|
signmanzdk
Aug 18, 2005, 11:24 PM
Post #301 of 417
(85570 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Jul 6, 2005
Posts: 29
|
i misunderstood the original statement then. I thought you were saying by eating fruit, then you wouldn't have room to eat other things that are more beneficial for you.
|
|
|
|
|
jt512
Aug 18, 2005, 11:34 PM
Post #302 of 417
(85577 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Apr 12, 2001
Posts: 21904
|
In reply to: i misunderstood the original statement then. I thought you were saying by eating fruit, then you wouldn't have room to eat other things that are more beneficial for you.
It's not a matter of "room," it's a matter of calories. If you need to restrict your total caloric intake to say 1700 kcal/day to lose weight, and you consume 500 of those calories as fruit, then it will be difficult to meet the protein requirement of the diet.
-Jay
|
|
|
|
|
alex_08
Aug 18, 2005, 11:51 PM
Post #303 of 417
(85577 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Jul 27, 2005
Posts: 15
|
i have been doing it all wrong for a long time before when i knew i was going to go on a climbing trip i would go on a crash diet to lose that weight fast and then i would gain all of that weight back very quickly. I'm most definitely going to try this asap
|
|
|
|
|
jeshimon
Sep 7, 2005, 3:02 AM
Post #304 of 417
(85577 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Mar 11, 2005
Posts: 13
|
Some one told me that endurance athletes such as marathon runners get a "kick" late in the race because their bodies run out of consumed carbs and start burning stored fats. Thus, burning fats gives more energy because fats are denser that carbs. Is there are truth to any of this??? :?:
|
|
|
|
|
mcgivney_nh
Oct 19, 2005, 10:23 AM
Post #305 of 417
(85577 views)
Shortcut
Registered: May 28, 2005
Posts: 421
|
keep a journal of all of the food that you eat, everyday. When you look back on it you can see how much you really consume (its more than you think)
-Sean
---hope this hasn't been posted before, no time to read 18 pages of posts.
|
|
|
|
|
montafoner
Oct 19, 2005, 12:29 PM
Post #306 of 417
(85577 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Apr 5, 2004
Posts: 143
|
How about dating a girl for five years with plans of marriage, then screwing things up and being left with nothing :cry: . That's how I lost 10 lbs in two weeks; I was an emotional wreak and lost my apetite (and strength). :cry:
|
|
|
|
|
jcshaggy
Oct 19, 2005, 12:45 PM
Post #307 of 417
(85577 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Jun 4, 2004
Posts: 340
|
Visit a Third World country and get dysentry :wink:
|
|
|
|
|
littlefingers
Oct 19, 2005, 2:20 PM
Post #308 of 417
(85577 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Aug 9, 2005
Posts: 89
|
From my personal experience and observation, I think that *generally* people put WAY too much emphasis on their weight when trying to improve climbing. I'm guilty of this too. Surprisingly, the strongest women climbers I know have a huge variety of shapes- some slender, some right out stocky, short and tall. Some are paranoid about their weight—(not even indulging in dressing on a salad), and others seem not to care that they don't have the waif-thin-climber stereo-type, (as they eat twinkies for a sugar rush between burns at a comp.) Something more consistent with their abilities abilities than their weight, is their focus and determination put into the climbing itself.
I've known a greater number of climbers who put more energy into controlling their weight than into climbing- and that definitely doesn't help their climbing ability! I just want to point out these observations, as I think that in any 'sport' it's too easy to get caught up in an "ideal" weight. I used to run competitively, and found this to be true with running too. From personal experience, I think I would have been happiest and most successful in my athletic goals to forget my weight, try to be healthy, and just focus on my goals/having fun/trying to push myself.
just for the books- the only girl on my running team who ran a sub 5 minute mile consistantly, happened to be less than 5' tall and definitely not a waif. Also with climbing- I know several women of similar height and build sending 5.13.
even though I see these opinions elsewhere- I think they're important to post just because of how over-paranoid people get abut the subject of weight... hope I'm not beating a dead horse into the ground.
cheers!
|
|
|
|
|
sweetchuck
Oct 26, 2005, 3:41 PM
Post #309 of 417
(85577 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Aug 18, 2005
Posts: 151
|
Whew, I read this entire thread, and I found it inspiring and very informative. Back in December I was weighing in at 188 (I'm 5'9") and having trouble getting into my pants. I started taking this "Bootcamp" class at the YMCA for 2 mornings a week, and eating less. Now I weigh 165, and I am stronger, but still have some flubber to get rid of. I know it's not the "right" way, but here's how I did it: I just plain wouldn't eat until dinner, or eat very little. I know you are supposed to eat little meals often, and not a big dinner, but here's my situation: My girlfriend is super skinny, and so she is kinda trying to gain weight. I can't know in the morning if we are going to go out to eat, or have a heavy dinner or whatever, what I can do in the morning is save my daily calories for the evening when I can eat whatever I like, not be a stick in the mud, and still lose weight. On the weekends I lower my guard and usually eat too much so Monday and Tuesday I dig out of the hole. Hardly ideal, I know, but is it unhealthy, or just problematic because I don't feel full during the day (which I don't mind)? The easiest time for me to eat less is at work since there is no food here.
I am a vegetarian, but I eat eggs and dairy. I have been trying to increase my climbing specific strength and it seems to be going well. So after reading this thread I have started having a protein shake in the morning. I have also been trying to be more careful on the weekend so I can move along quicker.
I try to lowball all my caloric estimates so I don't fool myself. I assume I burn 2,000 calories a day. I try to eat 1500 max on week days, 1000 minimum. I read labels, but when I don't know how many calories are in something I try to overestimate. I count my 1 hour bootcamp class as 300 calories, and a 1 hour walk as 200. Seems to be working for me. I just wonder if there is a problem with not eating much until the evening, or is it just a matter of comfort and not feeling hungry. I don't want to be a food scientist, so I just try to think of it as a matter of calories in-calories out and work from that end. I'm just going to do this for 6 more months or so until I get where I want to be and then I will focus more on strength, and eating the things that will help with that. I eat what I like, but it is generally healthy, but vegetarian. I just wanted to put my $0.02 in, but any comments would be welcome. Thanks for the informative thread, the fruits of which include a nasty protein shake a day!
|
|
|
|
|
jt512
Oct 26, 2005, 4:14 PM
Post #310 of 417
(85577 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Apr 12, 2001
Posts: 21904
|
In reply to: I am a vegetarian, but I eat eggs and dairy.
Elimitating cheese from your diet and switching to fat-free milk will instantly lower your intake of total calories and saturated fat, and will do wonders for your cholesterol levels, too.
In reply to: I have been trying to increase my climbing specific strength and it seems to be going well. So after reading this thread I have started having a protein shake in the morning...I try to lowball all my caloric estimates so I don't fool myself. I assume I burn 2,000 calories a day. I try to eat 1500 max on week days, 1000 minimum.
If you can do that without constantly feeling hungry and thinking about food, then fine; if not, then the biological pressure not to starve will be likely to eventually win out, and you will find it almost impossible not to start overeating. In the long-run, you might be better off by targeting caloric intake a little higher, say, 1700 kcal/day.
In reply to: I read labels, but when I don't know how many calories are in something I try to overestimate.
You can look up almost any food in the world in the searchable USDA Nutrient Database:
http://www.nal.usda.gov/fnic/foodcomp/search/
In reply to: I just wonder if there is a problem with not eating much until the evening...
Yes, there is a problem. Your body needs to maintain appropriate blood glucose levels. After a typical period of overnight fasting, your supply of stored glucose in the liver, which your body draws upon to maintain blood glucose between meals, is nearly depleted, and your body has to turn to elsewhere for a source of glucose. That source is your muscles. So, during the additional 10 hours between the time you wake up and finally have a meal at dinnertime, your body is breaking down muscle protein and converting it to glucose. Add to this the fact that, when you are on a low-calorie diet, your body is breaking down more muscle protein than usual anyway, and you can see that too much of your weight loss is going to come from muscle. You have taken a good step toward fixing this problem by drinking a protein shake in the morning, but you should go further: you should consume some carbohydrate in the morning with your protein shake. Your body will then burn the carbohydrate in the shake and use the protein to rebuild muscle. If you blend a piece of fruit or two in with your protein shake, you'll not only satisfy your body's carbohydrate requirements, you'll also make the shake more palatable.
You should probably have a small midday meal as well: either another fruit-protein shake, or an "energy" bar. The latter might not be as healthy, but it is convenient, and you know exactly how many calories, how much protein, and how much carbohydrate it contains.
-Jay
|
|
|
|
|
sweetchuck
Oct 26, 2005, 6:33 PM
Post #311 of 417
(85577 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Aug 18, 2005
Posts: 151
|
Hi Jay, thanks for the sound advice. I'll start eating an apple or pear with my shake (don't have a blender here at work so I can't make a smoothie). So, fruit and another shake for lunch. Another shake for lunch because I probably still need more protein? I have no idea how much protein I get because I just got keyed into it's importance reading this thread.
As for the cheese, forget it! I love cheese! Case closed.
I know you didn't sign up to be RC.com's free nutrition consultant, but I sure do appreciate your informed opinion. Thanks again.
sc
|
|
|
|
|
jt512
Oct 26, 2005, 8:13 PM
Post #312 of 417
(85577 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Apr 12, 2001
Posts: 21904
|
In reply to: Another shake for lunch because I probably still need more protein?
Two reasons: The first is, with calorie intake down around 1000 - 1500 kcal/day, your body is going to be breaking down a lot of muscle, so you will need very high intakes of both protein and carbohydrate. (That implies you'll need to minimize your fat intake.) The second reason is timing. Just having a protein shake and a piece of fruit in the morning will not provide enough protein and carbohydrate to suppress muscle protein breakdown all day long, so you should eat something midday.
-Jay
|
|
|
|
|
mped
Nov 8, 2005, 6:22 AM
Post #313 of 417
(85577 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Jan 30, 2004
Posts: 62
|
When I went vegetarian I lost 25lbs in a month. 6' tall. From 175lbs to 150lbs. My diet was P/J sandwiches, ceral, mashed potatoes, pickles, etc. As you can guess, not too healthy. But I was a very misinformed veggy. Eventually I tried new stuff and have worked my way to the right amount of protein, etc, etc. Chili, Soy Meats, etc..
The main issue here is finding fat. I'm almost vegan and I could probably eat six meals a day. Calories don't matter much here. 2000-5000. Whatever it takes.
|
|
|
|
|
ledavis23
Nov 22, 2005, 10:11 PM
Post #314 of 417
(85577 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Sep 9, 2005
Posts: 108
|
Jay,
I'm a 23 year-old female consuming a low-fat diet (except for the occasional tiny peice of cake or 1/2 serving of chocolate). I climb twice a week and run twice a week. I know I need to to both one more time per week, but that's not the issue. I'm 5'5" 130lbs. I figure I have about 10 pounds in the hips/thighs that I could get rid of. I've heard that this is the last area that women typically lose weight. Do you know of any specific things I could do to trim that last bit of weight?
|
|
|
|
|
jt512
Nov 22, 2005, 10:16 PM
Post #315 of 417
(85577 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Apr 12, 2001
Posts: 21904
|
In reply to: Jay, I'm a 23 year-old female consuming a low-fat diet (except for the occasional tiny peice of cake or 1/2 serving of chocolate). I climb twice a week and run twice a week. I know I need to to both one more time per week, but that's not the issue. I'm 5'5" 130lbs. I figure I have about 10 pounds in the hips/thighs that I could get rid of. I've heard that this is the last area that women typically lose weight. Do you know of any specific things I could do to trim that last bit of weight?
Well, there's really no easy way, except by exercising more and/or eating less. It all comes down to burning more calories than you consume. Not only could you increase your aerobic exercise sessions to 3 days a week, you could work up to 6 days a week. If you are comfortable with a low-fat diet, then my advice in the opening post should work well for you.
Jay
|
|
|
|
|
lordshockspeare
Nov 27, 2005, 10:14 PM
Post #316 of 417
(85577 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Aug 25, 2004
Posts: 116
|
I´m sure its been mensioned many times in this thread but one important thing to realize is that eating an extrmely low-fat diet really isn´t all that healthy. Fat is needed for so many processes and restricting fat intake hardly helps the body lose more fat. In fact increasing your fat intake has been proven to help the body burn more fat. The fats of course you should increase are the so called "good fats" like fish, flax, sesame, peanut, cocunut, olive...
I for one love my steak and eggs :D !
Another thing to consider is not dropping your calories too much in a diet because then your body goes into starvation mode and will horde more fat rather then burn it. (although I don´t believe this all that much, its what they say in nutrition textbooks)
Just consistent excercise always seems to be the best bet as far as burning fat.
|
|
|
|
|
jt512
Nov 27, 2005, 10:44 PM
Post #317 of 417
(85577 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Apr 12, 2001
Posts: 21904
|
In reply to: I´m sure its been mensioned many times in this thread but one important thing to realize is that eating an extrmely low-fat diet really isn´t all that healthy. Fat is needed for so many processes and restricting fat intake hardly helps the body lose more fat. In fact increasing your fat intake has been proven to help the body burn more fat. The fats of course you should increase are the so called "good fats" like fish, flax, sesame, peanut, cocunut, olive... I for one love my steak and eggs :D !
Nope, it hasn't been mentioned previously. You're the first one. The rest of us have been trying to stick with stuff that's really true.
Jay
|
|
|
|
|
greenketch
Nov 27, 2005, 11:03 PM
Post #318 of 417
(85577 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Jan 12, 2005
Posts: 501
|
Lordshockspere, while my first inclanation is to agree with you I really can't. I had a challenge with cancer some years back. The end result is that I am doing fine but no longer have the parts of the body to properly digest fat. Because they cause problems when they are passed without being digested I must eat a very restricted fat diet as well. I must agree that fats are required for many things. They also are very high in calories and so they contribute highly to energy output. However, I eat candies and the body does a perfectly good job of making it's own fat from excess carbs.
Watching your intake and controling it is the best approach. Eating a proper balance of fats, proteins, and carbs is a part. Eating enough food at the right time of day is another. Maintaing a routine with sufficient cardio routine is also critical in the overall picture. As the saying goes it gets back to "All things in moderation"
|
|
|
|
|
lordshockspeare
Nov 29, 2005, 8:14 PM
Post #319 of 417
(85577 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Aug 25, 2004
Posts: 116
|
Allright I´m not just talking there is some science and proof to it...
from the site; http://www.westonaprice.org/splash_2.htm
has some interesting atricles, take whatyou want from it.
"Perhaps the best way to lose unwanted weight (excess weight in the form of fat, that is) is to change the type of fat in the diet to the type of fat found in the coconut. New research from McGill University in Canada has shown that consuming medium-chain triglycerides (C8, C10, C12, and C14), the type found in coconut oil, leads to an increase of endogenous oxidation of long-chain saturated fatty acids. They note that this "suggests a role for medium chain triglyceride fats [such as coconut oil] in body weight control over the long term."8
This study should be of much concern to the male population out there:
All though only inadvertly realtes to fat loss.
from www.pubmed.com:
"The possible effect of dietary fat content and the ratio of polyunsaturated to saturated fatty acids (P/S-ratio) on serum sex hormones was studied in 30 healthy male volunteers. The customary diet of the subjects, which supplied 40% of energy as fat (mainly from animal sources, P/S-ratio 0.15) was replaced for a 6 weeks period by a practically isocaloric experimental diet containing significantly less fat (25% of energy) with a higher P/S-ratio (1.22) and other environmental factors were stabilized. Serum testosterone and 4-androstenedione decreased from 22.7 +/- 1.1 nmol/l to 19.3 +/- 1.2 nmol/l, (SEM, P less than 0.001) and from 4.6 +/- 0.2 nmol/l to 4.3 +/- 0.2 nmol/l (SEM, P less than 0.01), respectively. These changes were paralleled by a reduction in serum free (non-protein bound) testosterone (P less than 0.01) suggesting a possible change in biological activity. During the low fat period a significant negative correlation between serum prolactin and androgens was observed. All the changes in androgen levels were reversible. With the exception of a small but non-significant decrease in serum estradiol-17 beta, the other hormone parameters were practically unaffected by the dietary manipulation. Our results indicate that in men a decrease in dietary fat content and an increase in the degree of unsaturation of fatty acids reduces the serum concentrations of androstenedione, testosterone and free testosterone. The mechanism and importance of this phenomenon is discussed in the light of epidemiological and experimental data."
|
|
|
|
|
jt512
Nov 29, 2005, 8:49 PM
Post #320 of 417
(85577 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Apr 12, 2001
Posts: 21904
|
In reply to: Allright I´m not just talking there is some science and proof to it... from the site; http://www.westonaprice.org/splash_2.htm
Quack, quack.
Jay
|
|
|
|
|
stvsmth
Nov 29, 2005, 9:38 PM
Post #321 of 417
(85577 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Sep 15, 2005
Posts: 2
|
Heh heh,
Literally a quack according to Quack Watch ... or, at least a "Promoter of Questionable Method" ... Quack Watch is a handy tool for spotting bogus science, worth the bookmark.
Thanks to Jay for the detailed comments ...
|
|
|
|
|
gramiras
Jan 3, 2006, 5:07 AM
Post #322 of 417
(85577 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Jan 1, 2006
Posts: 10
|
I'm 6' 1" and eat 2,700 calories per day. 280 grams of that are carbohydrates in the form of brown rice, the rest is made up of chicken breasts and egg white protein shakes. Maybe a table spoon of flax oil in the rice every now and then. I walk ( I repeat...WALK) to reduce body fat which is currently 5.6%. Any lower/leaner strength is dramatically reduced and you start to have mental conditioning problems..OCD and things like that. If I drop the carbs below 150 grams, you can expect that I will be going manic within a couple of days, so 280-300 works better. I can bench 315 twice on my own (doesn't mean shit for climbing) but does represent a significant compromise from being fatter and stronger. I'm sure someone can tell you the ideal body composition for someone of your frame and fitness goals, but if I were you I'd stick with the basics...solid food, ie rice and chicken and only supplement egg white protein after a good workout.
|
|
|
|
|
gramiras
Jan 3, 2006, 5:11 AM
Post #323 of 417
(85577 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Jan 1, 2006
Posts: 10
|
No need for a biology/science lesson. Eat real food, train and drink water when your thirsty.
PS. Cholesterol is GOOD, helps to produce testosterone which is really GOOD.
|
|
|
|
|
ajkclay
Jan 3, 2006, 6:54 AM
Post #324 of 417
(85577 views)
Shortcut
Registered: May 9, 2002
Posts: 1567
|
In reply to: No need for a biology/science lesson. Eat real food, train and drink water when your thirsty. PS. Cholesterol is GOOD, helps to produce testosterone which is really GOOD.
Well, I'm sold :shock:
Adam
I just read your previous post about developing OCD with bodyfat lower than 5.6%... how to put this nicely? hmmm, ah I know:
BULLSHIT!
|
|
|
|
|
gramiras
Jan 3, 2006, 8:24 AM
Post #325 of 417
(85577 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Jan 1, 2006
Posts: 10
|
I don't think it really has to do with the % of BF that causes abnormalities in brain function, rather the lack of glucose (blood sugar) from the reduced carobohydrates that determines your mental state. Unfortunately, the only REAL way (that I have done) to lose the lbs is to drop the carbs, so you have to be a aware of this side effect and plan for it, such as dropping the carbs to 150 or possibly lower for only one to two days at a time while keeping your cardio high (walking twice a day). Note that reducing carbs should be offset with an increase in protein and fat (monounsaturated, like flax or safflower oil) to maintain your 2700 calorie per day regime. This amount of calories will sustain your lean tissue and get you through your workouts while the walking will cause the deficit needed for the fat loss. Expect a three to four pound loss in the first seven to eight days, then tapering off to one and a half to two pounds of fat loss per week.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
