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shortfatoldguy


Sep 3, 2003, 7:04 PM
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Re: How to lose weight to improve your climbing [In reply to]
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My solution is quite simple:

1) Get into a months-long emotional crisis.
2) Lose your appetite.
3) Start taking antidepressants, which forces you to quit drinking to excess.
4) Double your workout time to compensate for the stress.

I'm pulling down much harder now. :twisted:

Seriously, I can testify to the need for increased protein. A couple of years ago, I was given the same advice that Jay gives, and it kept me from wasting my workout time by consuming my own lean tissue. (Regular body-fat tests had confirmed that this is what I'd started doing.)


overlord


Sep 5, 2003, 11:20 AM
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I find that slow and steady is the best for long term weight loss.

As a previous poster said "canned tuna". This is one of the best foods for replacing a meal, low in fat and high in protein.

What always works for me is, low fat low card high protein meals, lotsa water, lotsa activity; i.e., mountain biking, running, swimming and climbing.

Eat most of your carbs in the morning. Stay away from sugar, beer, bread, butter, salt and fast food.

Try to eat at least 4 - 6 meals a day, keeping them small.

Sorry if I repeated anything anyone has already mentioned.

im practising something like that. the only problem is i LOVE pizza. so i try to make it low fat.


enigma


Sep 12, 2003, 8:18 AM
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Re: How to lose weight to improve your climbing [In reply to]
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I find that slow and steady is the best for long term weight loss.

As a previous poster said "canned tuna". This is one of the best foods for replacing a meal, low in fat and high in protein.

What always works for me is, low fat low card high protein meals, lotsa water, lotsa activity; i.e., mountain biking, running, swimming and climbing.

Eat most of your carbs in the morning. Stay away from sugar, beer, bread, butter, salt and fast food.

Try to eat at least 4 - 6 meals a day, keeping them small.

Sorry if I repeated anything anyone has already mentioned.

im practising something like that. the only problem is i LOVE pizza. so i try to make it low fat.

Well I would tell you to eat one of those diet pizzas like healthy choice, weight watchers, or lean cuisine but do you have supermarkets that sell that in /Slovenia :roll: :lol:


stonefiend


Sep 15, 2003, 4:39 AM
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Re: How to lose weight to improve your climbing [In reply to]
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I have been on the atkins diet all of my life. I don't like carbs that much.. aside from beer. so most of what i consume consists of meat, veggies and some fruit. I have noticed, however, that if i drink lotsa beer the night before a difficult endurance project, (ie. RRG motherlode stuff) my chances of sending is greater. no lie. it's worked for me countless times. the hangover keeps the jitters down as well.
Carbload.


abkaiser


Sep 15, 2003, 5:28 PM
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Re: How to lose weight to improve your climbing [In reply to]
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JT,

Yet another followup question or two for you:

1) Soy Protein powder - is there any problem to consuming this every day? After taking a dose of it, I find it's a great hunger inhibitor. I was thinking of using it for that, as well as to increase protein intake.

2) Carbs - What are your thoughts on white rice? Everybody tells me not to eat that, as it's high in carbs, but it's *white rice*! That's a main staple of asian diets (often eaten with every meal, and yes, I spent time in Japan), and asians aren't known for being fat.

Thanks!

Andy


jt512


Sep 15, 2003, 5:35 PM
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Re: How to lose weight to improve your climbing [In reply to]
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In reply to:
JT,

Yet another followup question or two for you:

1) Soy Protein powder - is there any problem to consuming this every day? After taking a dose of it, I find it's a great hunger inhibitor. I was thinking of using it for that, as well as to increase protein intake.

I see no problem in consuming soy protein daily.

In reply to:
2) Carbs - What are your thoughts on white rice? Everybody tells me not to eat that, as it's high in carbs, but it's *white rice*! That's a main staple of asian diets (often eaten with every meal, and yes, I spent time in Japan), and asians aren't known for being fat.

Carbs are not fattening, no matter what the current diet faddists tell you. The problem with white rice is the same problem with white bread: the nutritious parts have been removed in the refining process. Instead of white rice, eat brown rice; instead of white bread, eat whole wheat.

-Jay


baalzimon


Sep 15, 2003, 6:42 PM
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Re: How to lose weight to improve your climbing [In reply to]
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Carbs are not fattening, no matter what the current diet faddists tell you.

Carbs can become fat very easily, especially if they have a high glycemic index (GI). Gi is a measure of how quickly a food will cause an increase in blood glucose levels. Glucose has a GI of 100. A potato and most white rice is about 95 or more. When you eat high GI foods, they flood your system with glucose. Then your body reacts by releasing insulin. The insulin sends the glucose to the liver where it is coverted into FAT. Since you now have very low glucose levels, you get hungry for more carbs and the cycle starts over again.

GI: http://www.coldcure.com/html/glycemicindex.html
Cycle:
http://www.cnn.com/...fusion.ap/index.html


jt512


Sep 15, 2003, 6:55 PM
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Re: How to lose weight to improve your climbing [In reply to]
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Carbs are not fattening, no matter what the current diet faddists tell you.

Carbs can become fat very easily, especially if they have a high glycemic index (GI). Gi is a measure of how quickly a food will cause an increase in blood glucose levels.

There may be some valid health reasons to avoid high-GI foods, but a calorie of white bread is no more or less "fattening" than a calorie of butter.

When you consume a high-carb meal (high GI or otherwise), your body stores very little of it as fat. Instead, nearly all the carbohydrate is burned for energy. The low-carb faddists conveniently overlook the fact that insulin promotes glucose uptake by muscle cells, where it is burned for energy. Contrast this with dietary fat, almost all of which goes directly into fat cells.

-Jay


abkaiser


Sep 16, 2003, 2:49 PM
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Re: How to lose weight to improve your climbing [In reply to]
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Instead, nearly all the carbohydrate is burned for energy. The low-carb faddists conveniently overlook the fact that insulin promotes glucose uptake by muscle cells, where it is burned for energy. Contrast this with dietary fat, almost all of which goes directly into fat cells.

-Jay

Please explain this process a little more. If I eat carbs, you're telling me this will be burned off as energy. Is this something like slightly increasing my normal metabolic rate, or will I burn this extra carb-energy only if I'm excercising?
Or to make my question easier: If I eat lots of carbs but don't excercise (ie, take in more calories than I burn), will I gain more weight if that intake is carbs, as opposed to low-carb foods?

Thanks for the help, Jay. This is all extremely helpful.

Andy


jt512


Sep 16, 2003, 4:00 PM
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Re: How to lose weight to improve your climbing [In reply to]
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Instead, nearly all the carbohydrate is burned for energy. The low-carb faddists conveniently overlook the fact that insulin promotes glucose uptake by muscle cells, where it is burned for energy. Contrast this with dietary fat, almost all of which goes directly into fat cells.

-Jay

Please explain this process a little more. If I eat carbs, you're telling me this will be burned off as energy. Is this something like slightly increasing my normal metabolic rate, or will I burn this extra carb-energy only if I'm excercising?

Your metabolic rate doesn't increase. Basically, your body burns what you feed it. You feed it carbs, it burns carbs. Except in insulin-resistant or diabetic individuals, very little carbohydrate is converted to fat.

In reply to:
Or to make my question easier: If I eat lots of carbs but don't excercise (ie, take in more calories than I burn), will I gain more weight if that intake is carbs, as opposed to low-carb foods?

I think I have already answered that question. A calorie is a calorie. It doesn't matter what the source of the calorie is. You'll gain ~1 lb of fat for every 3500 calories you consume in excess of what you burn, regardless of the fat-carbohydrate composition of your diet. I hate to resort to macronutrient balance calculations, but here goes: Let's say you burn 2500 calories/day but consume 3000 calories, of which 2000 is carbohydrate and 1000 is fat (we'll conveniently ignore protein). To a first approximation, all the carbohydrate you consume will be burned. In addition, you will burn 500 calories of fat. That leaves 500 calories of fat unburned, which will be added to your body fat stores.

-Jay


baalzimon


Sep 16, 2003, 11:15 PM
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Re: How to lose weight to improve your climbing [In reply to]
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we're getting closer to agreeing i think. something you are leaving out is that if you eat high GI food (many high carb foods are high GI), then your body is flooded with calories(glucose), and you may not be able to burn them at a hogh enough rate to keep them from getting converted into fat. if you eat low GI food, then the calories are slowly released into your system and you can burn them fast enough to use them up as they come, and prevent the large insulin release.

josh


jt512


Sep 17, 2003, 12:29 AM
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we're getting closer to agreeing i think. something you are leaving out is that if you eat high GI food (many high carb foods are high GI), then your body is flooded with calories(glucose), and you may not be able to burn them at a hogh enough rate to keep them from getting converted into fat...

I see no evidence for that in the scientific literature. In fact, the opposite appears to be true; namely, that high-GI foods promote carbohydrate burning, rather than conversion of carbohydrate to fat. In her recent review article,* Janette Brand-Miller, one of the big names in carbohydrate research who was quoted in one of the news pieces to which you posted links, specifically states this. The most likely effect of high-GI foods on body weight is that this increased carbohydrate burning triggers hunger more quickly than when low-GI foods are consumed. Thus, it may be helpful to base weight-loss diets on low-GI carbohydrates, but not for the reasons you state.

-Jay

*Brand-Miller JC, Holt SH, Pawlak DB, McMillan J. Glycemic index and obesity. Am J Clin Nutr. 2002 Jul;76(1):281S-5S.


styndall


Oct 6, 2003, 4:38 PM
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Re: How to lose weight to improve your climbing [In reply to]
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Buy the cheap soy-protein powder. Let the muscle heads waste their money on designer whey peptides.
-Jay

I'm not too terribly up on my scientific nutrition, but somewhere recently, I heard that soybeans contain protein uptake inhibitors, as well as some nutrient uptake inhibitors, probably as a defense mechanism. This, if true, would suggest that soybeans themselves wouldn't be the best source of protein. I'm not sure whether that would carry over to soy-based protein powders, as I know essentially nothing about the process by which that stuff is made. Do you have any thoughts or more information on this kind of thing?


jt512


Oct 7, 2003, 10:45 PM
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Buy the cheap soy-protein powder. Let the muscle heads waste their money on designer whey peptides.
-Jay

I'm not too terribly up on my scientific nutrition, but somewhere recently, I heard that soybeans contain protein uptake inhibitors, as well as some nutrient uptake inhibitors, probably as a defense mechanism. This, if true, would suggest that soybeans themselves wouldn't be the best source of protein. I'm not sure whether that would carry over to soy-based protein powders, as I know essentially nothing about the process by which that stuff is made.

Substances in soybeans that interfere with the digestion of protein are inactivated by heat, so this is only a problem for raw soybeans. My (limited) understanding is that most soy products -- and I presume this includes soy protein supplements -- are processed with heat, and so their protein is highly digestible. Soybeans also contain antinutrients, notably phytates, that inhibit the absorption of minerals from the intestine. These are not, to my knowledge, inactivated; however, it is unlikely that they are present in sufficient quantities to interfere with the absorption of minerals from other foods in the diet. Moreover, many foods contain phytates and oxalates that inhibit mineral absorption. Spinach, for instance, contains high concentrations of oxalate, rendering nearly all of its calcium unavailable. This is not to say that one should avoid eating spinach, only that one should not rely on spinach as a source of calcium. Likewise, one should not count on soy products as rich sources of minerals, either, though as a protein source soy should be fine (except when eaten raw).

-Jay


climbhigh2005


Oct 7, 2003, 11:00 PM
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Very impressive!! Good advice.. definetly the best I've heard in a long time!


heath


Oct 10, 2003, 10:47 AM
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I think I have already answered that question. A calorie is a calorie. It doesn't matter what the source of the calorie is. You'll gain ~1 lb of fat for every 3500 calories you consume in excess of what you burn, regardless of the fat-carbohydrate composition of your diet. I hate to resort to macronutrient balance calculations, but here goes: Let's say you burn 2500 calories/day but consume 3000 calories, of which 2000 is carbohydrate and 1000 is fat (we'll conveniently ignore protein). To a first approximation, all the carbohydrate you consume will be burned. In addition, you will burn 500 calories of fat. That leaves 500 calories of fat unburned, which will be added to your body fat stores.

It's my understanding, based on the information that I've read, that high-GI foods stimulate the appetite, causing an individual to eat more than they they normally would, which leads to obesity. Without referring to any specific literature, I would summarize it by saying that consumption of foods high on the glycemic index cause the over-production of insulin, which in turn causes the blood sugar level to quickly peak and then drop very low which then causes the onset of hunger, even if the calories aren't necessary. I believe that's why the Atkin's diet is effective for a lot of people. The diet has very little effect on the metabolism, but rather affects the tendency of an individual to be hungry.

I've only read a little of the Atkin's literature, but they attempt to suggest that the while on the Atkin's diet, the body gets into some special metabolic state such that only a portion of calories from fat are absorbed into the body. So that rather than getting 9 calories per gram of fat, the body only gets 5 grams and the rest are somehow magically discarded. I might be misreprenting it, but this was the impression that I was given.


climb_plastic


Oct 14, 2003, 7:46 AM
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The best thing to do is to eat only what you need to eat for nurishment and not eat for taste. When you eat stuff that tastes good then you will eat more than you need to because you also get satisfaction from the taste and not just getting the nutrition you need. Take the Subway diets for instance. They're not losing weight because the sandwich is good for them. The reason why they lose weight is because they eat those things every day and every meal and so they get so sick of it that they are just eating what they need to and not eating extra for the taste. They may start off eating 10 of them in their first time but when they get to the next meal and it's the same exact thing then they'll most likely eat less. After a while they get so sick of it they're only taking a bite out of the sandwich and throwing out the rest.


realization


Oct 30, 2003, 6:32 PM
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Re: How to lose weight to improve your climbing [In reply to]
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I consider myself pretty healthy, but correct me if i'm wrong. For breakfast i'll normally eat raison brand cereal, with 2 % milk. Lunch I have a banana, red apple, wheat bagel, and plain grain granola bar. I don't drink carbonated drinks period, I normally have water / Gatoraide, orange juice, that kinda thing. For dinner, i'll normally have pasta, grapes, pineapple's, oranges, but it basically depends on what my mom feels like making. I always have dannon yogurt, and dannon smoothies whenever i'm hungry, and I normally snack on Fat free wheat thins when i'm bored. I ride my bike to my friends wall daily, Climb hard on weekends 6-8 hours, and eat little to none ( more than usual due to halloween ) candy. I try to excersize at home, push ups, and pull ups at home whenever possible. How does this compare, what am I eating right wrong? I know i'm pretty healthy considering my age grade, seeing what other people eat at the school lunch table ( cookies / pizza ) but please put in your opinion, i'd appreciate it THANKS
-mike


bonesbrigade


Oct 30, 2003, 8:20 PM
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Is that why Rocky ate all the raw eggs, because it is high protein content while he was burning fat? Apollo Creed was no slouch. I am going to start drinking raw eggs all the time while i work out.


jt512


Oct 30, 2003, 9:02 PM
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Is that why Rocky ate all the raw eggs, because it is high protein content while he was burning fat? Apollo Creed was no slouch. I am going to start drinking raw eggs all the time while i work out.

Do so at your own risk. Raw eggs are pretty hazardous, they can be contaminated with salmonella and other microbes. They're also a poorer source of protein than cooked eggs, due to the presence of protease inhibitors that are inactivated by cooking.

-Jay


anothertucsonclimber


Oct 30, 2003, 9:31 PM
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...LAY OFF THE TWINKIES DUDE...Comon people - this is a joke. Stop hitting the BK drive thru for those onion rings.....!


piton


Nov 6, 2003, 6:15 PM
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hey Jay,

what are some foods that are good for you that get things moving. besides a cup of dunkin donuts coffee..


inflight


Nov 6, 2003, 6:38 PM
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jay_climbingchick


Nov 8, 2003, 3:36 AM
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Thanks Jay I am glad you told me that because I was at a lose on how to do it right.
:D


chadnsc


Dec 2, 2003, 7:40 PM
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Ok, I have a couple of questions.

1. Is it true that the human body can only absorb 40 grams of protein every two hours? Basically is it wise to eat more than 40 grams of protein in one sitting. Yes I know this is hard to do.

2. In the initial post it was stated that the average man climbing 3 times a week and doing cardio 3 times a week needs 2,500 calories a day. What is an "average man"? I ask because I'm not average size, 6'-3" 240lbs(very muscular build, but still have fat to loose) Oh, and I'm also an insulin dependent diabetic.

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