable for them. This is not the case, if it was then they would have declared bankruptcy 2-3 times in the last decade.
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knoxville
Feb 14, 2005, 3:59 AM
Post #79 of 116
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Registered: Nov 5, 2004
Posts: 12
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Yes, styles change and unexpected items get popular. That's the way the world is. Sorry if other people are buying cloudveil, north face, et al, or even carabiners so that everybody else doesn't recognize how cool and important you are for being a climber. I mean why even have climbing gear if not to look like a bad ass?
As for me, I'm just happy that outdoorsy looking stuff is accepted at bars and clubs. Otherwise I'd have nothing to wear.
I often think about the American explorers of previous centuries--Dana, Whitney, Muir, etc--and how they made it safely up so many amazing mountains without benefit of goretex, polypro, or whatever else shows up next. I bet they were pissed when everybody starting sewing wool sweaters to keep warm.
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alan_ellis
Feb 14, 2005, 2:41 PM
Post #80 of 116
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Registered: Dec 3, 2003
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In reply to: Now that Arcteryx has been bought out/sold out to Adidas, I wonder how long until their quality starts creeping downhill too (if it hasn't allready)...
Damn! Are there any good companies left?
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plund
Feb 14, 2005, 3:50 PM
Post #81 of 116
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Registered: Mar 6, 2003
Posts: 302
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I own a TNF HyVent Shell, fleece & HyVent rain pants, and have no complaints. I also didn't pay full retail for any of them, and wouldn't for ANY technical-type gear. With all the online stores now, SOMETHING is always on sale or clearance. That said, TNF gear does seem to be the shizzle now for the "in" crowd, but who cares. If the gear performs, use it - if not, try something else. I don't have years of TNF experience for comparison, but I like my HyVent & don't care what Biff Gnarly is wearing...
The constant consumption of small & innovative by large & corporate does suck, though....good luck changing that!
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roambb1
Feb 14, 2005, 4:46 PM
Post #82 of 116
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Registered: Oct 22, 2004
Posts: 74
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I live in a very Urban area of Washington DC, and I must say that TNF jackets are the Hype among teenagers in my neighborhood. I'd have to guess that the knockoff market is pretty strong here, but people are buying original and knockoffs in bulk, and TNF is now a fashion statement that rivals Nike Air Jordans in the 90's. Kids are being held up for their jackets, as they used to be for thier shoes. Mtn Hardware and Arc Teryx also seem to be gaining popularity. I saw a kid in a full Mtn Hrd Gore-Tex suit on the bus the other day. I promise you, he was not doing any mountaineering or backpacking. He also trashed the thing in the dryer. Amazing that these items have become so trendy. I mean, my neighborhood is pretty low income, and if you aren't using the functionality of Gore tex, you could get a lot more jacket for the buck.
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nuts_r_us
Dec 22, 2005, 8:04 PM
Post #83 of 116
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Registered: Mar 18, 2005
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In reply to: I often think about the American explorers of previous centuries--Dana, Whitney, Muir, etc--and how they made it safely up so many amazing mountains without benefit of goretex, polypro, or whatever else shows up next. I bet they were pissed when everybody starting sewing wool sweaters to keep warm.
Now that's funny.
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kings_peak1
Dec 22, 2005, 8:58 PM
Post #84 of 116
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Registered: Dec 21, 2005
Posts: 14
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TNF has always been ok gear. It has also always been over priced.
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dynoclimber
Dec 22, 2005, 9:27 PM
Post #85 of 116
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Registered: Nov 26, 2003
Posts: 151
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I bought a TNF softshell (on sale) 2 years ago for skiing and climbing. 2 months later 2 zippers (front and right pocket) and the drawstring at the waist were busted. I didnt even ski with it. Bummer. If you are putting your life on the line (as many mountaineers are) I wouldn't suggest this stuff. In fact, I would advise against it. Even when doing everyday activities, you would probably be more comfortable in a cheap columbia jacket thatn a TNF one for 300 bones. As for all the "yuppies" wearing it, who cares? If they want to spend their not-so hard earned money on a jacket that sucks, let them. They'll never know the difference. We all know it sucks, thats why we dont buy it, so it shouldn't really affect us anymore.
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cedk
Dec 22, 2005, 9:31 PM
Post #86 of 116
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Registered: Oct 31, 2001
Posts: 516
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And what happened to Pizza Hut?!!? I remember back in the 80's it was so tasty that we called it Rad'. Then Pepsi bought them and suddenly they became nothing but a greasy doughey mess. They used to care about providing me with delicious pizza, now all they care about is creating next month's gimmick pizza! Man they sold out!
Oh yeah, and Van Halen was better with David Lee Roth!
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joebuzz
Dec 22, 2005, 9:41 PM
Post #87 of 116
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Registered: Aug 5, 2002
Posts: 107
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I used to work for The North Face long before "TNF" came into being. I still have friends with the company, some at the very high corp. level. And yes, they do Suck! now. I was one of the people who suggested a real climber's company like LaSportiva was a good model to follow when TNF wanted to get into the shoe biz. I truly apologize to all of you for that.
For a while, even while becoming the urban fashion ware that they are now, they still made their core products as well. That of course is gone as well. They still have some gear that works really well, but there are a bunch of companies that have picked up where the real North Face left off. Lots of my old gear is still in great shape after years of being truly hammered on.
Peace & Happy Holidays... Joe
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clippedclimbing
Dec 22, 2005, 9:43 PM
Post #88 of 116
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Registered: Jun 17, 2004
Posts: 76
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In reply to: I agree with everyone about TNF's quality going downhill, no longer being innovative, etc. But people seem to be under the impression that such a turn towards lower quality/greater distribution has been profitable for them. This is not the case, if it was then they would have declared bankruptcy 2-3 times in the last decade.
Actually, you have your info wrong. Since VF purchased TNF, they have become extremely profitable. They are on track to break 1 billion in global sales for 2005. Yes, there quality has gone to shit and their ditribution model has changed but they are definitely making money.
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sweetchuck
Dec 22, 2005, 9:48 PM
Post #89 of 116
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Registered: Aug 18, 2005
Posts: 151
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I just bought my girlfirend a NF momentum fleece shirt and it is the bomb. Very warm, seems well made, good fit, she looks hot in it, and it did her good on our backpacking trip last weekend in the freezing and rain. I have a NF synthetic down jacket that weighs next to nothing, I wore it every night on the AT for a couple months, and it is the bomb. It was dirt cheap too beause I hit a sale. 6 years later it is still going strong. Some of their stuff has gone down hill, but some of it is still quite good. If you can get a good sale, you can get good gear cheap. As for how popular and expensive the stuff is, hey, if you are going to spend a couple hundred bucks on a jacket it might as well be waterproof and warm. That helps going to the store or the mountains. It seems like everyone in NYC wears NF, and hey, it can be cold as a witch's tit up there, and most people walk or take the subway all the time so it is nice to have something on that will keep you dry and warm for that 20 block walk in the rain. Sure it's trendy, and I feel like some kinda frat boy in my jacket but damn if it's not warm, light, and comfortable.
Here's a big thank you for the barefoot, 10 year old Korean kids who put it together. Great job, it's woth both dimes they gave you to make it.
sc
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madrock
Dec 22, 2005, 9:56 PM
Post #90 of 116
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Registered: Dec 11, 2002
Posts: 255
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Several companies have been bought and sold recently. Actyrex, Mountain Hardware, Marmot and several others are now owned by "Big Company Incorporated". They all say nothing will change but only get better. Lets wait and see.
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crackers
Dec 23, 2005, 1:54 PM
Post #91 of 116
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Registered: Apr 20, 2005
Posts: 416
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Hey Joe, did you work for TNF the first time VF owned them or this time?
I know the CEO of VF, and he is pretty balls to the walls about making quality gear for the high end users while maximizing the value of the brand in the consumer quality line. I think that since they re-acquired TNF in 2000 (?), they've substantially improved the quality of their technical offerings.
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akclimber
Dec 23, 2005, 2:43 PM
Post #92 of 116
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Registered: Mar 17, 2004
Posts: 609
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In reply to: Here's a big thank you for the barefoot, 10 year old Korean kids who put it together. Great job, it's woth both dimes they gave you to make it. sc
Someone please give this man a trophy! :lol: :lol: :lol:
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euroford
Dec 23, 2005, 2:47 PM
Post #93 of 116
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Registered: Aug 26, 2002
Posts: 2913
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In reply to: Hey Joe, did you work for TNF the first time VF owned them or this time? I know the CEO of VF, and he is pretty balls to the walls about making quality gear for the high end users while maximizing the value of the brand in the consumer quality line. I think that since they re-acquired TNF in 2000 (?), they've substantially improved the quality of their technical offerings.
well why don't you do the world a public service and call yer punter friend up; let him know that 90% of their 'core' market thinks that 90% of what they turn out is consumerist crappola.
they need to do some serious work both marketing and technical to bring themselves back around. that is, if they even care to do so.
which i suggest they do: even the regular punters are starting to figure it out, they are starting to buy MH shit now, becouse its so way friggin cooler. like, hey man this is the shit real climerz wear!!
yeah, well anyways. my wife LOVES her Triple C jacket on those cold days shopping on Michigan Ave.... or evenings going clubbing with her girliefriends over on Rush Street....
while i on the other hand, I totally dig my 1 year old Spire 30 pack. thats IF i can get another full season out of it. i've already torn it in two places.
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climbinkeg
Dec 23, 2005, 3:05 PM
Post #94 of 116
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Registered: Mar 25, 2005
Posts: 16
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TNF is really going downhill. One of my friends at school is a big skier so he figured that he would wear his TNF jacket. Within two months of skiing his jacket fell apart. He didnt have any big wipeouts but now his jacket is destroyed from nothing but downhill skiing. On the other hand I have the Tadpole 23 tent and love it. It is holding up extremly well with no leaks.
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fishbelly
Dec 23, 2005, 3:49 PM
Post #95 of 116
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Registered: Oct 31, 2004
Posts: 273
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Once they started to market Extreme Gear in the ski shops. Its been down hill. Comes in handy when the lift stalls.
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samxbam8
Dec 23, 2005, 4:50 PM
Post #96 of 116
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Registered: Sep 1, 2005
Posts: 108
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[quote="cedk"]And what happened to Pizza Hut?!!? I remember back in the 80's it was so tasty that we called it Rad'. Then Pepsi bought them and suddenly they became nothing but a greasy doughey mess. They used to care about providing me with delicious pizza, now all they care about is creating next month's gimmick pizza! Man they sold out!
I like my pizza hut pizza
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samxbam8
Dec 23, 2005, 4:51 PM
Post #97 of 116
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Registered: Sep 1, 2005
Posts: 108
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i like my pizza hut pizza
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samxbam8
Dec 23, 2005, 4:53 PM
Post #98 of 116
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Registered: Sep 1, 2005
Posts: 108
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In reply to: And what happened to Pizza Hut?!!? I remember back in the 80's it was so tasty that we called it Rad'. Then Pepsi bought them and suddenly they became nothing but a greasy doughey mess. They used to care about providing me with delicious pizza, now all they care about is creating next month's gimmick pizza! Man they sold out!
I like my pizza hut pizza
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elshells
Dec 23, 2005, 5:06 PM
Post #99 of 116
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Registered: Mar 2, 2005
Posts: 96
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Here is some interesting info Liz Claiborne bought Prana.
Where do you think that line will go. I am predicting your local department store. Right next to the Clinique counter.
Kinda like TNF. Although I agree that Vanity Fair was a good thing for them. At first I was skeptical, but now they are super profitable. They appeal to mainstream America, but still make a great product.
Pizza Hut tastes terrible now.
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sirdrinksalot
Dec 23, 2005, 7:29 PM
Post #100 of 116
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Registered: Aug 26, 2004
Posts: 71
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I tell you what... I don't give a damn about the "quality" of the new TNF cuz they make a huge profit and support the "ANCHOR REPLACEMENT INITIATIVE" BigTime! Kudos to you TNF. Real Men of Genius! Keep it coming, I love those shiny new anchors! And my old assed yet still bomber sleeping bag.
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