I have never had a problem with quick draws but they seem to be taboo for trad climbing in the US.

I have never had a problem with quickdraws but they seem to be taboo for trad climbing in the US.

. . . but they seem to be taboo for trad climbing in the US.

This isn't to say that there are not times and places where draws can be useful on a particular trad route.

acording to dirteye from the other post we are all gonna die horrible and imeadiate deaths if we so much as dare to use a draw on a tradclimb

That's what everyone is saying, s---.

Jesus christ dude, alpncmbr1 finally makes a post in a reasonably calm and nice guy tone, and you have to call him names?

Well, his tone was calm, but have you noticed how he drops a nice condescending

chuckle

in all his posts now? I especially like how he repeated previously given advice as though no one had mentioned it before, and like he's the only one with a clue as to how to climb. Did you catch his idiotic post about the revolver the other day?

And I was teasing about the slings/dying thing. But sport climber hell sounds like a nice place to burn! :lol:

I use quickdraws when I dont feel like deracking slings from my shoulder -- where they belong. So D.I.E. how often are you falling on your gear?

Falling or HANGING???

'chuckle'

I use quickdraws when I dont feel like deracking slings from my shoulder -- where they belong. So D.I.E. how often are you falling on your gear?

I especially like how he repeated previously given advice as though no one had mentioned it before, and like he's the only one with a clue as to how to climb.

There is no reason to take a quick draw on a trad climb.

On the other hand, here are a few things you can't do with a QD:

1. Can't make an alpine clutch.

2. Can't make a rappel backup.

3. Can't make any of the friction knots to ascend or belay escape.

4. Can't sling a horn, flake edge, or dinner plate.

I can think of two reasons: they are less bulky than so-called trad draws, and you never have to flip the biners around to clip them.

These are arguments against carrying quick draws exclusively, but who does that?

-Jay

Well, let's say you have used up your slings and you have your three QD left, and you need to sling a horn. [Voice of Karl Mauldin] What will you do? WHAT WILL YOU DO??? [/Voice of Karl Mauldin]

The truth comes out! Dirt you sportard! :P

Caughtinzipper,

BLASPHEMER!!!! How dare you accuse me of bolt clipping!

Perhaps you prefer the term 'tard wanker?' :P

Hangdogging... I bet in spandex no less! :lol:

IF I were going to take up something as gay as sport climbing, I'd need a set of those red and white spiral striped lycra tights, yes-indeedledy-do.

The bulk of a tripled runner vs a quick draw is not worth discussing.

Flipping biners around is also a non-issue for me.

Well, let's say you have used up your slings and you have your three QD left, and you need to sling a horn. [Voice of Karl Mauldin] What will you do?

WTF is an alpine clutch??

The bulk of a dozen is.

Try climbing something harder than 5.4.

Use my prussik loops, which is what I'd do for 2 and 3 (and maybe 1, if I knew what that was) anyway.

-Jay

IF I were going to take up something as gay as sport climbing, I'd need a set of those red and white spiral striped lycra tights, yes-indeedledy-do.

There is no reason to take a quick draw on a trad climb.

Here's the real reason we're having this argument: I own 42 quickdraws (that I know of) and you don't. If you think I'm going to go out and spend more money on slings, you're nuts.

-Jay

What in the hell do you do with 42 QDs?

What in the hell do you do with 42 QDs?

You can leave draws on a project in SoCal for longer than 10 minutes, and they don't get jacked? Will wonders never cease!

You can leave draws on a project in SoCal for longer than 10 minutes, and they don't get jacked? Will wonders never cease!

There is no reason to take a quick draw on a trad climb. On the other hand, here are a few things you can't do with a QD:

1. Can't make an alpine clutch.

2. Can't make a rappel backup.

3. Can't make any of the friction knots to ascend or belay escape.

Most of the time he's spot on in his technical advice/admonishments.

... funny, I carry a couple of prusiks with me for this. Using a spectra or dyneema sling to make a prusik knot would be a pretty scary experience that I think you'd only try once.

Dirt, the point was that some slings are carried.

And in the unlikely scenario that you got to a spot where you HAD to have a sling, but only had quickdraws you could, I don't know, come up with something? It wouldn't be that hard.

Your same argument, "what if you need ___" could be extrapolated out to have people carrying 30 draws and 30 cams.

I am not saying it's stupid to carry all runners. I am saying it's pretty dumb to make a blanket statement that draws are no good for trad. Plenty of climbers have found useful applications for them, and sound reasons for those applications.

Ok, so make a mariner out of your prussik loop.

Or a kleimheist.

You MIGHT just need your prussik loops for other things, especially for the alpine clutch.

Besides all that. these are thing yo ucan't do with a QICK DRAW, or didn't they teach you teh difference between a quick draw and a prussik loop down under? I see all that standing up side down has affected your mind.

Puss in eye is no doubt the snot nosed dickless sibling of a scabby pox infested, sphylitic two dollar batton rouge whore 8^)

Personally, I like to look at the route I'll be doing. If it's straightforward, with little wandering or bulges, I'll take mostly quickdraws with a few slings. If it's wandery or unknown, I'll carry more slings and tripled draws.

Uh-huh. So you are a single pitch, guide book beta, see to the top kind of climber. Gotcha.

We bought quick draws when our kids started climbing because we figured sport climbing was a good way to introduce the kids to the rocks. Well, since we have them we usually carry a few for trad climbing too.

Also, after climbing a few meandering sport climbs, we now carry slings on bolted routes.

Crazy, isn't it?

Some climbers get so rapped up in believing that there are rules to the game.

What keeps you alive and safe is GOOD HABITS, not RULES.

The folks who say "never clip a draw to a nut" seem to fall in the category of people who believe that climbers need rules. The word "never" is an absolute. There are times to clip short sport draws to nuts. And there are many many times not to.

I have two suggestions for the folks out there who are having a hard time with this.
1- Calm down. Other people are allowed to do things differently than you do.
2- Consider buying a few 12" open slings, and rack them like draws. I carry six sport draws and four 12" open draws on most climbs. The 12" open draws do not contribute to "nut wiggle," because I use 24" or 48" slings when they are necessary.

I won't sit here and tell you that you have to do it that way, but I'll say that it works for me, or at least it has so far.

Uh-huh. So you are a single pitch, guide book beta, see to the top kind of climber. Gotcha.

errr before you go patting yourself on the back for knowing his situation, you should have noted that he lives in Queensland, home of Frog Buttress, it's very unlikely that he does only single pitch routes.

I would have thought that by looking at the route he means working out whether it's likely to be straight or wander. It doesn't take a genius to look at a prospective route to work this out, regardless of its height.

Aren't you the cluess wanker who has only climbed a few trad climbs? thanks for the tip, I'll be sure to keep in in mind, giving it all the consideration it deserves!!

Like Hell he is.

DMT

It's better to be honest AND polite than it is to be either alone.

where the hell did you get that gem from?

Aren't you the cluess wanker who has only climbed a few trad climbs? thanks for the tip, I'll be sure to keep in in mind, giving it all the consideration it deserves!!

Dirtbrain, You use all that Wide and gay gear you have on your rack or do you just post those shots so that we will think you are a wide crack hardman? :lol: Stuff looks pretty damn shiny to me :roll:

Quickdraws (of any sort) are just fine for lengthening a placement. Sometimes the placement needs to be lengthened more, so you use a runner..Duh! Sometimes, you don't need to lengthen it at all, and you just clip the rope into the biner on the piece.

Hi ,
clueless wanker here! Thanks a lot dirt . Last time I try to play on your team. "wanker"... thats none of your bussiness, "clueless"... I beg to differ! I may not have a lot of experience but I do understand the discussion. Jeezus you guys are a hard ass bunch. I was trying to agree with you! Mostly 'cause nobody else does. Never mind, your beating this one into the ground anyway.

I remember hearing the word "quickdraw" used in Yosemite in the 80s to refer to short tied runners carried on the rack with two biners already attached.

For the record Wide and gay is a term that one of my partners uses for hard wide cracks. he is verry fkn good at climbing them so INMOP he can call them whatever he wants 8^) It is certainly not meant as a slight to anyone of any alturnitive sexual persuasion. Dirtbrains wide rack does look too shiny to belong to a real climber though :lol:

Gee tardman, I guess I am not a real climber then. Too bad a few of my FAs are a higher grade than anything you have listed in your profile. I guess then if I am not a real climber, you must be something less.

YOU gotta work on your flamage pal, it's weak.

yes, you are truly clueless. ....

IT's true, Once in a While, you can clip directly or very short, without running the risk of screwing up the placement but most people don't really understand when that is. .

ha ha HA HA HA HA HA HA HA f---ing HAAAA!!!!

This piece of s--- was written by some f--- who has NO climbs listed in his profile so no-one can know how pathetic his dumb lying ass is!

And yet I bet he tries to say something about how he just hasn't posted them!

f--- off you lying piece of s---, if you have no climbs posted in your profile how the hell do you justify criticising someone who does? And before you bother playing with your dick by telling us that you really have climbed harder, how do you know that he has posted his hardest climbs, maybe he has just ticked the ones that are listed dickhead!

In fact, from looking at your profile, you have really contributed nothing to this website other than a load of s---... no personal climbs, no routes (which one would expect you would have if you had FA's, and anything positve to contribute), no gear (except a photo which could be of anyone's rack), no reviews, very average photos of one person climbing a 5.7 with no photos of you trying something so hard. You're more full of s--- than a 30 year old septic tank.

You say tradman's flames are weak, yours are based on lies and s---! That's not a flame, it's the ramblings of some needledick who thinks he can make up for shortcomings in the trouser department by pretending to be a hardman of climbing!

Edit: f---ing poser! Off to the killfile for you, I aint wasting any more of my time reading s--- from tosspots with nothing positve to add to this site.

ha ha HA HA HA HA HA HA HA f---ing HAAAA!!!!

This piece of s--- was written by some f--- who has NO climbs listed in his profile so no-one can know how pathetic his dumb lying ass is!

And yet I bet he tries to say something about how he just hasn't posted them!

f--- off you lying piece of s---, if you have no climbs posted in your profile how the hell do you justify criticising someone who does? And before you bother playing with your dick by telling us that you really have climbed harder, how do you know that he has posted his hardest climbs, maybe he has just ticked the ones that are listed dickhead!

In fact, from looking at your profile, you have really contributed nothing to this website other than a load of s---... no personal climbs, no routes (which one would expect you would have if you had FA's, and anything positve to contribute), no gear (except a photo which could be of anyone's rack), no reviews, very average photos of one person climbing a 5.7 with no photos of you trying something so hard. You're more full of s--- than a 30 year old septic tank.

You say tradman's flames are weak, yours are based on lies and s---! That's not a flame, it's the ramblings of some needledick who thinks he can make up for shortcomings in the trouser department by pretending to be a hardman of climbing!

Edit: f---ing poser! Off to the killfile for you, I aint wasting any more of my time reading s--- from tosspots with nothing positve to add to this site.

Looks like you've still got it Curt. This dude about blew a gasket.

that ain't no big deal :roll: half the punks fresh out of the gym crank harder than i do 8^) just because you are strong don't mean you know your feces :D these days i don't climb at all. I tore my rotator cuff again 2 weeks ago which is the only reason that i am even engageing in this drivel :roll: So since you are such a bad ass and s--- to use a draw what is the farthest out and most scetch piece you have ever hand drilled a bolt from :twisted:

Looks like you've still got it Curt. This dude about blew a gasket.

He is on my killfile though, I was serious about him being a dickhead, it's pretty irresponsible to be giving out advice about the safety of things which may cause someone to second-guess their own judgement next time they are climbing just for the sake of a troll.

I did the rotator cuff doing stupid people tricks off of a rope swing. can't get much more redneck than that unless you fall off a freaking tow truck :twisted: I would ventuer a guess that both of our current cranky dispositions are influenced by not being able to climb due to injurys :evil:

Hey dirtcurt,

I know alpnclmbr1. I have climbed with alpnclmbr1. alpnclmbr1 is a friend of mine. And you, sir, are no alpnclmbr1. You did quite a fine job of stirring the s--- up here, though. Nice. :lol:

Curt

....I love Loyd Benson parody quotes...

...I was cleaning a rather overgrown overhanging wet offwidth on lead. A friend swears it's at least 5.11.

At least 5.11! Wow, you must be hardcore.

If a person has plenty of slings I don’t see any reason why they would use draws.

God you are a moron. IT's precisely inexperienced climbers who get into trouble short clipping, which is what YOU are calling safe. safe it may be sometimes, but anyone who knows much knows that short clipped pieces walk, lift, and screw up in other ways. People hit the ground because they short clip when inadviseable.

A tripled sling is a fine thing to short clip with when you need to, and it has much greater versatility over the queer draw.

You wouldn't know a troll if one bit you on the ass.

I like to clip nuts with a single biner on occasion..:shock: ..How do you like dem apples? ;)