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hangerlessbolt
Apr 17, 2002, 3:12 PM
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I have always found female bodies to be incredibly attractive. (My first love was the female gymnast body; thick quads, ripped calves, and wide backs.)
With regards to being intimidated, personally, it’s not intimidation but rather motivation that I feel when my partner (male or female) climbs as hard or harder than I do. It pushes me to try harder.
Case in point: I was recently working my first 5.12a on TR. I was the first one to try it. I got about 20 feet off the ground and after several attempts, asked to be lowered. My female friend was up next. She made it to where I had made it. Took a few tries, but finally worked the entire route. When she came down I felt I had to give it another go. Not because I was intimidated that a “Lady” did something that I couldn’t, but because I was motivated by the stick-to-it-evness that she displayed. Gender is not nearly as much a factor for some as it is for others. I would have tried the route again with the same desire had my partner been a man. Just the way it is.
Now with that said, I know and have known many men that have given up on activities because their female counter-part became better at it than them. (Bowling, pool, darts, etc.) However, on the same token, I know and have known women that have given up on certain activities because their male counter-parts became better at it than them. So I don’t know if it is so much gender driven, as it is personality driven. Whatever it is, I find it sad that someone would give up climbing or any other activity that brings them joy and satisfaction just because their girlfriend, boyfriend, wife, or husband is better at it than they are.
But what do I know…I’m just a climber
-Hanger
[ This Message was edited by: hangerlessbolt on 2002-05-02 10:55 ]
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camhead
Apr 17, 2002, 3:21 PM
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Man, I thought that this thread would be about men being intimidated by women who are better climbers than them!
Oh well.
I am sick of trying to get girls that I like to try climbing. from now on I'm only going to date climbers, preferably only those that are better climbers than me.
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missedyno
Apr 17, 2002, 8:21 PM
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well, even though i think it's funny that i can beat some guys in an arm wrestle, i personally like that my boyfriend is a lot stronger than me.
so do you think this question can go in reverse? strong women wanting stronger men?
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rockwomyn
Apr 17, 2002, 8:48 PM
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Well as a dedicated weight lifter and climber of course, i have developed quite a bit of muscle...not enough to become bulky because of my lack of testosterone, but i am getting defined and toned. Which i love. even though i was just thinking yesterday that because of my lack o' boobs that i looked like a boy. I soon got over that after i did a super intense workout and felt great.
However...to those who don't work out, like people i work with i feel like i have to defend my passions for exercise, diet and of course that irresponsible and risk taking sport of climbing. It used to bug me but now i just remind myself that when i look in the mirror i look great, i feel great and that's all that matters.
If men are intimidated....oh well they can fall into the group of people i would rather not conversate with anyway.
MUSCLE GIRLS ROCK!!!!!!
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foolry
Apr 17, 2002, 9:18 PM
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I too got the impression from the title of this thread that we were talking about girls that climb better than guys. . . sooo, I'll say that I would love to date a climber that could kick my trash on the crag, I'm very competitive and this would inspire me to push myself way harder. And hopefuly she would do the same and we could just feed of each others energy.
Along the same lines, I think that watching a chic get a real tough redpoint is a MAJOR turn on.
And on the strength issue, the kind of body that hardcore climbing builds I personally find way attractive.
~foolry
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cedk
Apr 17, 2002, 9:36 PM
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I'd like to turn this around. Would you ladies date someone who climbed significantly and consitantly worse than you?
Oh yeah and on the actual topic of the post, what climber isn't attracted to girls that are in shape? I don't think I've seen Sir-mix-alot out at the crag recently.
[ This Message was edited by: cedk on 2002-04-17 14:45 ]
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runningitout
Apr 17, 2002, 10:05 PM
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cedk/x(?): good question. I wouldn't have a problem with it. Besides the standard, forgive me girls, is that most climbing couples the man is able to lead/climb the harder routes, so the men are used to this why would we have aproblem with it? The one I would think would have an issue would be the guy feeling inferior.
I would be glad to say I am a lesbian, but that wouldn't be true, but I can say that I love looking at toned female bodies, they're extremely attractive creatures. And I love the way I look after a trip.
I think our climbing men are not your average arseholes, and do not subscribe to what may intimidate other men, god bless em.
Proud to be a large ladie,
Lis
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crap
Apr 17, 2002, 10:18 PM
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My little girly cousin in on a college Rugby team and has almost as many scars as me now. I like it, but of course our relationship is based on kicking the crap out of each other and trying to break each other. Our favorite is standing on the other's stomach while they slowly say the entire alphabet or whisle. I got a hugh weight advantage, but she still hangs in there some how. Shes a tough cookie. It would really suck if this was the same kind of relationship I had with a girl friend. Where is the lovin in that?
Maybe people get intimidated because they want a romantic relationship with with somebody they've always had a crap kicking relationship with and they can't get the other to understand.
Just a thought I had in Math class
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indigo_nite
Apr 17, 2002, 11:15 PM
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this is a way interesting topic. I'm a girl for context. (Warning: This is long)
I've noticed when climbing with guys that there's more competition. It's generally OK when I don't climb as hard (or sometimes expected) but it doesn't seem as cool (from the guy's psyche) if I'm climbing stronger that day. With women, it seems to vary more on the individual. If I'm climbing w/ a fem who's pretty competitive, she might be testing me to see how hard I'll climb so she can compare her abilities to me.
Competition against my partner doesn't seem to motivate me much. I'd rather get the satisfaction of completing a project that has been kicking my butt for a while. I like people who are funny and relaxing (if they're intense climbers on top of this, that's way cool).
If a guy were climbing below my level but was safe and had the same goals for improvement, that would be cool. Like at least having the ability to swap belays.
Psychologically wanting a stronger guy? Well, I wouldn't want to be bigger than the guy. It's nice to be w/ someone who makes you feel looked after (probably in life as in climbing).
I've been playing sports since I realized I wasn't a cheerleader type. Gaining too much muscle has always been a concern. But I see strong women climbers w/ well-defined back muscles and think, "wow, I want a back like that."
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treyr
Apr 17, 2002, 11:33 PM
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No I am not intimidated. i dont get indtimidated cuz i know there are always people better than u and u always have room for improvement.
Trob
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crap
Apr 18, 2002, 12:02 AM
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Competion?
I like to think of it as setting a standard that the others must meet. Like towing the line. Two evenly matched climbers sharpen each other and push the line of their ablities upward at a steady rate. Unevenly matched partners may stagnate or get frusterated with each other. An overly matched girl may cause more frusteration than stagnation in a male partner of lesser ablities.
[ This Message was edited by: crap on 2002-04-17 17:04 ]
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spike_in_milton
Apr 18, 2002, 4:03 AM
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Hey crazylikeafawkes... define "too much muscle" on a woman. I personally find well muscled women devestatingly sexly, attractive, and frequently confident in themselves and their abilities (which I also like in a person in general, not just women ).
If you're finding guys intimidated by your power, t'hell with them. They don't know what they can learn from you.
Spike
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daisuke
Apr 18, 2002, 4:42 AM
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I'll define it to you spike... in 3 words: female body builders... and I'll tell you why it's TOO MUCH muscle in 3 more words: extremely not sexy.
I'm straight and all but I think I can tell the difference between ugly and attractive men, and I don't see anything attractive in guys with thighs wider than their heads either!
D
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qacwac
Apr 18, 2002, 5:18 AM
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Big muscles on females just aren't attractive to me. Maybe it's just that it doesn't seem natural to me. Lean, firm, smooth, with only slight definition is what I find appealing.
As for climbing ability. If I were to seek a relationship she would definately have to climb or else I'd have to give up climbing. As long as she was willing to climb and enjoy it then I don't guess it would matter how bad she was. However I don't think I would like having a girlfriend who consistently climbed better than me.
Is she intimidating me? No I don't think so, she could probably cook (I say this because I never cook) better than me and that's not intimidating. Embarassing though? Yeah, a lot.
And to answer the original question. The difference is that "good climber" in my opinion applies totally to ability to get up the rock. "she looks manly" totaly refers to physical appearance and can have nothing to do with climbing. some girls are just born "manly". I think there's a huge line between the two. For example say Heidi Klum climbed a V14. She would be a good climber. She does not look manly. suppose Mrs. Butch flails on a V0-. Is she a good climber? No. Is she manly? Yeah. They're completely different.
You can be one and not the other.
You can be the other and not the one.
You can be both.
You can be neither.
As for using the common sport against them. If it's producing an undesirable effect in either member then it should be stopped or checked or revaluated. Let's take a similar example. Guy and girl are boyfriend and girlfriend. Both climb. Guy pulls incredibly hard and starts sending some 14's and double digit V's. (all good right) Well it makes him start to get cocky (which he has no problem being cocky, after all, he's sending some hard stuff) but she doesn't like it. So she tells him to either stop having a bighead or she's leaving cause she can't stand cocky guys. Nothing wrong with this. Climbing is producing a characteristic trait that she doesn't like so she should do something about it. Same as girl getting big muscles that the guy doesn't like. He should try and do something about it.
Now of course if the guy likes muscles then there's no problem.
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rockwomyn
Apr 18, 2002, 1:34 PM
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The only way female bodybuilders get so huge is because they take some sort of supplements, steroids etc. Woman do not produce enough testoterone to get that huge naturally. Not saying that we can't build muscle and be lean mean and toned. But the herculean bulk is accomplished with assistance.
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roclymber
Apr 18, 2002, 1:58 PM
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Hellaz, Im not even close to being intimidated by a climber chic. That rocks. I mean someone that can climb better than me, well deserves the respect. I dont think it should even be a gender issue, just a skill issue. rock on girls!
matt
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climberchic
Apr 18, 2002, 3:40 PM
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It's always a bonus when a guy knows more or can climb harder, so I have something to learn, but by no means is a requirement. It's hard enough to find someone you connect with, are attracted to, AND share your life passion. So, if the chemistry was right, would I date someone that climbs "worse" than me? Absolutely. But the key is persistence. If they give up too easily (on a climb) that is a major turnoff to me. Just a need to climb, that's all.
On another note, I haven't had much experience climbing with guys that climb worse than I do. Besides "new climber" exceptions, I have been lucky enough to keep finding partners that can seriously crank. This motivates me to, not necessarily to compete or surpass them, but try to at least keep up. In a lot of cases, "keeping up" means dragging yourself up those 12a's
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krillen
Apr 18, 2002, 4:00 PM
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Okay I'll take the heat.
You guys that say you'd love to date a stronger climber than you, or aren't intimidated by a stronger woman than you, have ot see the big picture.
Sure at first it's fantastic (as most new relationships are) but after a while it nags at you a bit (in varry degrees depending on the person) ESPECIALLY if you are very competetive. We can all SAY we think equality in the sexes is a good thing, but there are still traditional sexual stereo-types ingrained into all of us.
Now, how you deal with those feelings of intimidation etc. is a different matter. Having them floating around in your head ISN'T bad thing, letting them interefere with your relationship with that person IS.
I will admit I HAVE been intimidated by stronger women, and still am occsionally, but I've done my best to see the whole person. Sometimes it gets the better of me, but all I can do it try my best.
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crackaddict
Apr 18, 2002, 7:29 PM
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I don't mind a woman that is muscular. I think it looks good.
I don't think I would like it if she beat me up and talked like a guy though.
Scary!
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overlord
Apr 18, 2002, 7:42 PM
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I like women with good body. Climbing really helps them. And i dont mind them climbing better than me. my ex was for a time better than me, so i pushed a little harder... now im the better one. but still a good girl is a good motivation. But they must not muck you. I dont muck anybody.
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maculated
Apr 18, 2002, 7:42 PM
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I don't think I could date a guy who was a worse climber than me. Why? I'd feel like it was holding me back. I'm getting this way with my choice of climbing partners. My most (at the moment) regular partner and I are about matched for skill, so it works pretty nicely. We work together to get better. Kind of how relationships should be.
And just to make Crap's day: I am Joe's complete lack of surprise.
Now, that's not to say that I wouldn't take a guy I was dating climbing and train him. I'd probably be bummed when and if he surpassed me, but. . . them's the knocks in life.
I can't remember who posted about not mentioning how ripped a gal is. I don't know about that. Just depends. People tell me I have wide shoulders (I don't think I do), and it kind of bugs. But tell me I'm in great shape? I'm yours.
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clam
Apr 19, 2002, 3:19 AM
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Wow! The thread was really different from what I thought it was going to be when I read the title. It was all about muscle and I thought it was going to be about technique. I'm a guy and started out hauling myself up the wall with my guns, pump, pump, pump. Then I noticed these women who were really dancing up the wall with little effort. That's when I noticed climberchicks for the first time. How'd they do that? And I watched them and asked some questions. I watched some more and tried to do that and my consciousness began to shift from upper body to mid body and legs. What a difference in climbing and its enjoyment. Thanks climberchicks! You can still climb better than me, but who cares. You taught me how to climb, like my mama taught me how to pray. I'm gonna keep watching you. Hope you don't mind!
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missedyno
Apr 19, 2002, 3:38 AM
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maculated: kudos on the fight club post. i just couldn't think of any. (i've been told that chicks who like fight club are uber cool.)
any chicks find that people feel they have some sort of important say with your looks? "don't work on your legs too much, they'll get big and you don't need them to climb" i've also been told not to touch weights as they will build mass as well...
geeeez!
[ This Message was edited by: crazylikeafawkes on 2002-04-19 03:24 ]
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jt512
Apr 19, 2002, 5:41 PM
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Quote:Maculated: People tell me I have wide shoulders (I don't think I do), and it kind of bugs.
I think broad shoulders on a woman looks great!
Quote:
But tell me I'm in great shape? I'm yours.
Maculated, you are in great shape!
Dinner at 8:00?
-Jay
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maculated
Apr 19, 2002, 6:03 PM
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Hey! I'm not THAT easy!
Crazy, well . . . that makes two of us, then. And, actually, I used to do a bunch of weights and crunches when I was younger, but I have a low metabolism, and it kind of just makes the fat stick out more . . . so I quit doing the crunches. I'm doing them again for lacrosse, and I've lost weight, so it's not that big of a deal, but yeah . . . "don't bulk up" is common. You should see my school - 80% skinny minnies spending 80% of their time on a treadmill.
[ This Message was edited by: maculated on 2002-04-19 11:04 ]
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