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squirrelgirl
Apr 8, 2002, 10:55 PM
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A friend of mine is a vegetarian. She still eats dairy products, but I'm not sure about eggs. I don't think she eats fish though. At this point she's kinda pale and skinny. However, she's still got some growing to do. So, this may just be temporary.
Me? I'm not a vegetarian myself. I like eating meat. Besides, we're omnivores by nature, and suddenly turning into an herbavore doesn't sit well with me personally and my several million years of evolution.
But, as long as you make sure you're getting enough of the proper nutrients, you should be just fine.
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maculated
Apr 9, 2002, 12:00 AM
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I actually agree with Camhead. Management is a huge concern in most livestock setups. My point was more about how much it destroys the land in terms of space and vegetation. All those cows on all those hills here in California, acres and acres and acres are - at the very least - eroding the soil. That's the kind of thing I'm thinking about.
Oh yeah, one more thing: cows aren't actually RAISED in stockyards. They are brought there for the final stage of feeding and slaughter. It's called 'finishing.'
And you know, all this knowledge still doesn't bother me that much, I'm still a meat-eater, so I can't be TOTALLY sold on everything I'm saying.
[ This Message was edited by: maculated on 2002-04-08 17:06 ]
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roclymber
Apr 9, 2002, 6:52 AM
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Alright, has the head honcho of this post (it being my idea.) I personally dun care about the environmental aspect of being a vegetarian. I'm still a firm believer in eating red meat, just now, I dun eat it.
Jay, i think you said this, but I know that I can get all the protein out of normal vegetables people eat everyday. I dun think the rest of the world knows this. By eating a nice variety of plants, a person will consume the proportional amount of protein that they need. As I said, there isnt anything that red meat has someone cant eat a plant and get the same thing.
But I still have to eat fish. Not so much of a have to eat scenario, but I love fish. Plus too, it is VERY good for you. A lot of fish are lean (They dun stand still for 20 hours a day like cattle, and pigs ) and they taste yummy in my tummy.
So while im prolly not an official vegetarian, im pretty close. And if people could start answering this question. Are they any downsides to this if someone eats a variety of stuff. Some of you have mentioned weight gain becuz lack of eating good foods, but is there anything else?
thx
matt
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mountainrat
Apr 9, 2002, 11:28 AM
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Just the protien and calcium are concerns for me- but I'm not a very good vegan, either. Sesame seeds and tofu are great sources of the above mentioned concerns. My personal experience is that red meat makes me feel sluggish and slow, and dairy DOES stiffen my joints. Kudos to Maculated for several very well informed and adroitly explained posts.
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rockwomyn
Apr 9, 2002, 1:19 PM
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You CAN have a completely, healthy meat free or even dairy free diet. If you are really serious about it do some research don't just eat carrots and apples and wonder why you look and feel like crap. There are tons are veggies alternative these days to go veg and feel good. Check out your local co-op for meat alternatives and buy lots of fresh veggies & fruits. I was a vegetarian for about 5 years and now will eat fish, some poultry and cheese once in a while. There are numerous protein powders made from soy or even just veggies that you can toss in a blender with a soy milk and frozen banana (my fave)and get carbs, protein and a smigde of fat for a fast meal. Just open your eyes, be creative and watch out for too much fat, a vegatarian downfall.....Cheese! So to all you negative people who have been programmed into thinking you have to eat meat, you are sadly mistaken. I also am athletic aside from climbing....I lift weights 5 days a week along with running and cycling 5+ plus times a week. I feel great and I am mostly meat free. We all have the ability to choice....just choice wisely!!!!
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tavs
Apr 9, 2002, 7:50 PM
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Vegan for just over five years, veggie for six months before that (and, for the record, vegetarian does indeed mean no fish): I've found no downsides and many upsides. But as others have noted, you need to really think about your diet (then again, so should all people). As a fish, dairy and egg eater, you should have very few problem or concerns really. Many of the things vegetarians or vegans have to be concerned with (calcium, iron, B12), you are still getting from your regular diet, though I agree with Jay that a multi-vitamin is a good idea for everyone. I lost some weight in the first year (it was there to be lost, and most of it came from cutting out fatty meat, dairy/ice cream, cakes/cookies/etc), but otherwise my weight's been stable since then at what I consider to be pretty close to my ideal. I climb hard, I've lifted/run/played sports, backpacked a lot--all as a vegan, all without being limited by being vegan. So I can't see any reason why you cutting out red meat and poultry would be much of an issue.
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toprope_media
Apr 20, 2002, 4:11 AM
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I have been a vegan for 12 years and highly recommend it if you feel it is right for you. Some people can't pull it off. There are so many foods out there without animal content, there is sooooo much variety. 12 years ago, it sucked. Couldn't find food anywhere. I remember going to Cape Cod and being forced to eat cold beans from the can. Now, with the help of the internet, you can reduce the problems with travel.
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tyger
May 3, 2002, 1:42 PM
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Just wishing to clarify:
Vegan: No animal flesh, or any product gain from an animal, regardless of how.
Vegetarian: No animal flesh. Many argue as to whether fish is breaking the "rules" or not.
I am a lifelong vege (parents were hippies). Apart from the decent bit of tuna I am 100% vegetarian (sod the rules!).
I suffer no mineral or vitamin deficiencies and am in a very high... no wait, decent state of fitness. I fully recommend it as a way of living. Make sure it is vege - tarian ie: you have to eat those vegetables.
For any endurance activity a vegetarian lifestyle is a good one. A bit of yoga and lots of water too and you'll feel a million bucks.
Tyger.
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hunter
May 6, 2002, 10:26 PM
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I'm a Proud member of PETA.
That's People Eating Tasty Animals.
Seriously though, I have no problems with folks who don't care for meat as long as they don't have a problem with me eating it. As far as the health issues go I think it's been pretty well shown that Veggie's can be perfectly healthy as long as they are super concious of their diet.
When I get hungry I go out and get my supper from the woods... and it ain't gonna be mushrooms
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jt512
May 7, 2002, 2:15 AM
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If anything, Hunter, vegetarians are healthier, and they don't have to be "super careful" about their diet.
-Jay (a nutrition research scientist)
[ This Message was edited by: jt512 on 2002-05-06 19:16 ]
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jt512
May 7, 2002, 3:06 AM
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Actually, a "vegan" + fish diet might be the best of both worlds.
-Jay
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hunter
May 7, 2002, 3:07 PM
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JT512,
Ok, I'll take your word for it seeing as how it's in your area of expertise.
Still, I'll let the deer & rabbits eat the veggies, then I'll eat them. Same thing, no?
Hunter
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iclimbtoo
May 7, 2002, 3:13 PM
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I say to have any vegitarian try a filet mignon. if that doesn't switch them to normal, then I don't know what will!
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sharmagod
May 7, 2002, 3:16 PM
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I cant go into the specifics of why but it is definetly a good thing.
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boretribe
May 7, 2002, 3:39 PM
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I've been a vegetarian for 2.5 years (no mammals for 17+) and feel great. I quit eating meat for ethical reasons and don't miss it at all (except maybe fish).
Good, healthy and tasty vegetarian protein sources are becoming easier easier to get each year so I don't find getting a well balanced diet to be difficult at all. It's also cheaper than a meat based diet.
If it's for health reasons only, I don't really see a reason to quit eating meat outright. As JT512 said fish + vegan is probably best.
The main dietary problem I see a lot of vegetarians get into is too much cheese and butter. This kind of defeats the purpose of not eating meat for health reasons.
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jt512
May 7, 2002, 5:07 PM
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Quote:
Still, I'll let the deer & rabbits eat the veggies, then I'll eat them. Same thing, no?
No. Fruits and vegetables are rich in antioxidants that are protective against heart disease and cancer. Animal foods are not.
Mom was right. Eat your veggies.
-Jay
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mikedano
May 7, 2002, 5:26 PM
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I once met a woman who was a vegan and had never seen Star Wars.
What kind of a life is that?
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hunter
May 7, 2002, 5:46 PM
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JT512,
Mom used to say "You are what you eat." At which time I was known to have said "Well I sure don't want to be a dang fruit or vegitable!"
Kidding aside, a well balanced diet consisting of natural foods works for me. I prefer to know where my food came from and what it ate or was fertilized with. I remain very suspicious of most commercial products. Take commercially raised chickens for example: I've seen a lot of natually raised chickens in my day and not one of them had yellow skin, was fat, or was "Fryer size" in 6 weeks. Makes one wonder just what they feed them things.
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clanalbania
May 7, 2002, 6:49 PM
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I have been a lacto-ove vegetarian since birth. At age 15 I became a vegan (It means nothing that comes from animals, only plants, as noted by a couple of people above). I am not strict vegan though. When I am not at home, or am in the mountains I do eat cheese or yogurt periodically. But for the most part I am vegan.
I have never noticed any lack of strength and I am active, climbing, mountaineering, cycling and back-country skiing. I ate this diet as a teenager and was cycling 100 to 200 miles a week.
The benefits. Ex-meat eaters tell me they have never felt so good after switching. There is a huge decline in the typical American disease processes, heart disease, diabetes, cancer, etc.
Finally there is no real concern for proteins as long as one is eating a diet that doesnt' boor you for its lack of variety. Lentils and rice cooked together make a complete protein for example, satisfying all the bodies needs for that day. The only issue that has been raised periodically is the B12 issue. Eat a yogurt once in awhile though and it is no problem.
You got to do this though only if you want to, otherwise it won't stick.
ClanAlbania
[ This Message was edited by: clanalbania on 2002-05-07 11:52 ]
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sugarbaby
May 7, 2002, 6:57 PM
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i've been a vegetarian for almost 8 years. "ovo-lacto" as they say. i eat eggs and dairy, and no meat at all.
if you know what you're doing, you won't be sickly, or thinner because of it, i'm healthier now than i was when i ate meat.
but if you're smart about it, it's pretty easy, and a very healthy lifestyle
it's great for some people, some hate it
its up to you
jenna
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iclimbtoo
May 7, 2002, 7:29 PM
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No, Star Wars!!!??? Deprived I tell you, deprived...
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sugarbaby
May 7, 2002, 8:08 PM
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say WHAT??
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jt512
May 17, 2002, 4:31 PM
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Quote:
i've found that the amount of protein or the protein sources used to compensate for the complex proteins you get from meats, are
much higher in carbs...
That much is true.
Quote:...which conflicts with your body's ability to breakdown/absorb the types of protiens you actually need.
That is false.
Quote:
you can eat a brick of tofu or you can have a an 8 oz piece of red meat. your body will
have an easier time extracting the proteins from the meat without all the carbs getting in the way. you'll stay trimmer too.
And that is just bullshit.
-Jay
[ This Message was edited by: jt512 on 2002-05-17 09:32 ]
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fiend
May 17, 2002, 4:51 PM
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I had a friend who was vegan for several years.
He got into mountaineering.
He eats meat now.
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talons05
May 17, 2002, 5:07 PM
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Humans are not genetically disposed to subsist purely on vegetable and other "non-meat" matter. Just look at your teeth - that is, if they haven't rotted out yet... Also, why is it "morally wrong" to eat meat? Because it was once a living thing? How is that different from eating vegetables? Weren't they once alive as well?
A.W.
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