|
areyoumydude
Feb 2, 2007, 8:43 PM
Post #1 of 128
(6178 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Dec 28, 2003
Posts: 1971
|
We just had two highlines, climbing and rigging gear stolen just north of Moab, UT. 4" ss double pulleys, multiple span sets, shackles, and a grip hoist(very expensive), plus other assorted gear. If anyone has any info or sees any of this stuff for sale on the interweb please contact me at larry@notforclimbing.com or just pm me.
Thanks, Larry 
(This post was edited by areyoumydude on Feb 2, 2007, 8:45 PM)
|
|
|
|
|
billcoe_
Feb 2, 2007, 9:09 PM
Post #2 of 128
(6126 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Jun 30, 2002
Posts: 4694
|
I hope they get caught, paid back, and you get your gear back.
damn that sucks.
|
|
|
|
|
roy_hinkley_jr
Feb 2, 2007, 9:10 PM
Post #3 of 128
(6124 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Sep 8, 2005
Posts: 652
|
Kudos to whoever it was that cleaned up the abandoned trash! Hopefully it was disposed of properly. Larry, unless that was private land (doubtful), you got what you deserved...don't litter!
|
|
|
|
|
mrpotter
Feb 2, 2007, 9:30 PM
Post #4 of 128
(6086 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Dec 31, 2005
Posts: 123
|
|
|
|
|
|
chanceboarder
Feb 2, 2007, 9:36 PM
Post #5 of 128
(6067 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Oct 6, 2003
Posts: 1348
|
I think a trap needs to be set to catch the evil doers! Rig another line and hide out in the bushes or behind some rocks or something and catch them in the act, then beat the living crap out of them...errr I mean turn them over to the cops for theft
Jason
|
|
|
|
|
roy_hinkley_jr
Feb 2, 2007, 9:45 PM
Post #6 of 128
(6046 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Sep 8, 2005
Posts: 652
|
mrpotter wrote: I hope that was sarcastic
Nope. Abandoned gear on public land is trash. Period. Highlines are particularly obnoxious...a visual blight visible from far away. Somebody did the right thing and cleaned it up.
|
|
|
|
|
d1ll1gaf
Feb 2, 2007, 10:06 PM
Post #7 of 128
(6026 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Mar 25, 2004
Posts: 119
|
roy_hinkley_jr wrote: mrpotter wrote: I hope that was sarcastic Nope. Abandoned gear on public land is trash. Period. Highlines are particularly obnoxious...a visual blight visible from far away. Somebody did the right thing and cleaned it up.
So next time you go climbing and abandon your car in the parking lot, I am free to come along and clean it up by removing it?
|
|
|
|
|
matttt
Feb 2, 2007, 10:12 PM
Post #8 of 128
(6020 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Jul 14, 2006
Posts: 84
|
So next time you go climbing and abandon your car in the parking lot, I am free to come along and clean it up by removing it?
brilliant logic....
|
|
|
|
|
doogle
Feb 2, 2007, 10:20 PM
Post #9 of 128
(6002 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Jun 21, 2005
Posts: 89
|
d1ll1gaf wrote: roy_hinkley_jr wrote: mrpotter wrote: I hope that was sarcastic Nope. Abandoned gear on public land is trash. Period. Highlines are particularly obnoxious...a visual blight visible from far away. Somebody did the right thing and cleaned it up. So next time you go climbing and abandon your car in the parking lot, I am free to come along and clean it up by removing it?
Not quite the same thing, is it.
If he had set up his slackline in a "slackline park", then maybe you'd have a point.
|
|
|
|
|
alexmac
Feb 2, 2007, 10:23 PM
Post #10 of 128
(5996 views)
Shortcut
Registered: May 23, 2005
Posts: 550
|
So next time you go climbing and abandon your car in the parking lot, I am free to come along and clean it up by removing it?
brilliant logic....
Not at all the same thing, in fact most would see it as "booty" and not thief, myself I'd post a note some place about having the gear; not that I'd clean it.
|
|
|
|
|
112
Feb 2, 2007, 10:24 PM
Post #11 of 128
(5991 views)
Shortcut
Registered: May 15, 2004
Posts: 432
|
And its not really trash if the salvage value is more than the cost of the clean-up effort.
Sounds bunk to me.
|
|
|
|
|
shimanilami
Feb 2, 2007, 10:43 PM
Post #12 of 128
(5949 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Jul 24, 2006
Posts: 2043
|
112 wrote: And its not really trash if the salvage value is more than the cost of the clean-up effort.
WTF????
In my opinion, he left a bunch of trash out there and some dude cleaned up after him. I'd buy that guy a beer if I could.
Empaque su basura.
|
|
|
|
|
112
Feb 2, 2007, 10:52 PM
Post #13 of 128
(5927 views)
Shortcut
Registered: May 15, 2004
Posts: 432
|
You may know more about the specifics here.
But it still sounds bunk to me.
(This post was edited by 112 on Feb 2, 2007, 10:53 PM)
|
|
|
|
|
metalhead
Feb 2, 2007, 10:53 PM
Post #14 of 128
(5922 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Jul 20, 2006
Posts: 108
|
In reply to: WTF???? In my opinion, he left a bunch of trash out there and some dude cleaned up after him. I'd buy that guy a beer if I could.
yeah right, i could see your point if it was up for more than a week but if its a work in progress i think its steeling
how would you feel if you had your draws up on a route and someone snaged em
|
|
|
|
|
mrpotter
Feb 2, 2007, 10:56 PM
Post #15 of 128
(5913 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Dec 31, 2005
Posts: 123
|
|
|
|
|
|
shimanilami
Feb 2, 2007, 11:02 PM
Post #16 of 128
(5902 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Jul 24, 2006
Posts: 2043
|
metalhead wrote: In reply to: WTF???? In my opinion, he left a bunch of trash out there and some dude cleaned up after him. I'd buy that guy a beer if I could. yeah right, i could see your point if it was up for more than a week but if its a work in progress i think its steeling how would you feel if you had your draws up on a route and someone snaged em
I'd feel I got what I deserved. Which is why I don't leave draws hanging on projects.
I was hanging out with Werner in the Valley last weekend and he said the Korean Team left $5000 worth of new cams and ropes on the N. American wall for a couple of months. He impounded it and is waiting with a fat littering ticket for those guys when they come back. That's justice if you ask me.
|
|
|
|
|
shimanilami
Feb 2, 2007, 11:03 PM
Post #17 of 128
(5898 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Jul 24, 2006
Posts: 2043
|
mrpotter wrote: If someone was worried about the visual effects of it, why couldnt they just take it down and leave all the gear there? Or at the very least, just leave a note where they could pick it up.
Is that what you do when you find booty on climbs?
|
|
|
|
|
mrpotter
Feb 2, 2007, 11:05 PM
Post #18 of 128
(5895 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Dec 31, 2005
Posts: 123
|
|
|
|
|
|
devils_advocate
Feb 2, 2007, 11:26 PM
Post #19 of 128
(5868 views)
Shortcut
Registered: May 18, 2006
Posts: 1823
|
yeah, booty gear, for the most part, isn't visually obnoxious from a distance.
|
|
|
|
|
limeydave
Feb 2, 2007, 11:49 PM
Post #20 of 128
(5833 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Nov 23, 2006
Posts: 2453
|
If you take something that isn't yours, without the intent to return it, you are a thieving scumbag.
If 'trash' or leaving stuff on lines offends you, call the powers who be to deal with it - that way people get their stuff back and a lecture on 'littering'.
Some people just aren't taught right and wrong - I blame the parents.
|
|
|
|
|
billcoe_
Feb 3, 2007, 12:00 AM
Post #21 of 128
(5813 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Jun 30, 2002
Posts: 4694
|
limeydave wrote: If you take something that isn't yours, without the intent to return it, you are a thieving scumbag. If 'trash' or leaving stuff on lines offends you, call the powers who be to deal with it - that way people get their stuff back and a lecture on 'littering'. Some people just aren't taught right and wrong - I blame the parents.
Thanks limey DAve:
BTW, you other jackasses: next time you leave a rucksack at the base of the climb and your stuff gets ripped, or you come back to find that your tent, along with the sleeping bag, stove and other things have been "removed as trash" by some dickhead, I hope you remember this discussion and perhaps change your attitudes.
Edited to add: what a couple of pricks you guys are. Shame on you.
(This post was edited by billcoe_ on Feb 3, 2007, 12:05 AM)
|
|
|
|
|
big_red
Feb 3, 2007, 1:43 AM
Post #22 of 128
(5761 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Dec 29, 2005
Posts: 109
|
Wow... I can't believe there are people here taking the side of the person who swiped the gear. I certainly hope you guys never have to deal with that.
|
|
|
|
|
Adk
Feb 3, 2007, 3:07 AM
Post #23 of 128
(5695 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Dec 2, 2006
Posts: 1085
|
Good luck catching these thieves.
Grand Larceny is a great reason to buy a trail cam to take pics of your gear should anyone come near it.
I hunt and I know many guys who place these out to catch treestand thieves in areas that have a history of getting hit. The photos that I have heard of always stick.
Good luck. I often wonder about ebay stuff.....was it stolen stuff ???
|
|
|
|
|
socalclimber
Feb 3, 2007, 2:05 PM
Post #24 of 128
(5624 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Nov 27, 2001
Posts: 2437
|
If it's on federal land, you might want to check with the land managers blm/nps/nfs rangers. Out here in Josh if you leave a high line up for more than 24 hours it very well can get confiscated.
|
|
|
|
|
bbirtle
Feb 3, 2007, 3:40 PM
Post #25 of 128
(5581 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Jan 28, 2007
Posts: 102
|
limeydave wrote: If you take something that isn't yours, without the intent to return it, you are a thieving scumbag. If 'trash' or leaving stuff on lines offends you, call the powers who be to deal with it - that way people get their stuff back and a lecture on 'littering'. Some people just aren't taught right and wrong - I blame the parents.
I agree completely and am astounded anybody would side with the thieves.
An odd piece of gear high on a route with no marks and no reasonable way to return it is the only case that strikes me as ethical to take something that isn't yours. All the rest is just plain theft.
|
|
|
|
|
joe
Feb 3, 2007, 4:14 PM
Post #26 of 128
(3682 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Jun 22, 2003
Posts: 897
|
it's time to put a jihad on these motherfucks.
|
|
|
|
|
kevinheiss
Feb 3, 2007, 10:11 PM
Post #27 of 128
(3622 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Apr 26, 2004
Posts: 272
|
THAT IS WHY YOU SHOULD LEAVE YOUR GEAR OVERNIGHT.
It sucks that your gear was taken but honestly you're asking for trouble by leave stuff outside. That also goes for people leaving quickdraws on a project route.
Also it would be really hard to charge them for theft since it was on public property. you would have to prove it is your gear which would be extremely hard to do
Kevin
|
|
|
|
|
drfelatio
Feb 4, 2007, 5:20 AM
Post #28 of 128
(3545 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Sep 16, 2004
Posts: 475
|
kevinheiss wrote: THAT IS WHY YOU SHOULD LEAVE YOUR GEAR OVERNIGHT.
I believe you meant "SHOULD NOT"
|
|
|
|
|
alexmac
Feb 4, 2007, 7:54 AM
Post #29 of 128
(3503 views)
Shortcut
Registered: May 23, 2005
Posts: 550
|
bbirtle wrote: limeydave wrote: If you take something that isn't yours, without the intent to return it, you are a thieving scumbag. If 'trash' or leaving stuff on lines offends you, call the powers who be to deal with it - that way people get their stuff back and a lecture on 'littering'. Some people just aren't taught right and wrong - I blame the parents. I agree completely and am astounded anybody would side with the thieves. An odd piece of gear high on a route with no marks and no reasonable way to return it is the only case that strikes me as ethical to take something that isn't yours. All the rest is just plain theft.
Not taking sides , but that sounds like logic of one murder is okay, 100 is not .
If we extend the logic to anything , its wrong to have booty at all period, as someone will always cross a line. The Tent and cleaning it cause its garbage is a good example :)
The world is not a good place, if you leave something out, your to blame. If I leave 20 bucks on my desk at work and a cleaner takes it, its my fault for tempting someone who makes min wage or less.
|
|
|
|
|
mattyp
Feb 4, 2007, 11:43 AM
Post #30 of 128
(3487 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Sep 5, 2003
Posts: 162
|
So who here believes in the "Leave No Trace" philosophy? Don't leave anything. It is simple.
|
|
|
|
|
billcoe_
Feb 4, 2007, 3:54 PM
Post #32 of 128
(3448 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Jun 30, 2002
Posts: 4694
|
alexmac wrote: The world is not a good place, if you leave something out, your to blame. If I leave 20 bucks on my desk at work and a cleaner takes it, its my fault for tempting someone who makes min wage or less.
I see. So you are saying that when you go to the crags expecting to do a bunch of routes one day, they are all 3 pitch routes. It is cold in the am so you are dressed warmly and head to the first route which is a finger crack that doesn't take gear larger than 1". You leave your coat, lunch, water and the double rack of big Camalots you need for the next route, in your backback at the base of that climb.
Some of you are saying that it is OK for anyone who sees that to steal it, and some of you are saying just expect someone to steal it, you should have left it in the car and hope it doesn't get stolen there.
It is wrong for anybody who dosen't own it to take it and thieves should be beat senseless if they are caught.
|
|
|
|
|
endercore
Feb 4, 2007, 4:04 PM
Post #33 of 128
(3442 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Apr 28, 2006
Posts: 100
|
i really don't understand how anyone can justify this type of behavior.
booty that was obviously lost, such as a quick-link attached to a bolt, is free game.
A completely rigged highline was obviously not lost, was clearly left with the intention with returning, and therefore removing it is obviously stealing.
to the op. I'm really sorry someone stole your line man. That sucks, I hope Karma bites the people that took in right in the ass and that you eventually get your gear back.
|
|
|
|
|
roy_hinkley_jr
Feb 4, 2007, 4:10 PM
Post #34 of 128
(3441 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Sep 8, 2005
Posts: 652
|
The only thing senseless is Billcoe's reply. What a moronic post. You really see no difference between stashing some gear where it's out of sight for a few hours and leaving highly visible ugliness out over night? Even quickdraws are much less obtrusive than a highline prominently strung across a gap. Do whatever you want on your own land. But you leave garbage like that on public property and it is the responsibility of all climbers to clean up your litter. Irresponsible people like Billcoe, and of course Dean What-A-Dick-Potter, are part of the reason climbers are losing access.
|
|
|
|
|
nextclimb
Feb 4, 2007, 4:14 PM
Post #35 of 128
(3436 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Oct 10, 2003
Posts: 23
|
The world is not a good place, if you leave something out, your to blame. If I leave 20 bucks on my desk at work and a cleaner takes it, its my fault for tempting someone who makes min wage or less.
Intrigued and not judging, I'd say the world is a good place but, just for perspective, give us examples of what you have stolen because someone tempted you. Also, would like to know you philosophy on the following:
1. Let's say you put the twenty in an unlocked drawer
2. How about a $1,000 in a locked file cabinet that a screwdriver could open?
3. A million in a trust fund?
|
|
|
|
|
alexmac
Feb 4, 2007, 4:29 PM
Post #36 of 128
(3429 views)
Shortcut
Registered: May 23, 2005
Posts: 550
|
nextclimb wrote: The world is not a good place, if you leave something out, your to blame. If I leave 20 bucks on my desk at work and a cleaner takes it, its my fault for tempting someone who makes min wage or less.
Intrigued and not judging, I'd say the world is a good place but, just for perspective, give us examples of what you have stolen because someone tempted you. Also, would like to know you philosophy on the following:
1. Let's say you put the twenty in an unlocked drawer
2. How about a $1,000 in a locked file cabinet that a screwdriver could open?
3. A million in a trust fund?
Well, Drawer and cleaner should not go, I would classify that as direct thief, were as money out in the open (wallet, walkman, etc)is the owners fault.
I have expereinced this in a former office where a new person to Canada did a great job, even left the 200 bucks in drawers but got tempted by accidental cash left on a desk.
I wonder if it was cleanign an eye sore or stealing gear; I guess without the actual "thief" speaking up we will never know.
|
|
|
|
|
styleboy
Feb 4, 2007, 9:12 PM
Post #38 of 128
(3357 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Nov 13, 2006
Posts: 107
|
It doesn't matter if you're tempted or not. Taking 20$ bucks off a desk is stealing. And I love how you stereotype 'minimum wage' workers. Not that it would be right, but I hope someone steals a bunch of your shit.
|
|
|
|
|
areyoumydude
Feb 4, 2007, 9:17 PM
Post #39 of 128
(3354 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Dec 28, 2003
Posts: 1971
|
This has happened to me before so I am not suprised. This gear was not abandoned. There is no climbing access issuses there because no one climbs there. It was in a place that is not a destination area. The view there is quite nice but it's not like there is a lack of nice views around here. I'm not sure what the motivation for doing this was. I just want the gear returned and if anybody that has any info to contact me.
Peace, Larry
|
|
|
|
|
alexmac
Feb 4, 2007, 10:36 PM
Post #40 of 128
(3323 views)
Shortcut
Registered: May 23, 2005
Posts: 550
|
styleboy wrote: It doesn't matter if you're tempted or not. Taking 20$ bucks off a desk is stealing. And I love how you stereotype 'minimum wage' workers. Not that it would be right, but I hope someone steals a bunch of your shit.
Oh well, if they do they get caught, simple. Guess your one of them minium wage workers.
If a person leaves stuff out be it cams, car keys, 20 bucks on a desk, cds on the car seat, wallet / purse / pack, well your just asking for it , if left unattended. Its a classic of the city, don't leave shit out and people won't take your shit.
My point being you leave it out, someone is going to take it. I myself leave people's stuff where it is unless its a blight on the landscape. In the blight case I remove whatever it is, pile it neatly to the side for the offender to pick up and move on.
|
|
|
|
|
AngusBeefheart
Feb 4, 2007, 10:53 PM
Post #41 of 128
(3304 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Nov 26, 2006
Posts: 68
|
jeez people,
you know what is trash and what is not trash. If you take something that is not yours that's stealing. If you take something that is actually garbage and then properly dispose of it, then you're cleaning up trash. If you have any doubts, then assume it's not trash.
don't be tool
|
|
|
|
|
nedsurf
Feb 4, 2007, 11:38 PM
Post #42 of 128
(3285 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Nov 9, 2004
Posts: 387
|
socalclimber wrote: If it's on federal land, you might want to check with the land managers blm/nps/nfs rangers. Out here in Josh if you leave a high line up for more than 24 hours it very well can get confiscated.
How long did you leave that stuff out there? Just north of Moab is Arches NP and a bunch of BLM land. Was it there?
There is a case called SIERRA CLUB v. MORTON, 405 U.S. 727 (1972) which established the scenery of a public area as something legally defendable. It was also over a recreational installation. Hikers and other public land users might not find you leaving your equipment out a good addition to the aesthetics of the area, especially if it was in Arches. I hope it is the Ranger who took it down and you recover your equipment with only a fine to pay rather than buying it all again. Check out the case; it is a significant landmark in environmental advocacy.
|
|
|
|
|
billcoe_
Feb 5, 2007, 3:41 AM
Post #43 of 128
(3258 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Jun 30, 2002
Posts: 4694
|
mattyp wrote: I don't think anyone is saying that it is ok.
Well heres one lowlife who thinks otherwise Matt:
roy_hinkley_jr wrote: Kudos to whoever it was that cleaned up the abandoned trash! Hopefully it was disposed of properly. Larry, unless that was private land (doubtful), you got what you deserved...don't litter!
I hope it rains on him hard and he can see the otherside of the fence. What a $%***X
|
|
|
|
|
lemon_boy
Feb 5, 2007, 3:55 AM
Post #44 of 128
(3241 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Mar 12, 2002
Posts: 287
|
so you're saying that it happened to you before, and you didn't learn your lesson the first time. now you're crying like a pu$$y about it happening again? try not to take this the wrong way, but you are a complete retard.
|
|
|
|
|
styleboy
Feb 5, 2007, 3:56 AM
Post #45 of 128
(3241 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Nov 13, 2006
Posts: 107
|
alexmac wrote: Oh well, if they do they get caught, simple. Guess your one of them minium wage workers. If a person leaves stuff out be it cams, car keys, 20 bucks on a desk, cds on the car seat, wallet / purse / pack, well your just asking for it , if left unattended. Its a classic of the city, don't leave shit out and people won't take your shit. My point being you leave it out, someone is going to take it. I myself leave people's stuff where it is unless its a blight on the landscape. In the blight case I remove whatever it is, pile it neatly to the side for the offender to pick up and move on.
Minimum wage worker, hardly. but If that was the case, I'd rather be a minimum wage worker than some ignorant jack ass. Like I said, I hope someone takes your 'trash' because you leave it at the base of a climb.
|
|
|
|
|
tyify
Feb 5, 2007, 4:11 AM
Post #46 of 128
(3226 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Apr 22, 2003
Posts: 905
|
Larry which line was it set up on? Birthday gap? Dog hole? I have personally slacked with Larry (areyoumydude) and I will say that he is a very enviromently and socially concious. I would ask if the park rangers had taken them down...
|
|
|
|
|
alexmac
Feb 5, 2007, 4:43 AM
Post #47 of 128
(3205 views)
Shortcut
Registered: May 23, 2005
Posts: 550
|
styleboy wrote: alexmac wrote: Oh well, if they do they get caught, simple. Guess your one of them minium wage workers. If a person leaves stuff out be it cams, car keys, 20 bucks on a desk, cds on the car seat, wallet / purse / pack, well your just asking for it , if left unattended. Its a classic of the city, don't leave shit out and people won't take your shit. My point being you leave it out, someone is going to take it. I myself leave people's stuff where it is unless its a blight on the landscape. In the blight case I remove whatever it is, pile it neatly to the side for the offender to pick up and move on. Minimum wage worker, hardly. but If that was the case, I'd rather be a minimum wage worker than some ignorant jack ass. Like I said, I hope someone takes your 'trash' because you leave it at the base of a climb.
Its okay, I would not climb with someone like yourself who thinks they can do what they want; would not trust you to stay on belay or tie and overhand never mind something to complex like a figure eight.
|
|
|
|
|
crankingclimber
Feb 5, 2007, 4:45 AM
Post #48 of 128
(3202 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Jul 27, 2002
Posts: 237
|
Taking that highline was stealing, as is taking draws. To all the poor helpless people who think this kind of action is justified because of the visual impact, get on your high horse and call the rangers, or the people who left the gear, and let everybody know your name - taking it anonymously is bullshit. That person is a thief. Better yet, quit crying about one highline and have some respect for your fellow climbers/liners - sure, your climbing area might not look quite as nice, and your day might be that much more ruined by it, but if you had any compassion or balls, you could just share. I'll gladly look at the odd highline so that my peers can have as much fun as I do - is it really hurting your eyes that bad? Are you really that selfish?
And as for the thief, instead of he/she having to look at one highline, it's OK to completely fuck up someone's day, cause them financial damage, and hurt them for days to come because of their missing gear/money??? Talk about selfish.
If it's really hurting access, or hurting the environment, then call the rangers, or take it down and leave it, or at least leave a note after taking it down. Link, the climbing ranger in the Valley, has been known to drop people's slacklines which were not set up with proper padding on trees etc. That's cool - he could've impounded it, and I'm sure does when warranted, but obviously it's not black and white cases of trash being left behind - even the rangers recognize that, surely fellow climbers can???
I don't know the specifics of the situation, and if it's really a cataclysmic mistake with dire consequences for land management and climbers reputation etc. then I retract the above. If not, then that person is a lowly thief.
Will |
|
|
|
|
areyoumydude
Feb 5, 2007, 5:04 AM
Post #50 of 128
(3186 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Dec 28, 2003
Posts: 1971
|
tyify wrote: Larry which line was it set up on? Birthday gap? Dog hole? I have personally slacked with Larry (areyoumydude) and I will say that he is a very enviromently and socially concious. I would ask if the park rangers had taken them down...
No, we put them up in a place that is not very popular, so that we could have a place to highline close to town but not be an eyesore to tourist. It was definitely sabotage. They left random pieces of gear all over the place threw some of it in the canyon and pulled most of the bolts leaving some behind half pulled out. It seems to me someone had a beef with us or the highlines and if that is the case they should have contacted us and we could of worked something out. Instead they vandalized and stole our gear. Total cowards if you ask me just like the anonymous posters talking shit.
I have talked to the rangers and they have no problem with our highlines.
I've posted pics of what some of the gear looks like on slackline.com in the highline forum.
|
|
|
|
|
styleboy
Feb 5, 2007, 9:24 AM
Post #51 of 128
(3210 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Nov 13, 2006
Posts: 107
|
When did I say I could do whatever I want? I simply stated that if someone else takes something that you leave out it is in fact stealing. Thanks for showing just how arrogant you really are..
I hope someone steals your belayer while you're mid-climb because he is a 'blight' on the landscape.
(you should look that word up before you use it.)
|
|
|
|
|
bbirtle
Feb 5, 2007, 12:13 PM
Post #52 of 128
(3195 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Jan 28, 2007
Posts: 102
|
alexmac wrote: bbirtle wrote: ...An odd piece of gear high on a route with no marks and no reasonable way to return it is the only case that strikes me as ethical to take something that isn't yours. All the rest is just plain theft. Not taking sides , but that sounds like logic of one murder is okay, 100 is not .
I've underlined above the key phrase.
alexmac wrote: If we extend the logic to anything , its wrong to have booty at all period
I would more or less agree!
alexmac wrote: ...if you leave something out, your to blame. If I leave 20 bucks on my desk at work and a cleaner takes it, its my fault...
No, the THIEF is the one to blame. I'm sometimes very absentminded and have lost a lot of gear just to leaving things behind. I accept blame for a ~mistake~ but often times I get the gear back due to the fact that most of the people in the world are honest.
Larry's case is far more clear-cut. If everybody was as unethical as some people on this thread, the world would indeed be an evil place!
(This post was edited by bbirtle on Feb 5, 2007, 12:15 PM)
|
|
|
|
|
c4c
Feb 5, 2007, 1:16 PM
Post #53 of 128
(3177 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Jun 18, 2006
Posts: 1279
|
In reply to: Larry's case is far more clear-cut. If everybody was as unethical as some people on this thread, the world would indeed be an evil place!
I don't know how you can read the news and still come to the conclusion that the world is NOT an evil place!? Man is basically evil which is why we have to lock things up and not leave them laying around. It is getting worse and not better.
|
|
|
|
|
alexmac
Feb 5, 2007, 1:53 PM
Post #54 of 128
(3164 views)
Shortcut
Registered: May 23, 2005
Posts: 550
|
styleboy wrote: When did I say I could do whatever I want? I simply stated that if someone else takes something that you leave out it is in fact stealing. Thanks for showing just how arrogant you really are.. I hope someone steals your belayer while you're mid-climb because he is a 'blight' on the landscape. (you should look that word up before you use it.)
And I am saying if your retarded enough to leave something out in plain view. Try leaving a wallet in the middle of central park and see if its there when you come back.
(This post was edited by alexmac on Feb 5, 2007, 1:53 PM)
|
|
|
|
|
kevinheiss
Feb 5, 2007, 2:22 PM
Post #55 of 128
(3148 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Apr 26, 2004
Posts: 272
|
Yes I did mean Should NOT leave your gear overnight
|
|
|
|
|
zeke_sf
Feb 5, 2007, 3:01 PM
Post #56 of 128
(3137 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Apr 28, 2006
Posts: 18730
|
areyoumydude wrote: They left random pieces of gear all over the place threw some of it in the canyon and pulled most of the bolts leaving some behind half pulled out.
Hmmm, vandalism, theft, and littering...sounds like a real service to the community. Dumbasses.
|
|
|
|
|
dynosore
Feb 5, 2007, 3:34 PM
Post #57 of 128
(3124 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Jul 29, 2004
Posts: 1768
|
1) It's not ok to steal, even if you're "tempted" geez people
2) take your slackline down when done, no one wants to look at your circus toy
|
|
|
|
|
AngusBeefheart
Feb 5, 2007, 4:17 PM
Post #58 of 128
(3098 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Nov 26, 2006
Posts: 68
|
I'ma gonna sit here with my rifle and take those damn climbers off of the cliff. They're a blight on the landscape and I'm just cleanin' up the trash.
|
|
|
|
|
ebonezercabbage
Feb 5, 2007, 4:19 PM
Post #59 of 128
(3093 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Apr 10, 2004
Posts: 151
|
I think that if it was a fixed line that is kept up by some sort of "service", then you can't take it. If you just see some jerk left his gear out for days at a time, its fair game to take.
Did u leave a note saying when ur coming back? Cause you may know that the gear has only been there for a day or two, the but ppl who took it could have thought it was there for much longer. Prime reason you do not leave your gear unattended.
You rolled the dice that no one would see it and take it. You lost your bet with yourself. Sorry, but u got what was coming to you.
Unless i'm missing something.....but even then, oh well.
|
|
|
|
|
joe
Feb 5, 2007, 4:51 PM
Post #60 of 128
(3063 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Jun 22, 2003
Posts: 897
|
roy_hinkley_jr wrote: Dean What-A-Dick-Potter
shut up you fucking crybaby
|
|
|
|
|
moose_droppings
Feb 5, 2007, 5:50 PM
Post #61 of 128
(3030 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Jun 7, 2005
Posts: 3371
|
Taking anything that is not yours and its theft, if it isn't yours, don't take it. Thats reality, and sadly its also a very rose colored outlook of the world we live in.
I personaly think thieves are lazy, and the easier you make it to steal, the higher percentage that it will be stolen.
Its not rocket science, its reality.
(This post was edited by moose_droppings on Feb 5, 2007, 5:53 PM)
|
|
|
|
|
dynosore
Feb 5, 2007, 6:01 PM
Post #62 of 128
(3017 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Jul 29, 2004
Posts: 1768
|
Brilliant comparison, really relevant. Shooting people vs. expecting people to pick up after themselves.
|
|
|
|
|
gandolf
Feb 5, 2007, 6:37 PM
Post #63 of 128
(2982 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Jun 4, 2005
Posts: 119
|
Dynoshore: In reply to: 1) It's not ok to steal, even if you're "tempted" geez people 2) take your slackline down when done, no one wants to look at your circus toy
My thoughts exactly.
If you take something without the intent to give it back to the original owner - it's stealing. (I can't beleive I had to spell that out for some people)
(This post was edited by gandolf on Feb 5, 2007, 6:38 PM)
|
|
|
|
|
roy_hinkley_jr
Feb 5, 2007, 6:41 PM
Post #64 of 128
(2976 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Sep 8, 2005
Posts: 652
|
Nah, it's only stealing if you keep or sell the gear. Toss it in the dumpster and it's a public service. Slacklining has nothing to do with climbing anyhow so all of this is irrelevant.
|
|
|
|
|
Davey
Feb 5, 2007, 6:44 PM
Post #65 of 128
(2973 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Feb 2, 2007
Posts: 294
|
I agree that it sounds pretty obvious that it wasn’t just abandoned and therefore it was not booty. But this is the world we live in you need to know the risk you are taking when you leave something some were. Yes it sucks. Cry about it rightfully so and then learn from it. It could have been a park ranger for all you know. Check with the park rangers if you want it back they might have it, just be ready to pay a fine. Plus check if you are allowed to leave something like this up. If not well then no wonder you got it jacked.
|
|
|
|
|
maldaly
Feb 5, 2007, 7:06 PM
Post #66 of 128
(2950 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Oct 31, 2002
Posts: 1208
|
So, all you advocates of slackline thievery, imagine that one day you're up on the Cap and a storm comes in. You rap off, leaving fixed lines so you can get back to your hight point when it clears up. When you go back, the lines and your haul bags are gone...
Is that thievery or public service?
While I'm no big advocate of leaving either highlines or fixed lines around, I don't see a whole lot of difference between the two.
Mal
|
|
|
|
|
areyoumydude
Feb 5, 2007, 7:37 PM
Post #68 of 128
(2929 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Dec 28, 2003
Posts: 1971
|
Davey wrote: I agree that it sounds pretty obvious that it wasn’t just abandoned and therefore it was not booty. But this is the world we live in you need to know the risk you are taking when you leave something some were. Yes it sucks. Cry about it rightfully so and then learn from it. It could have been a park ranger for all you know. Check with the park rangers if you want it back they might have it, just be ready to pay a fine. Plus check if you are allowed to leave something like this up. If not well then no wonder you got it jacked.
Like i said before it wasn't a ranger and it is totally legal to set up highlines and leave them up as long as we are using them daily which we were.
|
|
|
|
|
AngusBeefheart
Feb 5, 2007, 7:54 PM
Post #69 of 128
(2911 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Nov 26, 2006
Posts: 68
|
dynosore wrote: Brilliant comparison, really relevant. Shooting people vs. expecting people to pick up after themselves.
you're not familiar with the concept of parody I see...
|
|
|
|
|
Davey
Feb 5, 2007, 7:57 PM
Post #70 of 128
(2904 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Feb 2, 2007
Posts: 294
|
areyoumydude wrote: Davey wrote: I agree that it sounds pretty obvious that it wasn’t just abandoned and therefore it was not booty. But this is the world we live in you need to know the risk you are taking when you leave something some were. Yes it sucks. Cry about it rightfully so and then learn from it. It could have been a park ranger for all you know. Check with the park rangers if you want it back they might have it, just be ready to pay a fine. Plus check if you are allowed to leave something like this up. If not well then no wonder you got it jacked. Like i said before it wasn't a ranger and it is totally legal to set up highlines and leave them up as long as we are using them daily which we were.
Then in that case I hope the mo fo falls and dies. next time leave up some old trashed anchors so when he goes to use the stuff it breaks and he gets screwed.
|
|
|
|
|
roy_hinkley_jr
Feb 5, 2007, 9:15 PM
Post #71 of 128
(2872 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Sep 8, 2005
Posts: 652
|
maldaly wrote: So, all you advocates of slackline thievery, imagine that one day you're up on the Cap and a storm comes in. You rap off, leaving fixed lines so you can get back to your hight point when it clears up. When you go back, the lines and your haul bags are gone... Is that thievery or public service? While I'm no big advocate of leaving either highlines or fixed lines around, I don't see a whole lot of difference between the two.
Fixed lines on El Cap are hard to see from the Valley floor. A highline stands out against the sky from many view points and are as ugly as power lines in the wilderness. Sounds like this is just another egotistical Moab newbie who never heard of Monkey Wrenching...the spirit of Ed Abbey lives on.
|
|
|
|
|
lemon_boy
Feb 5, 2007, 9:44 PM
Post #72 of 128
(2853 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Mar 12, 2002
Posts: 287
|
malcom,
you also have to admit there is a difference between getting weathered off el cap, leaving a few fixed pitches, and getting back on it ASAP (next day) versus the bullshit 'permanently' fixed lines that stain the base of el cap. people think that they are doing a service of some sort by leaving these up. it is a total disservice and a slap in the face to people who are actually COMMITTED to doing the routes(s)
|
|
|
|
|
maldaly
Feb 5, 2007, 9:58 PM
Post #73 of 128
(2838 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Oct 31, 2002
Posts: 1208
|
I should have used a better example than being weathered off. There are lots of fixed ropes for "convenience" purposes. Hell, the standard way to do the Nose is to fix to Sickle, rap off to have dinner and drinks in C4 or Dornans, then really get on the route the next day. Roy, I object to the concept that it's okay to leave a fixed line on El Cap because the tourists probably won't see it but it's not okay to leave a fixed highline in an obscure canyon outside of Moab because a tourist might see it. I'm uncomfortable with either assumption.
Full disclosure here: When we did the Nose we fixed to Sickle, ate dinner at the Broiler Room then got back on the route then next day. Made me feel weird but I got to strut around saying things like "Yeah, I got a few fixed lines up on the Cap and I'm headed back up tomorrow to finish it off".
Mal
|
|
|
|
|
j_ung
Feb 5, 2007, 10:18 PM
Post #74 of 128
(2821 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Nov 21, 2003
Posts: 18690
|
I think I agree with the folks who call this a theft. If you're concerned that somebody else's gear is an eyesore, there are more mature ways to deal with the situation than taking it without leaving word. Same goes for project draws.
Please note that nowhere in this post did I cite my opinion on project draws and highlines being left behind. I only stated that there would be a better way to combat those if you thought they needed it.
|
|
|
|
|
devils_advocate
Feb 5, 2007, 10:26 PM
Post #75 of 128
(3068 views)
Shortcut
Registered: May 18, 2006
Posts: 1823
|
j_ung wrote: I think I agree with the folks who call this a theft. If you're concerned that somebody else's gear is an eyesore, there are more mature ways to deal with the situation than taking it without leaving word. Same goes for project draws. Please note that nowhere in this post did I cite my opinion on project draws and highlines being left behind. I only stated that there would be a better way to combat those if you thought they needed it.
Agreed, but I think it stands to state that several of us simply vocalized discontent at leaving a highline up. Nowhere did I, nor a couple others, state that we supported theft. I leave it to Roy to defend his fastidious stance.
|
|
|
|
|
lemon_boy
Feb 5, 2007, 10:28 PM
Post #76 of 128
(2580 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Mar 12, 2002
Posts: 287
|
i have left ropes up on routes overnight 2 or 3 times due to weather, getting a beatdown, or whatever. but each time i got my ass out of bed before light the next day and cleaned up my mess. each of these times i didn't sleep welll because i knew there was the possibility of my stuff being gone the next day. however, i knew it was my responsibility.
that is where i have the biggest problem, is people not owning up to their choices and decisions. this complet lack of responsibility is pathetic. growing up, if i would have left my father's or granfather's tools out in the yard overnight they would have busted their jim beam bottle over my ass. 'but grampa, i was planning on using the tools again sometime this week, maybe". i have no sympathy for these babies.
|
|
|
|
|
AngusBeefheart
Feb 5, 2007, 10:37 PM
Post #77 of 128
(2563 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Nov 26, 2006
Posts: 68
|
this whole retarded blame the victim mentality is one of the major flaws in our society. We shouldn't ever have any simpathy because people are asking for crimes to be committed against them.
theft is theft, I leave my $1500 kayak sitting out on the beach in coastal NC for 6 months (along with everyone else's boats) none of them are locked down and none of them are ever stolen. You know why? Because most people aren't tools.
It's not yours, you take it, YOU'RE the one responsible, not the person who's stuff you stole. I really hope none of you "if you leave it out you should expect to have it taken" people raise kids.
|
|
|
|
|
norm1057
Feb 5, 2007, 10:41 PM
Post #78 of 128
(2561 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Apr 21, 2006
Posts: 104
|
Good point Lemon and about what I've been thinking for the last 3 pages.
Anytime you leave stuff on public property, this is what may happen. Like it or not that is how it is. If you wanted your stuff so bad it should never have been left. People that climb on rocks aren't the only folks out in backwood areas. Also, this case sounds alot like some kids playing out of sight that found something cool to play with or tear up. When younger and much less knowing, I would probably have considered such a find quite the score. In that situation, an unknowing individual could care less about your undeserved rights on public property.
Pick up after yourself or buy some property and post it. Then you could do what you want. Whining can only make it worse for everyone else.
ps: Sorry about your stuff but I have also lost things under similar circumstances. Hard lesson to learn.
|
|
|
|
|
bler
Feb 5, 2007, 10:53 PM
Post #79 of 128
(2548 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Apr 22, 2004
Posts: 302
|
why did you leave your gear? you really thought it would not get taken? and then you say its 'stolen' ? i'd like to see that report to the police, you leave it out (espically intentionally) you run the risk of it getting stolen.
I go climbing, and my buddy sees one biner and goes out of his way to claim the goods.. you leave shit out, others take it.. thats the way it is.
if you want to keep your stuff, bring it with you. lastly, you trust gear that has been left out in the weather? you're lucky the gear didn't fail on you.
|
|
|
|
|
lemon_boy
Feb 5, 2007, 10:59 PM
Post #80 of 128
(2544 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Mar 12, 2002
Posts: 287
|
hey angus,
did mommy buy that kayak for you? i bet if you worked your ass off to buy it yourself you would think twice about leaving out in public for 6 months without locking it down.
using the whole 'blaming the victim' argument in this case is ridiculous. i'm not blaming a victim. i am chastising some ostrich who has their head in the sand saying "it won't happen to me".
i seriously hope that you don't have kids. they will be completely unprepared for the real world. you will probably be the type of parent who blames the school system, society, etc when your kid is 35 years old and living in your basement huffing paint every day.
|
|
|
|
|
Davey
Feb 5, 2007, 11:02 PM
Post #81 of 128
(2535 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Feb 2, 2007
Posts: 294
|
lemon_boy wrote: hey angus, did mommy buy that kayak for you? i bet if you worked your ass off to buy it yourself you would think twice about leaving out in public for 6 months without locking it down. using the whole 'blaming the victim' argument in this case is ridiculous. i'm not blaming a victim. i am chastising some ostrich who has their head in the sand saying "it won't happen to me". i seriously hope that you don't have kids. they will be completely unprepared for the real world. you will probably be the type of parent who blames the school system, society, etc when your kid is 35 years old and living in your basement huffing paint every day.
Hella funny. True dat.
|
|
|
|
|
AngusBeefheart
Feb 5, 2007, 11:08 PM
Post #82 of 128
(2531 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Nov 26, 2006
Posts: 68
|
Davey wrote: lemon_boy wrote: hey angus, did mommy buy that kayak for you? i bet if you worked your ass off to buy it yourself you would think twice about leaving out in public for 6 months without locking it down. using the whole 'blaming the victim' argument in this case is ridiculous. i'm not blaming a victim. i am chastising some ostrich who has their head in the sand saying "it won't happen to me". i seriously hope that you don't have kids. they will be completely unprepared for the real world. you will probably be the type of parent who blames the school system, society, etc when your kid is 35 years old and living in your basement huffing paint every day. Hella funny. True dat.
no, actually i worked my ass off for that boat. What mommy did do was raise me right.
You raising your kids to accept that taking things that are left out should be expected is a validation of that behavior. Of course, everyone trying to justify the highline being taken is really trying to validate their own immorality. I don't steal, but apparently you approve of stealing.
And then of course you're surprised that there are communities out there that actually watch out for each other.
(This post was edited by AngusBeefheart on Feb 5, 2007, 11:11 PM)
|
|
|
|
|
AngusBeefheart
Feb 5, 2007, 11:14 PM
Post #83 of 128
(2518 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Nov 26, 2006
Posts: 68
|
lemon_boy wrote: i'm not blaming a victim. i am chastising some ostrich who has their head in the sand saying "it won't happen to me".
actually, what the OP said was "hey, my shit got stolen, it sucks, if anyone sees being sold let me know" which is exactly what you or I or anyone would do if something valuable was stolen.
|
|
|
|
|
lemon_boy
Feb 5, 2007, 11:22 PM
Post #84 of 128
(2509 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Mar 12, 2002
Posts: 287
|
come on little beefheart, come clean! mommy and daddy are putting you through duke university. mommy and daddy bought you a car, pay your car insurance, and give you a little 'pampering cash' so you can party it up on the weekends. admit it. you know nothing about how the real world works.
to say that i justify stealing and that i am immoral is pretty absurd. anybody who knows me knows that if i catch somebody breaking into my car, i'm gonna break both of their arms. and then i am going to hurt them. but at the same time, if i weld a stopper into some crack and can't get it out (which, btw hasn't happened in more than 10 years because i pride myself on not losing shit left and right) i'm not going to tell the big bad pirate to give it back to me.
but i guess that mommy and daddy taught you that its not your fault when you don't keep your sh!t together. life sure is sweet when everything grows on trees, eh little buddy?
(This post was edited by lemon_boy on Feb 5, 2007, 11:24 PM)
|
|
|
|
|
AngusBeefheart
Feb 6, 2007, 3:30 AM
Post #85 of 128
(2470 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Nov 26, 2006
Posts: 68
|
aww that's cute, so to respond to theft you use felony assault, real moral champ, real moral. And we're not talking about booty gear, pay attention.
I'm sorry you're so hurt by the fact that i'm getting an education. I guess this 'real world' you speak of isn't the same as the one on MTV?
Because no one who goes to a good school is on financial aid, has thousands of dollars in loans, and works a job on top of 60 hours of 'not real' school work a week.
I guess when you rationalize the world with violence, you have no choice but to lash out against those who don't
(This post was edited by AngusBeefheart on Feb 6, 2007, 3:34 AM)
|
|
|
|
|
nedsurf
Feb 6, 2007, 4:00 AM
Post #86 of 128
(2449 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Nov 9, 2004
Posts: 387
|
gandolf wrote: Dynoshore: In reply to: 1) It's not ok to steal, even if you're "tempted" geez people 2) take your slackline down when done, no one wants to look at your circus toy My thoughts exactly. If you take something without the intent to give it back to the original owner - it's stealing. (I can't beleive I had to spell that out for some people)
I agree with this statement as well. Good ethics simply put.
|
|
|
|
|
jeremy11
Feb 6, 2007, 4:08 AM
Post #87 of 128
(2449 views)
Shortcut
Registered: May 28, 2004
Posts: 597
|
roy_hinkley_jr wrote: A highline stands out against the sky from many view points and are as ugly as power lines in the wilderness. Sounds like this is just another egotistical Moab newbie who never heard of Monkey Wrenching...the spirit of Ed Abbey lives on.
if highlines are so offendingly ugly, then go sabotage some powerlines, or maybe a road or some buildings in your pristine wilderness. sell your car so you don't pollute. chop every bolt you find.
BTW Larry is NOT a newbie. I do not know him personally, and have never rigged a highline, but I do know he is a very experienced climber and highliner, highlines take a long time to rig, and he was using it every day. it was not going to be left up for months or even days unused.
when gear is stuck or bailed off of and abandoned it is fair game. anything else that appears in any way that the owner might be returning is stealing.
|
|
|
|
|
lemon_boy
Feb 6, 2007, 6:28 AM
Post #88 of 128
(2410 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Mar 12, 2002
Posts: 287
|
oh little beefy weefy, aren't you the sweetest? why don't you write us all a little haiku on the dichotomies of man being bigger than god and the questions of flesh vs soul? cute little blog page by the way. only further proves my point that you haven't fallen out of the nest yet. pretty typical of the average 9 year old.
working 60 hours a week on top of a full course load? first of all, you haven't worked 60 hours in your entire lifetime (and don't try to count the 10 hours you spent failing to teach a bunch of kids about wilderness medicine, and getting the young chicklets drunk and failing to score). also, duke might might consider 6 credit hours full time, but no REAL university does. don't kid yourself. you're going to be living at your mama's house for quite a while kid. i bet you're the kind of belayer who drops a partner and says 'its not my fault, i didn't think you would fall."
|
|
|
|
|
AngusBeefheart
Feb 6, 2007, 6:31 AM
Post #89 of 128
(2407 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Nov 26, 2006
Posts: 68
|
my dearest lemon_boy, you seem to struggle with reading comprehension, as soon as i'm done with the chicklettes I'll give you a little peer tutoring (you teach me about this real world and I'll teach you how to read)
(This post was edited by AngusBeefheart on Feb 6, 2007, 6:49 AM)
|
|
|
|
|
superory
Feb 6, 2007, 9:31 AM
Post #90 of 128
(2370 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Jul 15, 2006
Posts: 55
|
this could really all be solved if we had all payed attention in kindergarten...
1. Clean up your toys when your done playing with them(Clean up you S#!t when your done with it)
2. keep your hands to yourself(don't take other peoples s#!t)
3. there is always time for milk and cookies(there is always time for milk and cookies)
|
|
|
|
|
dynosore
Feb 6, 2007, 1:50 PM
Post #91 of 128
(2356 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Jul 29, 2004
Posts: 1768
|
Face it beefy, lemon boy has you figured, and you're a spoiled little brat. From your blog
In reply to: Saturday began like any other. Me and Vik woke up late, consumed some sort of college type food, and drove over to pick up Ashley. From there we went to Petsmart and Vik bought an anole. Yes, another beast to add to our menagerie. The little green lizard complements the scorpion, fire-bellied toad and rat quite nicely. On the way back we stopped at Sam's to get some tobacco, but Vik had forgot his passport and the guy behind the counter decided to channel his rage at the failure that is the life of a late 20's burn out working full time at a gas station towards Viktor, who's only crime was to leave his ID at home (he is of course fully of age and has frequented Sam's for nearly a year). We had a little row and then left. For the next few hours I watch X-Men cartoons on youtube.
I'd rather hang around the gas station "loser" you delight in slamming than your know-nothing spoiled self important crowd. Works 60 hours and full time student BWAHAHAHA right.
|
|
|
|
|
AngusBeefheart
Feb 6, 2007, 1:57 PM
Post #92 of 128
(2348 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Nov 26, 2006
Posts: 68
|
so the guy saying you shouldn't steal people's shit is a spoiled brat while guy trying to defend theft by saying they had it coming is right?
this got off topic. And classy job pulling quotes from my blog, neither of you know me and we were having a perfectly fine little flame war.
But really, whatever you think of me (sheesh, that kayak bit opened up a can of worms, I was just trying to show that there are places where you would expect not to have things taken) the point remains: Don't take shit that isn't yours
(This post was edited by AngusBeefheart on Feb 6, 2007, 2:14 PM)
|
|
|
|
|
reg
Feb 6, 2007, 2:30 PM
Post #93 of 128
(2334 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Nov 10, 2004
Posts: 1560
|
bler wrote: lastly, you trust gear that has been left out in the weather? you're lucky the gear didn't fail on you.
this is my main thought on this - also i'd never take anybodys project or slack stuff but i do take "booty" ie: you can't clean it and leave it - its mine
|
|
|
|
|
aclove
Feb 6, 2007, 3:14 PM
Post #95 of 128
(2312 views)
Shortcut
Registered: May 28, 2004
Posts: 14
|
In the initial post Larry was not complaining, justing asking if anyone had any details. Roy then picked a fight... then went on to advocate monkey wrenching. He gives environmental conservation a bad wrap like Islamic terrorists give religion a bad wrap.
|
|
|
|
|
devils_advocate
Feb 6, 2007, 4:58 PM
Post #96 of 128
(2284 views)
Shortcut
Registered: May 18, 2006
Posts: 1823
|
mmmmmmm.... lemon-chicken beef wrap.
|
|
|
|
|
dharmatreez
Feb 6, 2007, 5:14 PM
Post #97 of 128
(2279 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Oct 25, 2005
Posts: 228
|
steal - NO
remove - YES
maybe it's just my trail mainantence and conservation background, but i would have carefully deconstructed the rig, no cutting, left a plastic LNT card with note, and handed in the slack rack to the nearest ranger or park office, letting them know about the note, and that someone might be coming to claim it
this would get rid of the "trash" left behind, while still allowing the owner to retrieve his gear (then it is between them and the park office, as it should be)
happy trails and safe climbing
jason
|
|
|
|
|
lemon_boy
Feb 6, 2007, 5:41 PM
Post #98 of 128
(2256 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Mar 12, 2002
Posts: 287
|
little andy beef fart, why don't you go ahead and give me that reading comprehension lesson? seems like a proud duke scholar, such as yourself, is the man, errrr boy, for the job.
but let's leave the reading for later and start with economics. so when your little $1500 kayak (what, is it some cheezy touring sea kayak? you obviously don't do any real kayaking) gets ripped, is mommy and daddy gonna buy you a new one? or are they just going to have the insurance man pay for it? here's a little lesson in economics for you (hey you're 9 years old, that's old enough isn't it?). the insurance man isn't paying for it. everybody else is. you're quite the little socialist aren't you? getting everybody else to pay for your laziness?
and jeremy11. you don't know anything about larry but you absolutely know he isn't a newbie. you been reading tarot cards again? and by the way, a blind man with one arm can set up a slackline in 15 minutes. if larry wanted to use it everyday, why not just do it at the park behind the maverick? save time, effort, hassle. probably because he wanted scenery and to 'be in touch with nature'. maybe the person who chopped it wanted scenery too?
(This post was edited by lemon_boy on Feb 6, 2007, 5:45 PM)
|
|
|
|
|
Davey
Feb 6, 2007, 6:00 PM
Post #99 of 128
(2243 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Feb 2, 2007
Posts: 294
|
I have seen more trolling on hear then an Alaskan fishing guide.
|
|
|
|
|
AngusBeefheart
Feb 6, 2007, 6:03 PM
Post #100 of 128
(2384 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Nov 26, 2006
Posts: 68
|
my good friend lemon_joy, we really seem to be bonding, I'd love to go climbing with you and learn more from your wisdom and vast experience. I promise not to drop you if you promise not to fall.
|
|
|
|
|
lemon_boy
Feb 6, 2007, 9:21 PM
Post #102 of 128
(2823 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Mar 12, 2002
Posts: 287
|
little angie beef hard,
i checked out your impressive tick list, and i just don't know if i can keep up. golly, top roping a couple 40 foot 5.6's sounds way out of my league. i bet you enjoy showing those pudgy little freshman babes just how a mountain man climbs those mighty rocks. bet you tell them epic tales of your boldness and take them out for a seductive dinner afterwards (on daddy's plastic, of course!). i almost broke my arm when i fell out of my chair laughing. maybe i should sue?
oh yeah, just what do you do for 60 hours a week at the aquarium? rub shamu's belly? teach dolphins sign language? write some of that pseudo-intellectual poetry that you post on your blog site? come on, out with it young lad, inquiring minds want to know!
|
|
|
|
|
112
Feb 6, 2007, 9:41 PM
Post #103 of 128
(2817 views)
Shortcut
Registered: May 15, 2004
Posts: 432
|
dharmatreez wrote: i would have left a plastic LNT card
Isn't that a contradiction?
|
|
|
|
|
billcoe_
Feb 6, 2007, 9:46 PM
Post #104 of 128
(2811 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Jun 30, 2002
Posts: 4694
|
112 wrote: dharmatreez wrote: i would have left a plastic LNT card Isn't that a contradiction?
That's funny. But why can't people just leave other people stuff alone.
Visual blight my ass.
The friggan house you live in is visual blight. How would you dudes claiming trash like your house torn down and your car made to disappear?
It's blight too.
|
|
|
|
|
dharmatreez
Feb 6, 2007, 9:50 PM
Post #105 of 128
(2806 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Oct 25, 2005
Posts: 228
|
ha!
i meant attached to the note for the slackliner and therefore taken with the note (and hopefully he would read it and attach it to his pack)
but knowing myself i probably would have went back in a few days to see if the note (and card were taken) just out of curiousity
but trading a whole slackline setup for a small, tan, plastic LNT card seems like a step in the right direction, but i am sure that would offend some climbers, as it is seen as a right to leave climbing "gear" on their entitled piece of rock on public land
wow, never thought i would get beef for not stealing but handing in the slackline and leaving a note and card for the original owner
happy trails and safe climbing you fuckers
jason
(This post was edited by dharmatreez on Feb 6, 2007, 9:58 PM)
|
|
|
|
|
roy_hinkley_jr
Feb 6, 2007, 10:05 PM
Post #106 of 128
(2791 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Sep 8, 2005
Posts: 652
|
billcoe_ wrote: Visual blight my ass. The friggan house you live in is visual blight.
Damn you're dumber than a brick. What part of "public land" don't you understand? Build a structure on public land and it gets torn down. Abandon a car on public land and it gets towed away. In both cases you get fined and stuck with the bill. Somebody did Larry a favor by cleaning up his shit.
|
|
|
|
|
dharmatreez
Feb 6, 2007, 10:15 PM
Post #107 of 128
(2786 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Oct 25, 2005
Posts: 228
|
roy_hinkley_jr wrote: Build a structure on public land and it gets torn down. Abandon a car on public land and it gets towed away. In both cases you get fined and stuck with the bill. Somebody did Larry a favor by cleaning up his shit.
out of curiousity...
if i would have cleaned the rig, and taken it to the park office, would the owner trying to retrieve it from them get fined?
what is the policy on federal/state land for leaving up gear like this? (not sure what land designation the OP was rigged on)
if a ranger or officer had seen it, would they have removed it?
anyone know the specifics on this
instead of all of these opinions on how different people "feel" whether it is right or wrong, what does the actual laws say
(This post was edited by dharmatreez on Feb 6, 2007, 10:24 PM)
|
|
|
|
|
d1ll1gaf
Feb 6, 2007, 10:40 PM
Post #108 of 128
(2763 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Mar 25, 2004
Posts: 119
|
roy_hinkley_jr wrote: billcoe_ wrote: Visual blight my ass. The friggan house you live in is visual blight. Damn you're dumber than a brick. What part of "public land" don't you understand? Build a structure on public land and it gets torn down. Abandon a car on public land and it gets towed away. In both cases you get fined and stuck with the bill. Somebody did Larry a favor by cleaning up his shit.
You should look in the mirror before calling other people names (didn't your mother teach you any manners?).
In order to abandon something, the owner needs to have made a decision not to attempt to retrieve the item. Leaving something behind on public land is not abandoning it (although given that the world is unfortunately not an honest place it may be ill advised). If the item has been left illegally, then only the proper legal authorities have the right to remove and/or seize it (and fine the person who left it). Using your own example of a car, if you where to come across a car that had been left in the ditch by its owner for a month and decided it was 'abandoned' and towed it off for yourself, you would be arrested and convicted of grand theft auto.
In this specific case, Larry was using the public land in line with the regulations provided by the rangers. That means his gear was not abandoned and this is a clear case of theft (based upon the information provided). What Larry should be doing is filing a police report so that if the person who took the gear is every identified they can be punished by the proper authorities.
|
|
|
|
|
lemon_boy
Feb 6, 2007, 11:09 PM
Post #109 of 128
(2749 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Mar 12, 2002
Posts: 287
|
from the idiocy of your post, i think roy_hinkley_jr isn't far off the mark. grand theft auto after a month long abandonment. damn that's funny.
|
|
|
|
|
112
Feb 6, 2007, 11:10 PM
Post #110 of 128
(2749 views)
Shortcut
Registered: May 15, 2004
Posts: 432
|
dharmatreez wrote: wow, never thought i would get beef for not stealing but handing in the slackline and leaving a note and card for the original owner
I just thought it was real funny to be leaving a note (a trace) reminding people to not leave a trace. Even if you went back to see if it was still there or not, its still a contradiction and therefore funny to me! :)
Its like the people in class who tell everyone to "be quite".
I seriously doubt anybody posting on this subject would bother to take down, not 1 but 2, highlines, if it didn't somehow benefit them finacially. IMHO
|
|
|
|
|
dharmatreez
Feb 6, 2007, 11:28 PM
Post #111 of 128
(2733 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Oct 25, 2005
Posts: 228
|
112 wrote: dharmatreez wrote: wow, never thought i would get beef for not stealing but handing in the slackline and leaving a note and card for the original owner I just thought it was real funny to be leaving a note (a trace) reminding people to not leave a trace. Even if you went back to see if it was still there or not, its still a contradiction and therefore funny to me! :) I seriously doubt anybody posting on this subject would bother to take down, not 1 but 2, highlines, if it didn't somehow benefit them finacially. IMHO
i find it funny myself, never realized the contradiction. i'm so use to replacing them at campsites and shelters during maintenance, i never thought twice about it in this situation
as to taking them down without financial reward, i would definitely do it. would be alot easier than most of the trail maintenance and campsite cleanup i do, also without any financial payback... i'm a different kinda cat i guess, but i do see what you mean that some would only see financial benefit in the work involved, and that is why it was stolen, i'm sure
happy trails and safe climbing
|
|
|
|
|
zeke_sf
Feb 6, 2007, 11:41 PM
Post #112 of 128
(2723 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Apr 28, 2006
Posts: 18730
|
AngusBeefheart wrote: my good friend lemon_joy, we really seem to be boning...
Get a room you two!
|
|
|
|
|
112
Feb 7, 2007, 12:19 AM
Post #113 of 128
(2684 views)
Shortcut
Registered: May 15, 2004
Posts: 432
|
roy_hinkley_jr wrote: Abandon a car on public land and it gets towed away.
You haven't proved the gear was abandoned. However, I do concede the gear in question was left unattended.
I hope you don't beleive your argument applies equally to items that are, at times, left unattended. Do you?
|
|
|
|
|
bler
Feb 7, 2007, 12:50 AM
Post #114 of 128
(2660 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Apr 22, 2004
Posts: 302
|
this all comes down to ethics, you are all stupid for arguing this, grow up and don't leave your shit out.. or your stuff will get taken too!
yes in some areas, leaving a biner is illegal and you will be fined, leave webbing and you get fined too.
besides who trusts gear that is left out anyways?
it's not a car, or a house.. its like leaving money out, you leave it, you loose it. its not like the people took it out from someone's bag !
|
|
|
|
|
lemon_boy
Feb 7, 2007, 12:51 AM
Post #115 of 128
(2660 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Mar 12, 2002
Posts: 287
|
damn, fell out of my chair laughing and bout broke my other arm. i think angie meant to say, 'you really seem to be boning me(ie reaming my ass)'. the 'we boning' is definitely a misnomer as i seem to be doing all of the pitching, and (s)he seems to be doing all the catching.
this thread has entertained the hell out of me, but i'm thinking about calling angie's parents and telling them to buy me a TV and cable instead.
|
|
|
|
|
AngusBeefheart
Feb 7, 2007, 1:03 AM
Post #116 of 128
(2657 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Nov 26, 2006
Posts: 68
|
oh lemon_cakes, you were always such the charmer...
|
|
|
|
|
112
Feb 7, 2007, 2:04 AM
Post #117 of 128
(2629 views)
Shortcut
Registered: May 15, 2004
Posts: 432
|
|
|
|
|
|
billcoe_
Sep 25, 2007, 4:40 PM
Post #118 of 128
(2533 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Jun 30, 2002
Posts: 4694
|
roy_hinkley_jr wrote: billcoe_ wrote: Visual blight my ass. The friggan house you live in is visual blight. Damn you're dumber than a brick. What part of "public land" don't you understand? Build a structure on public land and it gets torn down. Abandon a car on public land and it gets towed away. In both cases you get fined and stuck with the bill. Somebody did Larry a favor by cleaning up his shit.
You seem so screwed up that it's hardly not even worth talking to you.
The next time you have a tent pitched on public land and go for a day hike: I hope and wish that the lowlife MF's who you seem to love and support, show up and STEAL every damn thing you own. Thats right, it's called STEALING which is taking other peoples hard earned goods without permission.
Then you will STFU: realize that you have no morals, are totally F*ed up ethically, and come to my side of the fence and agree with me that everything you have said so far on this thread only indicates that you have NO ethics, and NO morals.
|
|
|
|
|
billcoe_
Sep 25, 2007, 4:41 PM
Post #119 of 128
(2532 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Jun 30, 2002
Posts: 4694
|
Don't take other people stuff Roy.
DON'T DO IT, IT'S CALLED STEALING AND IS AGAINST THE LAW
|
|
|
|
|
moose_droppings
Sep 25, 2007, 6:24 PM
Post #121 of 128
(2463 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Jun 7, 2005
Posts: 3371
|
Adk wrote: Good luck catching these thieves. Grand Larceny is a great reason to buy a trail cam to take pics of your gear should anyone come near it. I hunt and I know many guys who place these out to catch treestand thieves in areas that have a history of getting hit. The photos that I have heard of always stick. Good luck. I often wonder about ebay stuff.....was it stolen stuff ???
Just this week we were hiking and came across one of these motion sensored cameras in a remote area hanging off a tree. It was monitoring a very secluded spring that made a bit of a watering hole.
My wife said "They'll know we were here now." after it took a picture.
I said "Not if we take it." and laughed.
Of course we didn't take it, but I took a picture of it while it was taking a picture of me. Should give the dude a good laugh. More wildlife than he bargained for.
Now back to the regularly scheduled argument...er...thread.
|
|
|
|
|
NSFW
Sep 25, 2007, 6:30 PM
Post #122 of 128
(2453 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Jul 25, 2007
Posts: 2005
|
moose_droppings wrote: Adk wrote: Good luck catching these thieves. Grand Larceny is a great reason to buy a trail cam to take pics of your gear should anyone come near it. I hunt and I know many guys who place these out to catch treestand thieves in areas that have a history of getting hit. The photos that I have heard of always stick. Good luck. I often wonder about ebay stuff.....was it stolen stuff ??? Just this week we were hiking and came across one of these motion sensored cameras in a remote area hanging off a tree. It was monitoring a very secluded spring that made a bit of a watering hole. My wife said "They'll know we were here now." after it took a picture. I said "Not if we take it." and laughed. Of course we didn't take it, but I took a picture of it while it was taking a picture of me. Should give the dude a good laugh. More wildlife than he bargained for. [IMG]http://i149.photobucket.com/albums/s46/jct54/camera.jpg[/IMG] Now back to the regularly scheduled argument...er...thread.
I can't believe you passed up an opportunity to moon it.
|
|
|
|
|
knieveltech
Sep 25, 2007, 6:34 PM
Post #123 of 128
(2447 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Dec 2, 2006
Posts: 1431
|
NSFW wrote: moose_droppings wrote: Adk wrote: Good luck catching these thieves. Grand Larceny is a great reason to buy a trail cam to take pics of your gear should anyone come near it. I hunt and I know many guys who place these out to catch treestand thieves in areas that have a history of getting hit. The photos that I have heard of always stick. Good luck. I often wonder about ebay stuff.....was it stolen stuff ??? Just this week we were hiking and came across one of these motion sensored cameras in a remote area hanging off a tree. It was monitoring a very secluded spring that made a bit of a watering hole. My wife said "They'll know we were here now." after it took a picture. I said "Not if we take it." and laughed. Of course we didn't take it, but I took a picture of it while it was taking a picture of me. Should give the dude a good laugh. More wildlife than he bargained for. [IMG]http://i149.photobucket.com/albums/s46/jct54/camera.jpg[/IMG] Now back to the regularly scheduled argument...er...thread. I can't believe you passed up an opportunity to moon it.
or set it on fire.
|
|
|
|
|
climbingaggie03
Sep 25, 2007, 6:46 PM
Post #124 of 128
(2435 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Mar 18, 2004
Posts: 1173
|
wzrdgandalf wrote :In reply to: roy_hinkley_jr wrote:Kudos to whoever it was that cleaned up the abandoned trash! Hopefully it was disposed of properly. Larry, unless that was private land (doubtful), you got what you deserved...don't litter! It would be trash pick up if the person who cleaned it up made an effort to get it back to the people who owned it and then made them know that it was taken down for this reason. Putting it under your ownership after you "clean it up" is stealing plain and simple. If it were an eye sore then they could have taken it down and cached it near where they took it down so that the owners could find it (and a letter explaining that they are stupid for leaving it up). Of course i think i would take a biner for my services in cleaning up
So, I don't think that they should take people's highline set ups, but your definition of trash is crap. Would you pick up a cigarette butt and try and figure out whose butt it is and give it back to them? Would you say you were stealing if you kept the cigarette butt and threw it away?
I think that he should have taken his highline down if he was going to leave it for long enough for people to take it. I think the people that took it down should have atleast left it for him instead of taking it. Do people always do what I think they should do? nope.
|
|
|
|
|
rocdaug
Sep 25, 2007, 8:20 PM
Post #125 of 128
(2378 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Sep 18, 2003
Posts: 220
|
Sorry you had your circus toys ripped off.
Yes it's stealing, and vandalism by the sounds of it.
Now you know what it feels like to have someone do you wrong.
Just for the sake of argument lets pretend that whom ever did this thinks that you have no right leaving your rig up. From their point of view you are the one in the wrong and loosing your gear is the price you pay.
The thing that many people who leave their gear up do not seem to understand is this: You are not the only people on the planet and this world was not created for your sole use. Personally, I hate seeing climbing crap littering my favorite places. It's an eyesore and the only people who don't think so are the people who leave their gear up.
...and I don't buy the "you don't climb hard enough to understand bullshit" or "it takes a long time to rig this so we have to leave it up" arguments. I don't give one floppy stacker if you think you are entitled to leave your crap laying around. If you leave it out and it gets stolen you are just stupid.
oh, and before some jackass (you know who you are) accuses me of stealing. ...sorry not my thing. Even though I think it's eyesore I, unlike those who leave their crap up, respect their right to litter my special places with their crap.
Yes, it's stealing
Yes, it's vandalism
Yes, it's wrong that others steal from you
and Yes, it's your fault.
rd
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
areyoumydude
Sep 28, 2007, 5:46 PM
Post #127 of 128
(754 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Dec 28, 2003
Posts: 1971
|
rocdaug wrote: Yes, it's stealing Yes, it's vandalism Yes, it's wrong that others steal from you Yes, it's your fault. rd
and yes, you are a dork.
|
|
|
|
|
rocdaug
Sep 28, 2007, 9:04 PM
Post #128 of 128
(708 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Sep 18, 2003
Posts: 220
|
areyoumydude wrote: rocdaug wrote: Yes, it's stealing Yes, it's vandalism Yes, it's wrong that others steal from you Yes, it's your fault. rd and yes, you are a dork.
masterful come back. breath taking... really put me in my place.
try no to hurt anything coming up with this stuff.
i would not want you to deprive the world of your wordcraft skill.
rd
(This post was edited by rocdaug on Sep 28, 2007, 9:05 PM)
|
|
|
|
|
|
