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graniteboy
Jan 30, 2003, 4:59 AM
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Welllll; after 3 decades of "one dimensional" trad climbing, I've come to discover this pearl-o-wisdom; Trad climbing is in FACT evry itty-bit as one dimensional as alpinism (at least tha's what I tell sprot climburz).
By using this method of negative campaigning, I can assure that there will be fewer sprot climburz clogging up the backcountry and or requiring rescue. Happy "front country" climbin to ya, Mr whateveryer-name izzzz.
[ This Message was edited by: graniteboy on 2003-01-29 21:01 ]
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mr_phelps
Jan 30, 2003, 5:55 AM
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I am not quite the trad climbing fan either. This is complicated by the fact that I find crack climbing to be completely terrifying. I constantly imagine myself slamming into a jagged crack wall, and spilling blood all over the belayer causing that person to drop me.
Ok, so that's probably worst case, but I don't really think crack climbing is quite as entertaining as face climbing. How could it be?
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onelung
Jan 30, 2003, 5:59 AM
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Stop It ...Stop It all of You!....Why is it that you cannot see that You love each other?
Jeeesh,
Oh to be on the Stone,
Bill
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flying_dutchman
Jan 30, 2003, 6:15 AM
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on the Stone or stoned?
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venezuela
Jan 30, 2003, 6:33 PM
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think about it??
sport routes are supposed to be "safer"...BUT where you there when the FA dude placed the bolts? or do you know if the rock is chipped or rotten on the inside? do you know if the bolts were placed correctly, using the right tools, and the right equipment? were the bolts used "good", CE certified? has corrosion eaten the bolts??
at the end, you trust someone else's bolt, maybe placed 10 years ago, in a blink .....but you get scared at your own placement.....
when climbing trad you thrive to know, what to expect of a certain piece of pro: anti-bomber, bomber, body-weight, psychological pro (that's when the pro is placed only for peace of mind, but it's actually NO GOOD)...I have found myself downclimbing a route because I couldn't find a bomber placement.....I knew what to expect from the nut/cam/bigbro/hexentric/etc..
that's one of the reasons why I prefer trad.....BECAUSE IT'S SAFER
Diego
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traddaddy
Jan 30, 2003, 6:52 PM
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As it says for one route in the Red River Gorge guide book:
"Sport climbers lower off here, traditional men continue to the top"
nuff said.
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rollingstone
Jan 30, 2003, 7:06 PM
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Some of the sweetest pitches in the world are, or course, in Yosemite, on the Big Stone! Jamming the entire Stovelegs with no hangs, or liebacking the Pancake Flake on the Nose, or jamming the Hollow Flake pitch on the Salathe, let alone the 1st pitch of the Salathe. If one has commensurate skills (I did not, but it was 1984 then), one can jam the headwall pitches of the Salathel. Try imagining hanging off of funky finger locks in an overhanging (95 degrees)crack about 2500 feet off the deck, nothing but air below you, fumbling for a cam or stopper to get in and then clip it and move on. I was nearly pissing myself from the exposre when I led the pitch in aiders!!
A sport climber will not do this comfortably.
(IMHO)
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bustinmins
Aug 16, 2003, 9:47 AM
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I've enjoyed Bastille's Crack and the pyramid. I'm looking to do my first trad lead in Eldo soon. I'm thinking that very easy 5.2 on the whale's tail as my first. I haven't looked at the route up close and personal - but the Eldo book's author recommends it as a newbie lead route.
Eldo is such a spiritual place - you can just feel the presence of those that have been there before you. I will be honored when I finally lead a route there.
Peace
JD
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dirtineye
Aug 16, 2003, 12:45 PM
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Gee this thread is pretty interesting except for the illogic of kalcario, that part at least had entertainment value though.
Stewart, did you actually lead gravy train when you decided it was 5.9. or did you second or top rope it? Just wondering...
About sport climbing not being limited to a specific line, well, why is it that almsot every sport climber wil tell you that getting any more than an arms reach from the bolt is off route?
About cracks, hmmm, if you don't like em that's that, but to say they are all the same is like saying all women are the same.
I was sad to learn that trad climbing is only cracks, since I have put up several routes that were faces led on gear, and now I find out that they are not trad climbs. will someone please tell me what I have been climbing then?
My favorite jab at sport climbing is that sport climbers seem to think they climb harder than trad climbers, but then, sporties get hurt falling off of trad routes... now why is that?
Wait a minute, disregard anythign positive about trad climbing in this thread, we are all lying, the sporties are right, trad is one dimensional, limited, too dangerous and downright boring, so STAY OFF THE TRAD!
Leave the trad areas to the old dinos and the few who are dumb enough to follow them. All the hot babes are at the sport crags anyway, so go there. Trad is for losers. Trad is uncool. Don't do it. Just say NO to trad. Better yet, stay in your gyms, with air conditionong. Yeah, that's it.
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rrrADAM
Aug 16, 2003, 1:47 PM
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A different angle on my first reply...
Just as it takes a keen eye to read the rock for placements on a PG or R rated climb, sometimes it takes a keen eye to spot a TROLL. :wink:
:troll:
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petsfed
Aug 16, 2003, 5:17 PM
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I've actually heard the "bland" comment before about crack climbing. My buddy from Rifle picked up Masters of Stone V and while watching commented to me, "I don't know how you can enjoy this stuff, she just does the same move over and over." I guess that is the draw for some. I love crack climbing. The better I get at it, the more I enjoy it. I love camming my toes into the crack eight inches below my hand jams and standing up. That's fun to me. An entire pitch of that would be perfect. I am terrible at face climbing. The entire premise behind its necessary skills eludes me still. I'm even worse at clipping bolts. But that's just me. I slag on his sport climbing, he slags on my trad climbing and when we cross over (so only one of us is in his comfortable domain) we both have a great time.
The other thing I learned: 1 rope's length of the same move sport climbing is boring. 1 rope's length of the same move trad climbing is at worst interesting and at best terrifying. There's a climb at Prophecy wall near St. George, Utah, who's first pitch is 140 feet in length. Initially I was going to lead it, but after the third bolt (and about 15 iterations of crimp, stem, pull) I looked down at my partner and said "This is gonna suck. If you want it, you can have it, but I'll downclimb and clean the draws." He went up. At the first set of anchors he was bored out of his mind but decided to go all the way to the top. When he finally got down, he stated, quite simply "Yeah, it did suck, lets find something interesting." So there you go.
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dingus
Aug 16, 2003, 6:08 PM
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It is one dimensional... from the ground up.
Think about it...
DMT
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stewbabby
Aug 16, 2003, 6:40 PM
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In reply to: Stewart, did you actually lead gravy train when you decided it was 5.9. or did you second or top rope it? Just wondering...
Curt,
The first time i did the route was following gus on it some time last october. Since then I have dont it on lead 2 or 3 times. It is one of my favorite routes at SR. Other than pulling through the little slot at the top with gear at your feet it is very straight forward. The gear is all there and the holds are great. There is one crux about 15 feet below the top. Great route..... have you done it yet.
stewart
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alpinerockfiend
Aug 16, 2003, 6:55 PM
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In reply to: It is one dimensional... from the ground up.
Do or don't. Can or can't. Will or won't.
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dirtineye
Aug 17, 2003, 1:17 AM
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Stewart, I doubt I'll climb at Sand Rock again. It's too far compared to Palisades, and too close to Chattanooga or Lost wall, and TOO NOISY AT NIGHT LOL.
If I do go there again, I'll be after They call me crusier, path of a patriot and a few other meanies.
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rrrADAM
Aug 17, 2003, 1:21 AM
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In reply to: It is one dimensional... from the ground up. Think about it... DMT
Good point. :wink:
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old_school
Aug 17, 2003, 2:15 AM
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its only repetitve if you climb the same route one hundred times
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crackaddict
Aug 17, 2003, 2:35 AM
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Types of climbing are'nt one dimensional.
Just some climbers are!
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traddad
Aug 17, 2003, 5:03 AM
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Oops. Did your troll button get stuck? Trad, BLAND?????? Let's go climbing sometime. I'll show you bland.
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ajkclay
Aug 17, 2003, 11:13 AM
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In reply to: It is one dimensional... from the ground up. Think about it...
Okay, I thought about it, and it aint one dimensional.
I've never seen a crack or any other route that was dead straight, with no moving left or right at all.
One dimensional means dead straight, as soon as you move either way to the side its two dimensional. As soon as the rock is concave or convex, it's three dimensional.
Think about it.
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hellclimber
Aug 17, 2003, 11:25 AM
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In reply to: In reply to: It is one dimensional... from the ground up. Think about it... Okay, I thought about it, and it aint one dimensional. ... ...it's three dimensional. Think about it.
Okay, I thought about it, and it isn't three dimensional. We agree on the movement being done in three dimensions but there is also time which makes it four dimensional.
Consider adding a fifth dimension. In lack of a better word lets call it the "troll" dimension. Given these facts and a little fiction, I think the answer should be that trad climbing is five dimensional.
Think about it...
hellclimber
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dingus
Aug 17, 2003, 2:05 PM
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In reply to: that trad climbing is five dimensional.
This is the dawning of the age of aquarius, the age of aquarius!
DMT
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dingus
Aug 17, 2003, 2:09 PM
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In reply to: As soon as the rock is concave or convex, it's three dimensional. Think about it.
*Yawn.* OK, I thought about it.
Trad climbing is still ground up. concave, convex, conwhatever. You must be one of those literal types. You're in for hard time in this world son.
DMT
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jt512
Aug 18, 2003, 6:50 PM
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My vote is four dimensional.
-Jay
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tradmanclimbs
Aug 19, 2003, 3:02 AM
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I can't belive all you guys took this tool seriously enough to even answer his stupid question :roll: What a loser.
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