Ill tell you what, whatever it takes to avoid a ground fall. In most cases I would say the first bolt if its really high. I will take a fall if its a small fall, I love to boulder. But, I also think a high ground fall that causes injury or worse is not worth the risk. Just this weekend I blew a clip on a runout second bolt and took a 25 foot ground fall, I walked away from it pretty banged up but I will never let it happen again, this I am sure. When I am able to breath properly again and the puss stops seeping from my head, (I was wearing a helmet, it is now a two piece), I will be back to the route that kicked my ass. I will be bringing a stick clip and I will be stick clipping that second bolt. Sport climbing is about having fun pushing your limits on a project. Clip what you need to to stay safe. If you want to be a cowboy place your pro.
Ill tell you what, whatever it takes to avoid a ground fall. In most cases I would say the first bolt if its really high. I will take a fall if its a small fall, I love to boulder. But, I also think a high ground fall that causes injury or worse is not worth the risk. Just this weekend I blew a clip on a runout second bolt and took a 25 foot ground fall, I walked away from it pretty banged up but I will never let it happen again, this I am sure. When I am able to breath properly again and the puss stops seeping from my head, (I was wearing a helmet, it is now a two piece), I will be back to the route that kicked my ass. I will be bringing a stick clip and I will be stick clipping that second bolt. Sport climbing is about having fun pushing your limits on a project. Clip what you need to to stay safe. If you want to be a cowboy place your pro.
A stick that is used to clip (usually) the first bolt of a sport climb from the ground so that even the opening moves are protected.
Some/many modern sport climbs are bolted with a high first bolt, with the expectation that it will be clipped with a stick clip. This is done, because it allows for safer clipping of the 2nd bolt, without having to make the 2nd bolt (and even 3rd bolt) very close to the previous bolt(s).
So, to call the climb a redpoint you cant "stick clip" any of the bolts?
That's what the debate, and the poll, in this thread is about.
My personal feeling -- stick-clipping the first bolt of a sport climb still allows one to claim a red-point or on-sight of the climb. Especially since many climbs are bolted with that expectation.
Why is Shelf special ? Been there a bunch of times and didn't think the first bolts were higher than usual, or the landing was worse, or the rock was more brittle.
Why is Shelf special ? Been there a bunch of times and didn't think the first bolts were higher than usual, or the landing was worse, or the rock was more brittle.
They're higher than a lot of places I climb, but I stick clip the first bolt unless I am sure that I won't fall before clipping it. Hitting the ground is never a "good landing," IMO.
I have only climbed for 2 years, and mostly at shelf and to flash or redpoint or onsight why not just have a spotter for that first bolt. Call the climb what it is.
(This post was edited by ShelfRoadNic on May 23, 2013, 6:29 PM)
They're higher than a lot of places I climb, but I stick clip the first bolt unless I am sure that I won't fall before clipping it. Hitting the ground is never a "good landing," IMO.
I associate Smith Rock with high first bolts. Barbecue The Pope for example.
I have only climbed for 2 years, and mostly at shelf and to flash or redpoint or onsight why not just have a spotter for that first bolt. Call the climb what it is.
They're higher than a lot of places I climb, but I stick clip the first bolt unless I am sure that I won't fall before clipping it. Hitting the ground is never a "good landing," IMO.
I associate Smith Rock with high first bolts. Barbecue The Pope for example.
They're higher than a lot of places I climb, but I stick clip the first bolt unless I am sure that I won't fall before clipping it. Hitting the ground is never a "good landing," IMO.
I associate Smith Rock with high first bolts. Barbecue The Pope for example.
I was thinking of Smith, too. Several routes there that I wouldn't want to climb without stick clipping, but most have a long stick somewhere close so I have never had a problem with not bringing a real commercial stick clip.
(This post was edited by milesenoell on May 24, 2013, 3:44 AM)
I was thinking of Smith, too. Several routes there that I wouldn't want to climb without stick clipping, but most have a long stick somewhere close so I have never had a problem with not bringing a real stick clip.
I might argue that that is a "real" stick clip. A piece of stick, fixed up with a bit of climbing tape is the real thing. These modern pre-made objects with extensible poles and pre-manufactured devices for holding the 'biner. They're just substitutes for a stick & some tape.
I was thinking of Smith, too. Several routes there that I wouldn't want to climb without stick clipping, but most have a long stick somewhere close so I have never had a problem with not bringing a real stick clip.
I might argue that that is a "real" stick clip. A piece of stick, fixed up with a bit of climbing tape is the real thing. These modern pre-made objects with extensible poles and pre-manufactured devices for holding the 'biner. They're just substitutes for a stick & some tape.
Yeah, cuz real sport climbers make their stick clips the traditional way. No, wait.
I was thinking of Smith, too. Several routes there that I wouldn't want to climb without stick clipping, but most have a long stick somewhere close so I have never had a problem with not bringing a real stick clip.
I might argue that that is a "real" stick clip. A piece of stick, fixed up with a bit of climbing tape is the real thing. These modern pre-made objects with extensible poles and pre-manufactured devices for holding the 'biner. They're just substitutes for a stick & some tape.
And I love the wads of tape left behind from these stick clips.
Honestly, if you're just happy with a pain in the ass stick at the bottom of the crag you obviously don't understand how to fully use a proper stick clip.
I might argue that that is a "real" stick clip. A piece of stick, fixed up with a bit of climbing tape is the real thing. These modern pre-made objects with extensible poles and pre-manufactured devices for holding the 'biner. They're just substitutes for a stick & some tape.
Good to know. I was just worrying that there was not enough gritty authenticity in my climbing, maybe using a branch to pre-clip that first bolt of a 5.9 will help.
I might argue that that is a "real" stick clip. A piece of stick, fixed up with a bit of climbing tape is the real thing. These modern pre-made objects with extensible poles and pre-manufactured devices for holding the 'biner. They're just substitutes for a stick & some tape.
Good to know. I was just worrying that there was not enough gritty authenticity in my climbing, maybe using a branch to pre-clip that first bolt of a 5.9 will help.
Woah, 5.9? I don't think most of us participating in this thread are at that elite level yet.
I was thinking of Smith, too. Several routes there that I wouldn't want to climb without stick clipping, but most have a long stick somewhere close so I have never had a problem with not bringing a real stick clip.
I might argue that that is a "real" stick clip. A piece of stick, fixed up with a bit of climbing tape is the real thing. These modern pre-made objects with extensible poles and pre-manufactured devices for holding the 'biner. They're just substitutes for a stick & some tape.
And I love the wads of tape left behind from these stick clips.
Honestly, if you're just happy with a pain in the ass stick at the bottom of the crag you obviously don't understand how to fully use a proper stick clip.
I've got an extendible painter's pole with a commercial stick-clip attachment at the end. I was very happy to have it with me at Rumney last weekend.
But, I started out old-school with a stick and tape. Though, I never left the wads of tape behind.
I was thinking of Smith, too. Several routes there that I wouldn't want to climb without stick clipping, but most have a long stick somewhere close so I have never had a problem with not bringing a real stick clip.
I might argue that that is a "real" stick clip. A piece of stick, fixed up with a bit of climbing tape is the real thing. These modern pre-made objects with extensible poles and pre-manufactured devices for holding the 'biner. They're just substitutes for a stick & some tape.
And I love the wads of tape left behind from these stick clips.
Honestly, if you're just happy with a pain in the ass stick at the bottom of the crag you obviously don't understand how to fully use a proper stick clip.
I've got an extendible painter's pole with a commercial stick-clip attachment at the end. I was very happy to have it with me at Rumney last weekend.
But, I started out old-school with a stick and tape. Though, I never left the wads of tape behind.
Then your not doing it right. More Trash FTW!
Now having reread this little thread, I realize a stick clip is exactly what I needed last fall. No pun intended. I had never passed up a climb before for the want of a stick, but yea, the LZ was a small boulder field. Plus there was a couple ledges just wide enough to flip the leader on his way down. The bolt was a litlle higher than I'm used to, so what the longest stick clip they make?
The longest I've seen are window washer poles. They're a bit heavy, but they extend pretty far. Not sure how long they make them, but one of my partners has one that is 25-30 ft.
The bolt was a litlle higher than I'm used to, so what the longest stick clip they make?
From what I've seen, mostly they make a biner-holder attachment, and you supply your own pole. I've seen a variety of different things used for the poles, from tent-poles to painting poles to window-washing poles.
Trade-offs include weight, length, portability, collapsibility, rigidity, and cost.
The longest I've seen are window washer poles. They're a bit heavy, but they extend pretty far. Not sure how long they make them, but one of my partners has one that is 25-30 ft.
I find that heavey is good because it means they're likely made of steel instead of aluminum. Al seems to have a lot more flex, which can be a real issue when you start trying to extend it out further.
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